California
Just testing to see if there is some kind of robot that automatically locks any thread that includes that horrible word that is the subject of this thread.
It seems any attempt to engage in a meaningful debate on this forum is shut down without notice if it includes the dreaded "C" word. There has to be at least a few adults on here that can keep a meaningful debate going without the name calling, right? I just read the posting guidelines and I don't see anything about all discussions about California are off-limits. Instead I would expect the moderators to actually do some moderating and keep the bomb throwers in check. Is this too much to ask?
It seems any attempt to engage in a meaningful debate on this forum is shut down without notice if it includes the dreaded "C" word. There has to be at least a few adults on here that can keep a meaningful debate going without the name calling, right? I just read the posting guidelines and I don't see anything about all discussions about California are off-limits. Instead I would expect the moderators to actually do some moderating and keep the bomb throwers in check. Is this too much to ask?
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quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
quote:Originally posted by kayzap
Stunning victory? No, a surprising victory in a battle.
How is it a victory:
It's a victory because people who were denied guns may now own and posses guns. Should their guns have ever been taken away? Absolutely not but the fact remains SCOTUS ruled that denial was wrong.
Our rights were taken away by many small cuts and a few slashes. The Gun Control Act and the Assault Weapons Ban.
Here in Ca. They are trying to limit the access we have to guns and they have tried and failed more than once to limit or restrict ammo. They failed because Citizens wrote, called and emailed our elected officials. When they limit our access it's only a first step. Next they'll limit even more and add other hoops. All in an effort to rid our State of firearms. We need those firearms and ammo so we can win those hearts and minds.
I've taken gun disliking prosecutors and Judges shooting. taught them how and showed them the fun and how safe plinking is if done correctly. These people go back to work with a changed attitude towards firearms. A positive one. Thats where the battle is won bringing neutral or anti gunners into the pro gun fold.
Many of the Anti's are anti because they don't know anything about how guns work and they are scared of guns. Once you show them how safe and fun they are. They turn pro gun to some extent. Once they are pro gun they start caring what gets banned, restricted or outlawed. They now have a horse in the race. They call, mail and email politicians about gun control laws and when a politician gets a large number of contacts about something they listen.0 -
quote:
I don't think the case is that they don't believe it's an individual right. They simply have their own agenda.
And there lies the problem! As a SCJ they are to READ the constitution and not interpret it. (it says what it says)0 -
kayzap: you're missing the point, it's explain a number of times on this forum, just read.
pdq_wizzard: and this is why there's only one solution in sight.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
kayzap: you're missing the point, it's explain a number of times on this forum, just read.
pdq_wizzard: and this is why there's only one solution in sight.
Rockatansky,
I understand your point. My difference is only with your approach in that there are many other steps to be taken first so as to grow your own strength and weaken the opposition.
Thats why we will continue to try and get dealers to ship to us so we can grow our numbers and weaken our enemies.0 -
quote:Originally posted by kayzap
Rockatansky,
I understand your point. My difference is only with your approach in that there are many other steps to be taken first so as to grow your own strength and weaken the opposition.
Thats why we will continue to try and get dealers to ship to us so we can grow our numbers and weaken our enemies.
Pointless0 -
quote:pdq_wizzard
Starting Member
4 Posts
Posted - 01/09/2009 : 10:58:17 PM
By the way I don't have a problem with crazy people not having guns so in that it is not unlimited, (the crazy people would not be out and about in the days of our founding fathers) but that is a moot point today so I don't want them to get there hands on guns.
But then again you can't stop bad people from doing bad things.
You cannot control a few crazy people by infringing the Rights of hundreds of millions of decent Citizens.
Not and call your country a `free Republic'.
Either call it was it is.. FASCISM ... or control the crazies by Constitutional means.
Given a REAL Justice system, and a public with the stones to do what is ABSOLUTELY necessary .. execute the vicious animals that roam at will among decent Citizens .. there would be a vastly lessened problem with crazies.
The FRIGHTENING thing about the Supreme Court decision was NOT the four that directly snat upon the Constitution. Those men could be dealt with by removal from office.
No...it is the FIVE that disturb me the most. They took and analyzed the Second, word by word...EXCEPT for those four magic words.
"SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED" !!!!
THOSE five are the real traitors...for they took the clear-cut dividing line between action and further erosion of liberties squarely away from us.
Had just ONE more `justice' sided with the Communists on the Court, we out here would have had a decision to make.
RESIST...... or submit as subjects.
We got the very worst decision from the Court...and never believe for a second that these people are not brilliant. They are not quite ready to take us on head to head...so they just cut the ground out from under our feet, with their decision.
Many, many people that WOULD have been on `our' side...the side of the Constitution..are now smiling smugly over their `victory'. Gag a maggot.....0 -
quote:So then....
You are saying 4473's NIC checks are unlawful?... The carrying of arms concealed without a permit is perfactly fine?
ANY freeperson, NOT imprisoned is allowed to be armed?
I understand you correctly then?
I guess our new California members would rather avoid answering questions......0 -
quote:Originally posted by freemind
quote:So then....
You are saying 4473's NIC checks are unlawful?... The carrying of arms concealed without a permit is perfactly fine?
ANY freeperson, NOT imprisoned is allowed to be armed?
I understand you correctly then?
I guess our new California members would rather avoid answering questions......
OK I will see if I can answer this.
4473's now this is a hard one as there are mentally ill people that should not have access to buy a gun. (Like I said before mentally ill people were not allowed to live among us in times past).
The thing that pisses me off is that I have to fill one out every time I buy a gun and that is not right, if I already own a firearm why should I have to continue to fill them out? (I know the answer to this) because it is a form of gun registration and not right!
On CC I think anyone that can lawfully own a gun should be able to CC if they so chose.
"ANY freeperson, NOT imprisoned is allowed to be armed?" now this is another hard one because again we let too many people that are murders walk on the same streets as you and me. I don't think all felonies should be treated the same. And there are many felons that have paid there due to society and as such should have all of there rights restored. But murders should be executed then we would not have to worry about them getting guns and doing harm.
These are just my thoughts.0 -
The SIMPLE solution to your concerns is:
Bad people should NOT be free to roam society. Ever heard "Those that are willing to trade freedom for security, deserve neither."?
Those words are just as true today, as they were over 200 years ago.
Where does restricting a citizens rights, give ANY saftey to society? There is NO answer to that.
For us, that belive in the people's contract, known as the constitution, we KNOW there is absolutely NO room, for government making ANY laws reguarding arms and ammo. It is for people able to THINK, what the difference IS between a RIGHT and a PRIVILAGE. Government can and DOES regulate privilages. Right or wrong, they do.
If government is allowed to make one, teeny tiny law, on arms or ammo, it has become a privilage, NOT a right.
quote:Originally posted by pdq_wizzard
quote:Originally posted by freemind
quote:So then....
You are saying 4473's NIC checks are unlawful?... The carrying of arms concealed without a permit is perfactly fine?
ANY freeperson, NOT imprisoned is allowed to be armed?
I understand you correctly then?
I guess our new California members would rather avoid answering questions......
OK I will see if I can answer this.
4473's now this is a hard one as there are mentally ill people that should not have access to buy a gun. (Like I said before mentally ill people were not allowed to live among us in times past).
The thing that pisses me off is that I have to fill one out every time I buy a gun and that is not right, if I already own a firearm why should I have to continue to fill them out? (I know the answer to this) because it is a form of gun registration and not right!
On CC I think anyone that can lawfully own a gun should be able to CC if they so chose.
"ANY freeperson, NOT imprisoned is allowed to be armed?" now this is another hard one because again we let too many people that are murders walk on the same streets as you and me. I don't think all felonies should be treated the same. And there are many felons that have paid there due to society and as such should have all of there rights restored. But murders should be executed then we would not have to worry about them getting guns and doing harm.
These are just my thoughts.0 -
James, it's "privilege". [:D]
pdq_wizzard: so all-n-all, you do belive in some "reasonable" gun control?0 -
quote:Originally posted by Highball
If there are indeed gun owners ..even a few ..in California that actually embrace the Constitution and Bill of Rights EXACTLY as written...I will cease my highly vocal objections to sending anymore weapons there.
Highball,
Here's proof that more than a few CalGunners are supportive of your 2A views. Can we count on your support?
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=1439620 -
quote:Originally posted by impactco
quote:Originally posted by Highball
If there are indeed gun owners ..even a few ..in California that actually embrace the Constitution and Bill of Rights EXACTLY as written...I will cease my highly vocal objections to sending anymore weapons there.
Highball,
Here's proof that more than a few CalGunners are supportive of your 2A views. Can we count on your support?
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=143962
Only reading the FIRST page of responses, your poll isn't accurate to posted responses. Only one or two were totally serious about no restrictions.
You won't find me advocating ANY laws/restictions/ect for firearms OR ammo. Hell, even one guy supposedly advocated NO laws, then in the same breath advocated a law for age requirement. Either those people are unable to process the question, or they enjoy talking from BOTH sides of their mouth.0 -
Why are we at Calguns even trying then. [B)] I guess we should just give in as you have and wait till the revolution???
Oh thats right because I will not sit on my hands and do nothing. Short of taking up arm vs. my own Gov. even though some on there [:o)] think thats the only way.
Having an argument on the internet is like running a race in the special olympics. Even if you win your still retarded.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Deadred707
Why are we at Calguns even trying then. [B)] I guess we should just give in as you have and wait till the revolution???
Oh thats right because I will not sit on my hands and do nothing. Short of taking up arm vs. my own Gov. even though some on there [:o)] think thats the only way.
Having an argument on the internet is like running a race in the special olympics. Even if you win your still retarded.
What have you on calguns have done? Concrete cases please where calgun or CA "gun owners" have overturned a single piece of CA gun control legislation.0 -
quote:Originally posted by impactco
quote:Originally posted by Highball
If there are indeed gun owners ..even a few ..in California that actually embrace the Constitution and Bill of Rights EXACTLY as written...I will cease my highly vocal objections to sending anymore weapons there.
Highball,
Here's proof that more than a few CalGunners are supportive of your 2A views. Can we count on your support?
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=143962
54.47% support gun control. any more questions?0 -
Yeah how many felons do you want to have buying guns from a FFL in your state? 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Deadred707
Yeah how many felons do you want to have buying guns from a FFL in your state?
Well, I want every person, whom has been released, to be able to buy a gun from ANY store that chooses to sell them. FFL's are unconstitutional and so is trivially taking away a freeperson's RIGHTS.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Deadred707
Why are we at Calguns even trying then. [B)] I guess we should just give in as you have and wait till the revolution???
Oh thats right because I will not sit on my hands and do nothing. Short of taking up arm vs. my own Gov. even though some on there [:o)] think thats the only way.
Having an argument on the internet is like running a race in the special olympics. Even if you win your still retarded.
Well, one of us MIGHT be in the special olympics, but it ain't me.
"If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck".
Fight for the sake of fighting, any not winning any battles, puts YOU on the losing side.
Change your tactics and WIN for once, would ya?0 -
quote:Originally posted by Deadred707
Yeah how many felons do you want to have buying guns from a FFL in your state?
What's a "felon" and what's "FFL" and what do these terms have to do with the US Constitution?
Note, once again, the main question to these trolls went ignored and unanswered. [:)]0 -
quote:Originally posted by freemind
quote:Originally posted by Deadred707
Why are we at Calguns even trying then. [B)] I guess we should just give in as you have and wait till the revolution???
Oh thats right because I will not sit on my hands and do nothing. Short of taking up arm vs. my own Gov. even though some on there [:o)] think thats the only way.
Having an argument on the internet is like running a race in the special olympics. Even if you win your still retarded.
Well, one of us MIGHT be in the special olympics, but it ain't me.
"If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck".
Fight for the sake of fighting, any not winning any battles, puts YOU on the losing side.
Change your tactics and WIN for once, would ya?
Your running 3rd right now.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
quote:Originally posted by Deadred707
Yeah how many felons do you want to have buying guns from a FFL in your state?
What's a "felon" and what's "FFL" and what do these terms have to do with the US Constitution?
Note, once again, the main question to these trolls went ignored and unanswered. [:)]
Sure it went unanswered. I knew it, and so did you. These people are trying to get OUR money and support flowing into their cause.
It would be like me throwing money or vocal support to Sarah Brady, NO THANKS.0 -
Well, there appears to be 103 people out there ...40 %... That recognize the truth of the matter.
That is a bigger percentage then we get here, on General...every time we run the poll.
Perhaps it is time to think about this a bit.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Highball
Well, there appears to be 103 people out there ...40 %... That recognize the truth of the matter.
That is a bigger percentage then we get here, on General...every time we run the poll.
Perhaps it is time to think about this a bit.
Well, since this forum software doesn't allow to conduct polls internally, I don't think it's an accurate assessment. Besides, the questions on that poll are misleading. Polls don't give you an accurate picture of anything anyhow.0 -
quote:Originally posted by freemind
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
quote:Originally posted by Deadred707
Yeah how many felons do you want to have buying guns from a FFL in your state?
What's a "felon" and what's "FFL" and what do these terms have to do with the US Constitution?
Note, once again, the main question to these trolls went ignored and unanswered. [:)]
Sure it went unanswered. I knew it, and so did you. These people are trying to get OUR money and support flowing into their cause.
It would be like me throwing money or vocal support to Sarah Brady, NO THANKS.
[:)] It's rather amusing.
I can't say that if the cause is 2A the way we see it it would be pointless, but once again, one needs to see results. "Resisting" and "fighting" without any results obviously isn't gonna do anything. They do have a fund and some lawyers and what not, but fighting a completely wrong cause, or rather fighting effect than cause, which is pointless waste of energy and resources. Don't see much dedication in that particular community either. Could be the lack of leadership though. Too many group pulling the blanket onto themselves, which is normal, maybe it isn't time yet.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Highball
Well, there appears to be 103 people out there ...40 %... That recognize the truth of the matter.
That is a bigger percentage then we get here, on General...every time we run the poll.
Perhaps it is time to think about this a bit.
Yes, many of us here are all fighting for the same cause. I'm glad that you now see the evidence of that.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
James, it's "privilege". [:D]
pdq_wizzard: so all-n-all, you do belive in some "reasonable" gun control?
if we don't put to death the people that need to be, then yes "reasonable" gun control is ok with me, but like I has said in other posts, IF you already own a gun there is NO reason to have a waiting peroid!!!0 -
quote:Originally posted by freemind
Where does restricting a citizens rights, give ANY saftey to society? There is NO answer to that.
I would have to say that restricting A citezens rights when it comes to gun control our saftey goes down, the crimals don't give a crap about the law.0 -
quote:Originally posted by pdq_wizzard
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
pdq_wizzard: so all-n-all, you do belive in some "reasonable" gun control?
if we don't put to death the people that need to be, then yes "reasonable" gun control is ok with me,
Thank you for clarifying it. You have much to learn.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
quote:Originally posted by pdq_wizzard
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
pdq_wizzard: so all-n-all, you do belive in some "reasonable" gun control?
if we don't put to death the people that need to be, then yes "reasonable" gun control is ok with me,
Thank you for clarifying it. You have much to learn.
learn about what? the fact that we let people out of our jails that should never have seen the light of day? I still say there are people out there that should NEVER own a gun. (use a gun in a crime you can never have a gun)0 -
quote:Originally posted by pdq_wizzard
learn about what?
Listening for one. Come back when you're ready.0
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