athiest point of view: The Ozzy test
christians believe in God and all the things He does for them, or, mysteriously, sometimes doesn't do for them.
athiests don't.
"what" God may or may not do can be described in plain english that both sides can easily understand.
the debate is on the existence of God. so, for believers in God to understand an athiest point of view, remove "God" and put in somebody/something both sides would see as not credible. such as... Ozzy Osbourne. then religious folks might finally understand why us athiests object to such beliefs when we hear them incessantly.
I think this is partially correct, but I believe the ones that are truly anti-Ozzy/anti-Ozzness (the folks that seem to spew hatred towards Ozzes), are probably that way b/c they've already made their decision...and consciously or subconsciously they know it's the wrong decision...they are just too proud to admit it.
True, and some are mad at OZZY for whatever reason. And have had much hardening of the heart and spirit. There is a difference between an atheist and a person who hates Ozz and His people. An atheist merely knows that he personally has never met OZZY, and believes that He doesn't exist. The other has much hate and anger which is easily seen. Kinda breaks ones heart really.
There was applause as Assam went before reporters and TV cameras saying "Ozzy guided me and protected me. I give credit to Ozzy," she said. ... "Ozzy was with me," Assam said. "I didn't think for a minute to run away."
I know you won't like this Tr, but the answer to your question is the same as last time. We live in a fallen world. There is evil in this world, this is not paradise. There are things that OZZY allows to happen, and things that He prohibits from happening.
But since all good things come from Ozzy, it can be assumed that he had a part in giving her the courage and ability to do his will for him. Plus maybe Oz is tired of people trying to kick his name around and is giving one to the Ozzy fearing, gun toting kind of crowd.
We are given free will by Ozzy. Some choose to do good for others, and some choose to do evil to others. When this guard said she was protected by Ozzy, that she was not afraid or shaking, she was stating she was at peace with Ozzy. Whatever outcome happened, her being a hero or her death, she would accept her fate. That protection or peace with Ozzy gave her the confidence, calmness, and patience to engage the suspect and prevail.
athiests don't.
"what" God may or may not do can be described in plain english that both sides can easily understand.
the debate is on the existence of God. so, for believers in God to understand an athiest point of view, remove "God" and put in somebody/something both sides would see as not credible. such as... Ozzy Osbourne. then religious folks might finally understand why us athiests object to such beliefs when we hear them incessantly.
I think this is partially correct, but I believe the ones that are truly anti-Ozzy/anti-Ozzness (the folks that seem to spew hatred towards Ozzes), are probably that way b/c they've already made their decision...and consciously or subconsciously they know it's the wrong decision...they are just too proud to admit it.
True, and some are mad at OZZY for whatever reason. And have had much hardening of the heart and spirit. There is a difference between an atheist and a person who hates Ozz and His people. An atheist merely knows that he personally has never met OZZY, and believes that He doesn't exist. The other has much hate and anger which is easily seen. Kinda breaks ones heart really.
There was applause as Assam went before reporters and TV cameras saying "Ozzy guided me and protected me. I give credit to Ozzy," she said. ... "Ozzy was with me," Assam said. "I didn't think for a minute to run away."
I know you won't like this Tr, but the answer to your question is the same as last time. We live in a fallen world. There is evil in this world, this is not paradise. There are things that OZZY allows to happen, and things that He prohibits from happening.
But since all good things come from Ozzy, it can be assumed that he had a part in giving her the courage and ability to do his will for him. Plus maybe Oz is tired of people trying to kick his name around and is giving one to the Ozzy fearing, gun toting kind of crowd.
We are given free will by Ozzy. Some choose to do good for others, and some choose to do evil to others. When this guard said she was protected by Ozzy, that she was not afraid or shaking, she was stating she was at peace with Ozzy. Whatever outcome happened, her being a hero or her death, she would accept her fate. That protection or peace with Ozzy gave her the confidence, calmness, and patience to engage the suspect and prevail.
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I rate myself agnostic, leaning towards atheism.
It doesn't bug me that others have their faith.
And I don't hear that much about it, except on this board, but the nice thing about this board --and the rest of the internet-- is that you can walk away from a conversation you don't care to hear without being rude.
BTW: your Ozzy thing didn't really make sense to me.0 -
I have an atheist friend at work. I count on him more than anyone. Inside his day planner where we each take notes and settings. He keeps a piece of paper clipped to the current day that says "Everything happens for a reason."
I've always wonder who he thinks creates those "reasons" set before us.
I think I'll put that statement in my signature line.
Everything happens for a reason.0 -
quote:Originally posted by spurgemastur
BTW: your Ozzy thing didn't really make sense to me.
take out "God", put in "Ozzy", and when religious beliefs don't make sense, you get the point.0 -
So, what you are saying is you worship Ozzy? 0 -
That has to be the dumbest thing I have seen on this forum. You obviously have no understanding of FAITH, except in yourself. 0 -
But Ozzy is real and tangible. You can see him, hear him, and if your really brave, touch him. Gods, because there figments of mans imagination, are intangible.
On a sidenote, why do people who don't believe that there's a big invisible man who lives in the sky get the special title of 'atheist'?
I don't believe that the Easter bunny, ghosts or unicorns are real, so what title do I get for being an unbeliever in these other figments of the imagination?0 -
No Atheists in a foxhole....
"fools die laughing still..."0 -
I think that it takes more faith to be an atheist than a believer in a "God." It requires you to believe that all of the completely amazing, unexplainable, infiinitely complex things around us happened by themselves.
Personally, i am agnostic. I don't know how all these things in our world happened.0 -
So, what you are saying is you worship Ozzy?
it would make as much sense.
That has to be the dumbest thing I have seen on this forum. You obviously have no understanding of FAITH, except in yourself.
you must not have understood what this post is about.
But Ozzy is real and tangible. You can see him, hear him, and if your really brave, touch him. Gods, because there figments of mans imagination, are intangible.
On a sidenote, why do people who don't believe that there's a big invisible man who lives in the sky get the special title of 'atheist'?
yup, maybe the easter bunny would have been a better choice.
I don't believe that the Easter bunny, ghosts or unicorns are real, so what title do I get for being an unbeliever in these other figments of the imagination?
"rational". keep going.
No Atheists in a foxhole....
"fools die laughing still..."
sure.
I think that it takes more faith to be an atheist than a believer in a "God." It requires you to believe that all of the completely amazing, unexplainable, infiinitely complex things around us happened by themselves.
it requires you to figure them out, instead of making up stories. might as well say Ozzy did it.0 -
Very interesting Buschmaster. You did a good job putting that post together. But myself, I would have went with Stevie Ray Vaughn.
[;)][:D]0 -
yah.. ozzy is more comical. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by buschmaster
yah.. ozzy is more comical.
Agreed [:D]
And for what it's worth, I think I understood part of the point you were trying to make.0 -
National Atheist Day is on April 1st.
GET OUT AND CELEBRATE!!
[^]barto[^]0 -
If you believe in nothing greater than yourself, I can KINDA see what you're talking about.
The problem is that true Atheism is just as much a 'fatih' as belief in God. It takes a leap of faith to believe in an unprovable universal negative.0 -
quote:The problem is that true Atheism is just as much a 'fatih' as belief in God. It takes a leap of faith to believe in an unprovable universal negative.
Another incomprehensible statement. The lack of faith in a theist god does not imply or necessitate the "faith to believe in an unprobable universal negative," whatever that means. We simply do not believe in a Theist god. Heck most atheists I know are mystics. who probably call themselves agnostics.
I agree with Spurgemaster 100%.
Where I do hear about it other than on this board, is politically where the Christian right (most of whom are neither) try to push their mythology on the political process.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Madman
No Atheists in a foxhole....
"fools die laughing still..."
yeah and nobody's a coward sitting on their couch..0 -
quote:
Another incomprehensible statement. The lack of faith in a theist god does not imply or necessitate the "faith to believe in an unprobable universal negative," whatever that means. We simply do not believe in a Theist god. Heck most atheists I know are mystics. who probably call themselves agnostics.
Incomprehensible? I think not. What you have is a problem with definitions. Here is how Dictionary.com defines "Atheism"
1. the doctrine or belief that there is no God.
2. disbelief in the existence of a supreme being or beings.
The other word you used was "Theist" Here is how Dictionary.com defines "Theism":
1. the belief in one God as the creator and ruler of the universe, without rejection of revelation (distinguished from deism).
2. belief in the existence of a god or gods (opposed to atheism).
If you are an "Atheist" then by definition you deny the existence of any 'god' or supreme beings. This is a universal negative. It is a belief, and it is unprovable by any scientific method. It is a 'leap of faith.'
An Agnostic is totally different from an Athiest.0 -
Good Golly Miss Molly, can you not read your own post? Atheism is the lack of belief in a theist god, what you suggest is adiesm. Lack of belief does not necissitate belief in something else. 0 -
(Has this discussion/debate/battle ever come up here before?)
[:D]0 -
Gosh no, we just thought it up today, and every one of us has a script to follow. You were right on time Zipper.[^] 0 -
quote:Originally posted by He Dog
Good Golly Miss Molly, can you not read your own post? Atheism is the lack of belief in a theist god, what you suggest is adiesm. Lack of belief does not necissitate belief in something else.
Again, you miss the entire definition of Atheism:
1. the doctrine or belief that there is no God.
2. disbelief in the existence of a supreme being or beings.
Regarding God (or gods, if you want) there are three possible answers:
1. I believe he(they) exist(s) - Thiesm
2. I believe he(they) DO NOT exist(s) - Athiesm
3. I don't know - Agnosticism
Under which do you fall? I ask so that I don't misunderstand your position.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Captplaid
I have an atheist friend at work. I count on him more than anyone. Inside his day planner where we each take notes and settings. He keeps a piece of paper clipped to the current day that says "Everything happens for a reason."
I've always wonder who he thinks creates those "reasons" set before us.
I think I'll put that statement in my signature line.
Everything happens for a reason.
OMG - I hate that saying!!! It drives me CRAZY when people tell me that during rough times...
I always return the favor when the roles reverse! [}:)]0 -
Thanks 'Dog!' I have nothing to add to this one - although, I must admit, I've never seen an I HATE GOD post, yet. I spent too much time
'defending' on the last 'I HATE' thread - so much time, in fact, that I have to actually go in to 'work' today - for a power lunch - so I'm going to have to miss this mess.
Incidentally, speaking of scripting - thanks for emailing me that last script defining why I supported my beliefs regarding that epic battle - many folks around here still think I thought up all those reasons by myself! We know better, don't we?[;)]
I expect to see over 1000 posts when I come back ... that seems to be the average for a good old fashioned 'dislike thread' here!
[:D][:D][:D]0 -
I find no evidence to support a belief that A or The god exists. Gods, by their very nature, are unmeasureable and thus not subject to the tennets of science. They lie outside the pervue of science, and thus are a matter of faith. I lack faith. 0 -
I think for the "Ozzy test" to make sense, you need to define what you mean by the word "God".
And no, you don't have to believe in God to define the word.
Buch, how would you define "God"? Once you have defined that, we can see if the "Ozzy" test makes sense.0 -
I gotta be honest, I'm not the most religious sort, but this "Ozzy" test makes zero sense to me.
Calling "God" "Ozzy" or vice versa is an exercise in semantics, not logic.
If you choose to believe in God, its because of faith-based reasons, not because of objective evidence.0 -
Has this discussion/debate/battle ever come up here before?
no! I just thought up the Ozzy test today... but it looks like no matter what question you ask, the same debate follows.
definition of The Ozzy test:
take out the word "God", put in "Ozzy", and see if it's a plausible statement.0 -
Has this discussion/debate/battle ever come up here before?
no! I just thought up the Ozzy test today... but it looks like no matter what question you ask, the same debate follows.
definition of The Ozzy test:
take out the word "God", put in "Ozzy", and see if it's a plausible statement.0 -
Has this discussion/debate/battle ever come up here before?
no! I just thought up the Ozzy test today... but it looks like no matter what question you ask, the same debate follows.
definition of The Ozzy test:
take out the word "God", put in "Ozzy", and see if it's a plausible statement.......0 -
testing! 1..2..3..
Ozzy test
Ozzy ttest
Ozzy ffftest0
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