Sovereignty - Do you Know Who You are?
Our government has turned us upside down and the people are so ignorant they don't have a clue.American citizens are going lower and lower bit by bit. Who is sovereign? Some would have you believe the Government is master for they themselves are agents of change for the enslavement of our citizens. If you want to learn what you can really do to turn this country around use this link and when finished completely 7 segments comments are welcome.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAVIh7MipX8
States know the truth why don't you?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUNQd8YhKHU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAVIh7MipX8States know the truth why don't you?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUNQd8YhKHU
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I know that I was built in a government run military factory out of surplus military parts.[:D] 0 -
Some interesting reads there nunn. 0 -
As I stated before, I have no use for either the Sovereigns or the Southern Poverty Law Center, but I have never heard of anyone with the SPLC shooting at the police over a minor traffic infraction.
Sovereign Citizens, as lofty as the title sounds, are NUTBAGS.0 -
Yeah I cant figure that either, no one should have a problem following the laws that do not violate the Constitution such as traffic laws and such and certainly is not anything to pull a smoke wagon over. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
As I stated before, I have no use for either the Sovereigns or the Southern Poverty Law Center, but I have never heard of anyone with the SPLC shooting at the police over a minor traffic infraction.
Sovereign Citizens, as lofty as the title sounds, are NUTBAGS.
All of them are nutbags, each and every one?
If your logic holds true then because some police commit crimes, then all police are criminals.
Broad-brushes are wonderful things.0 -
Enough of them are nutbags, and their stated purposes are so extreme, that I will regard them with suspicion.
Maybe there are some nice Klansmen too, but I don't care to know any of them0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
Enough of them are nutbags, and their stated purposes are so extreme, that I will regard them with suspicion.
Maybe there are some nice Klansmen too, but I don't care to know any of them
Nothing wrong with that. Caution is a good thing, particularly when dealing with those who are seen as 'extreme' and who oppose most government authority and one represents that government authority at the lowest level.
Merely making a point with my previous comment.0 -
quote:Originally posted by lt496
quote:Originally posted by nunn
As I stated before, I have no use for either the Sovereigns or the Southern Poverty Law Center, but I have never heard of anyone with the SPLC shooting at the police over a minor traffic infraction.
Sovereign Citizens, as lofty as the title sounds, are NUTBAGS.
All of them are nutbags, each and every one?
If your logic holds true then because some police commit crimes, then all police are criminals.
Broad-brushes are wonderful things.
Cant argue with that.
I would hope to presume that nunn was meaning or referring to shooting at police over a traffic infraction and not labeling those bad that would defend the Constitution. Although he does seem to paint with a very 'broad brush' however and might consider being more defined with whom he labels and or makes presumptions.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Juggernaut
quote:Originally posted by lt496
quote:Originally posted by nunn
As I stated before, I have no use for either the Sovereigns or the Southern Poverty Law Center, but I have never heard of anyone with the SPLC shooting at the police over a minor traffic infraction.
Sovereign Citizens, as lofty as the title sounds, are NUTBAGS.
All of them are nutbags, each and every one?
If your logic holds true then because some police commit crimes, then all police are criminals.
Broad-brushes are wonderful things.
Cant argue with that.
I would hope to presume that nunn was meaning or referring to shooting at police over a traffic infraction and not labeling those bad that would defend the Constitution. Although he does seem to paint with a very 'broad brush' however and might consider being more defined with whom he labels and or makes presumptions.
'Sovereign Citizens' scare many people (particularly police) with their views on individual liberty and severely limited government.
As with any group who hold to such views and when viewed in the light of our ever more predatory government and police, then there is sure to be a certain fringe that carry the views to a violent level.
Two ends of a spectrum...
Overreaching, extra and anti-constitutional governance vs. confrontational individual-liberty beliefs with an eye on forcing government at nearly all levels back into the bottle that it was intended to be in at our founding.
Police, by the nature of their being the 'tip of the spear' of government and by largely being 'Law Enforcement Officers', are in the position to be the contact with the movement.
There are sure to be confrontations and some of them will turn bad.
Caution is a good thing, just as is an understanding of the root-cause of the sovereign citizen movement and an understanding of their views.0 -
Very good, you sound like HighBall. 0 -
And you know what else? Paying federal income tax is voluntary! 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Juggernaut
Very good, you sound like HighBall.
Well, Bert had his head screwed on straight in such matters of government and liberty. He and I saw eye-to-eye on many things.
There are a number of other such men who post on these forums and I am proud to number myself among them.
That said, I am and always have been my own man, one who happens to espouse and agree with certain themes that one also hears from other such men.
That is a good thing.0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
And you know what else? Paying federal income tax is voluntary!
So, if something is 'a law', or 'a regulation', regardless of its comparability with the Constitution or founding principles, we all had best just shut up and go along quietly, huh...
Of course, people could simply call you and have you decide for them on what they can and cannot stand in opposition to, or on what approach to take in that opposition.
Personally, I like the spirit of opposition to government in 'most' of its guises. We need it, desperately.
King George had lots of 'good men' who stood in the breach and enforced 'his law' also.
Thank God there was a spark in some men that just wouldn't concede to go along with all that was commonly accepted or what was decided by the powers that be.
Crazy stuff, huh?
Philosophically speaking, of course.0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
And you know what else? Paying federal income tax is voluntary!
Not according to them and Gordon Kahl, Andrew Joseph Stack and Ed and Elaine Brown to name a few.
quote:Originally posted by lt496
quote:Originally posted by Juggernaut
Very good, you sound like HighBall.
Well, Bert had his head screwed on straight in such matters of government and liberty. He and I saw eye-to-eye on many things.
There are a number of other such men who post on these forums and I am proud to number myself among them.
That said, I am and always have been my own man, one who happens to espouse and agree with certain themes that one also hears from other such men.
That is a good thing.
That is good as am I.
quote:Originally posted by lt496
quote:Originally posted by nunn
And you know what else? Paying federal income tax is voluntary!
So, if something is 'a law', or 'a regulation', regardless of its comparability with the Constitution or founding principles, we all had best just shut up and go along quietly, huh...
Of course, people could simply call you and have you decide for them on what they can and cannot stand in opposition to, or on what approach to take in that opposition.
Personally, I like the spirit of opposition to government in 'most' of its guises. We need it, desperately.
King George had lots of 'good men' who stood in the breach and enforced 'his law' also.
Thank God there was a spark in some men that just wouldn't concede to go along with all that was commonly accepted or what was decided by the powers that be.
Crazy stuff, huh?
Philosophically speaking, of course.
Well said, apparently I like you, HighBall and other true Patriots of the Republic of the Constitution are sparks that will form a raging fire from all over our Nation if it is necessary and comes to that; hopefully not lest we be spared the bloodshed and carnage of war that will be upon us yet once again.0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
As I stated before, I have no use for either the Sovereigns or the Southern Poverty Law Center, but I have never heard of anyone with the SPLC shooting at the police over a minor traffic infraction.
Sovereign Citizens, as lofty as the title sounds, are NUTBAGS.
I would expect a comment like that from an uneducated person.
You only prove your lack of understanding by your narrow minded comments, did you even take the time to watch and try to understand the position so it could be discussed?,I doubt it.
But then again that has always been the case in the history of this nation and this people that failed the test of true freedom.
You remind me of those in the past history of this nation that sided with the king, they thought patriots were "NUTCASES" as well.
Nuf said.
The government schools have done a great job of controlling the minds of our citizens.0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
And you know what else? Paying federal income tax is voluntary!
In 1871 a corporation was formed called 'UNITED STATES' (all caps)that has it's own similar, but not identical, Constitution and is governed by Admiralty or corporate law. This was done for the express purpose of hoodwinking the American people into believing that IT was the lawful united States of America, when in fact, it is not. The corporate 'UNITED STATES' operates under UCC (Uniform Commercial Code), not common law
What has happened here is that the IRS now is functioning like the mob. This country didn't have income tax till the creation of the federal reserve back in 1913. It wasn't fully implemented till after ww2 with the excuse of helping to pay off the war effort.
Paying income tax in America actually is voluntary since anybody who doesn't want to is free to go move to puerto Rico or some foreign tax shelter or put their money in some sort of tax exempt foundation and not pay a cent to the IRS
See what a IRS head say's here.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSW_M5_jPkA&feature=relatedhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hctiAVTfZq4&feature=related
and one more for you to learn something.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1r1hNjxVfU&feature=related0 -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_QAoDNf0_s&feature=related
Not just in the US but in the UK as well. Time to reign in unconstitutional government, they are in the UK.0 -
The only duly constituted law enforcement officers in this country are County Sheriffs. 0 -
And the only true Constitutional Militia are volunteers made up of the 3% citizenry of this Nation to stand up against tyranny foreign and or domestic and no matter what form that it may take from evil dictator(s) to jack booted thug(jbt) henchmen makes no difference, the rest are just civilians. We have an obligation to protect the Constitution from blight such as this and expunge it from our GOD granted sovereign and Constitutional Nation. Just because some politician, official, president, senator, congressman, general or other individual, organization, department, agency, corporation, church, group, etc tries to dictate laws and legislation to us and then tries to enforce it upon us does no obligate us to follow it if it is not in line with the Constitution. As beside the Holy Scriptures(which is in a religious aspect and in a separate class) the Constitution is the highest law of the land and there is no law that can supersede it no matter the situation or circumstance. Therefore if legislation is illegally passed that violates the Constitution we are NOT obligated to follow it but we are obligated to fight and undermine it so help us GOD. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
The only duly constituted law enforcement officers in this country are County Sheriffs.
You are 150% correct, the sheriff's office has the authority
and duty to protect it's citizens from unconstitutional laws.
Edmund Burke commented that, "Bad laws are the worst form of tyranny." It is not what a lawyer tells me I may do; but what humanity, reason, and justice tell me I ought to do.
Today in the u.s.a. we have tyranny. Thousands of new laws are being shoved down sovereign u.s. citizens throats, most bear little resemblance to the Constitution that our forefathers gave us.I believe the very essence of tyranny is defined by the blind enforcement of bad laws and the people willingly following them.
A Sheriff has the power, the authority, and the responsibility to resist tyranny and unconstitutional laws and actions, and some actually do one of which is Sheriff Mac;Here is a short speech given and he talks about the Brady bill.
Sheriff mac on video...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nfVjgp7OYE&NR=1
http://www.paulstramer.com/constitutionaldutiesofasheriff.htm0 -
Sovereign Citizens and Posse Comitatus. Interesting.
By the way, I work for a municipality, not a sheriff, so am I a JBT?0 -
quote:Originally posted by Juggernaut
And the only true Constitutional Militia are volunteers made up of the 3% citizenry of this Nation to stand up against tyranny foreign and or domestic and no matter what form that it may take from evil dictator(s) to jack booted thug(jbt) henchmen makes no difference, the rest are just civilians. We have an obligation to protect the Constitution from blight such as this and expunge it from our GOD granted sovereign and Constitutional Nation. Just because some politician, official, president, senator, congressman, general or other individual, organization, department, agency, corporation, church, group, etc tries to dictate laws and legislation to us and then tries to enforce it upon us does no obligate us to follow it if it is not in line with the Constitution. As beside the Holy Scriptures(which is in a religious aspect and in a separate class) the Constitution is the highest law of the land and there is no law that can supersede it no matter the situation or circumstance. Therefore if legislation is illegally passed that violates the Constitution we are NOT obligated to follow it but we are obligated to fight and undermine it so help us GOD.
Well, my God man! If things are that dire, then please quickly get off your computer and get out there and start "standing up against tyranny" to protect us. You and the others of those self-appointed 3% percenters are being lazy by just hanging out in your computer room banging away on your keyboard. You can't do much "protecting" that way.
Heck, since it is obvious you and the 3% percenters haven't been doing your job (or apparently doing ANYTHING but banging on your keyboard) I think it is fair for me to blame you 3% percenters as being the reason I have lost a lot of my constitutional rights. All of you have only been posting on the internet and not out there doing your job.
Please get our there and do your job.0 -
quote:Originally posted by sovereignman
quote:Originally posted by nunn
The only duly constituted law enforcement officers in this country are County Sheriffs.
You are 150% correct, the sheriff's office has the authority
and duty to protect it's citizens from unconstitutional laws.
Edmund Burke commented that, "Bad laws are the worst form of tyranny." It is not what a lawyer tells me I may do; but what humanity, reason, and justice tell me I ought to do.
Today in the u.s.a. we have tyranny. Thousands of new laws are being shoved down sovereign u.s. citizens throats, most bear little resemblance to the Constitution that our forefathers gave us.I believe the very essence of tyranny is defined by the blind enforcement of bad laws and the people willingly following them.
A Sheriff has the power, the authority, and the responsibility to resist tyranny and unconstitutional laws and actions, and some actually do one of which is Sheriff Mac;Here is a short speech given and he talks about the Brady bill.
Sheriff mac on video...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nfVjgp7OYE&NR=1
http://www.paulstramer.com/constitutionaldutiesofasheriff.htm
Well, I will admit that Sheriffs are close to the people because they are elected and have to be re-elected. And the sheriff's deputys are under the control of the Sheriff. But I don't see the police departments being a whole lot different. Reason being that the police chief is appointed by the city council and those city council members are elected.
Also I have observed that various police chiefs have supported citizens rights and variousl sheriffs have trampled citizens rights. So I don't see the difference that some here are trying to sell. I think they are trying to make something out of nothing.0 -
quote:Originally posted by tr fox
quote:Originally posted by sovereignman
quote:Originally posted by nunn
The only duly constituted law enforcement officers in this country are County Sheriffs.
You are 150% correct, the sheriff's office has the authority
and duty to protect it's citizens from unconstitutional laws.
Edmund Burke commented that, "Bad laws are the worst form of tyranny." It is not what a lawyer tells me I may do; but what humanity, reason, and justice tell me I ought to do.
Today in the u.s.a. we have tyranny. Thousands of new laws are being shoved down sovereign u.s. citizens throats, most bear little resemblance to the Constitution that our forefathers gave us.I believe the very essence of tyranny is defined by the blind enforcement of bad laws and the people willingly following them.
A Sheriff has the power, the authority, and the responsibility to resist tyranny and unconstitutional laws and actions, and some actually do one of which is Sheriff Mac;Here is a short speech given and he talks about the Brady bill.
Sheriff mac on video...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7nfVjgp7OYE&NR=1
http://www.paulstramer.com/constitutionaldutiesofasheriff.htm
Well, I will admit that Sheriffs are close to the people because they are elected and have to be re-elected. And the sheriff's deputys are under the control of the Sheriff. But I don't see the police departments being a whole lot different. Reason being that the police chief is appointed by the city council and those city council members are elected.
Also I have observed that various police chiefs have supported citizens rights and variousl sheriffs have trampled citizens rights. So I don't see the difference that some here are trying to sell. I think they are trying to make something out of nothing.
No peace officer, sheriff, or State government is obliged to comply with a federal law that violates the Constitution. This is why our elected officials, military, and police take no oath to the President, Supreme Court, or the Congress, but to the United States Constitution.
States are sovereign entities can use their powers to prevent the enforcement of illegal statutes and executive orders within their boundaries.
The Sheriff is the chief law enforcement officer of every county in the 50 states and they have the duty to NOT allow such laws in their jurisdictions.This precedent goes back to English common law and before.
Juries (power in the sovereign hands of the sovereign people)likewise have a duty and an obligation to consider the Constitutionality of a law before they decide a case, despite what judges try to instruct them in the process of trying to herd them like cattle into a mindset that only the judge can read the law, that is pure bull. The law was made for the people, and not for the exclusive use or understanding of judges or lawyers.
This is the way our government was set up to work. This is the true system of checks and balances set up by our founding fathers.
Thomas Jefferson, the author of the Declaration of Independence, and James Madison,the one person most responsible for authoring the U.S. Constitution, separately authored resolutions nullifying the Alien and Sedition Acts within two states,via the Kentucky and Virginia Resolutions.
The state legislators declared the law for what it was,unconstitutional and such law was unenforceable in those states.
Jefferson said that "acts that seek to punish crimes exceeding the mandates within the enumerated powers "are altogether void, and of no force; and that the power to create, define, and punish such other crimes is reserved, and, of right, appertains solely and exclusively to the respective States, each within its own territory."
State nullification of illegal federal laws are a cornerstone of our founding principles. States are starting to wake up and understand their 10th amendment responsibilities. http://www.revolutionary-war-and-beyond.com/10th-amendment.html
The 2nd Amendment has certain limitations in peacetime, but if Americans are pushed to the wall by extremism by government despots there are no limits at that point.It is the duty of every citizen to overthrow a despotic system by any means available.
There is a line in the sand so to speak, every sovereign citizen must decide where that line is and act accordingly.0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
Sovereign Citizens and Posse Comitatus. Interesting.
By the way, I work for a municipality, not a sheriff, so am I a JBT?
I assume you took a "OATH" to the Constitution,you are required to
obey your oath first and foremost or it means nothing.
And if statute law conflicts with Constitutional and common law your duty lies to uphold Constitutional law first and foremost.
Either you are a peace officer first or you are a statute enforcer and tax collector. It would depend on your understanding the responsibilities of your oath of office and your obedience to same.0 -
quote:Originally posted by sovereignman
quote:Originally posted by nunn
Sovereign Citizens and Posse Comitatus. Interesting.
By the way, I work for a municipality, not a sheriff, so am I a JBT?
I assume you took a "OATH" to the Constitution,you are required to
obey your oath first and foremost or it means nothing.
And if statute law conflicts with Constitutional and common law your duty lies to uphold Constitutional law first and foremost.
Either you are a peace officer first or you are a statute enforcer and tax collector. It would depend on your understanding the responsibilities of your oath of office and your obedience to same.
Succinct and absolutely dead-nuts on target.0 -
quote:Originally posted by lt496
quote:Originally posted by sovereignman
quote:Originally posted by nunn
Sovereign Citizens and Posse Comitatus. Interesting.
By the way, I work for a municipality, not a sheriff, so am I a JBT?
I assume you took a "OATH" to the Constitution,you are required to
obey your oath first and foremost or it means nothing.
And if statute law conflicts with Constitutional and common law your duty lies to uphold Constitutional law first and foremost.
Either you are a peace officer first or you are a statute enforcer and tax collector. It would depend on your understanding the responsibilities of your oath of office and your obedience to same.
Succinct and absolutely dead-nuts on target.
Works for me and well said.0 -
I follow orders without question. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
I follow orders without question.
You remind me of history past, Just like Hitlers men who blindly followed orders. It didn't help them when they got to Nuremberg.
And it won't help you when the judgement come.0
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