Diesel additives
Who in here uses additives in there diesels? If so what do you uses and why. If you had to choose between Diesel Kleen and Mystery oil what you use? I've been using Diesel Kleen in my Cummins, but have heard that Mystery oil is better, is this true?
Traci
Traci
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Dont know about the diesel kleen you mention. However I think the MM oil would work great in your diesel truck. Starting in 2007 (now) I heard that they will have ultra low sulphur diesel fuel to 'help' mother earth and some hippie crap like that. MM oil says not for 2007 ultra low vechiles --- which tells me that MM oil will have the necessary sulphur in it to lubraciate the valves and help you avoid costly future repairs; not to mention better mileage.
MM oil is an odd duck in that it can be used in gas, diesel, and gasoilne engine oil. [:0]
Since some diesel trucks have large tanks, and you may have to buy a rather large amount to go to directions -- but its worth it.0 -
I was thinking about using the MM oil, cause I've hear the new diesel won't lube my motor like the old diesel fuel. It's funny I've been mixing gas and oil for motorcycles and jetski's for ever. Now I'm mixing it for my truck. 0 -
Diesel Clean is good.
My favorite that we used in the big trucks (I would look into it before useing in the smaller diesel motors though) was Unleaded Gasoline. We would add about 1/2 gallon to every 150 gallon tank of diesel. In the refer units we would go a little less than 1/4 gallon to the refer tank (usually 50 gallon tanks).
The Unleaded gas keeps the fuel from gelling durring cold weather and cleans the fuel system very good.
But again talk to some people before trying in a pickup diesel. As I have not heard of anyone doing this in the smaller diesels and don't know if anything could be damaged in them by doing this.0 -
quote:Originally posted by git_r_done
Diesel Clean is good.
My favorite that we used in the big trucks (I would look into it before useing in the smaller diesel motors though) was Unleaded Gasoline. We would add about 1/2 gallon to every 150 gallon tank of diesel. In the refer units we would go a little less than 1/4 gallon to the refer tank (usually 50 gallon tanks).
The Unleaded gas keeps the fuel from gelling durring cold weather and cleans the fuel system very good.
But again talk to some people before trying in a pickup diesel. As I have not heard of anyone doing this in the smaller diesels and don't know if anything could be damaged in them by doing this.
Isn't the Cummins 5.9 orginally a semi-truck motor anyway?0 -
quote:Originally posted by Cutiegirlracing
quote:Originally posted by git_r_done
Diesel Clean is good.
My favorite that we used in the big trucks (I would look into it before useing in the smaller diesel motors though) was Unleaded Gasoline. We would add about 1/2 gallon to every 150 gallon tank of diesel. In the refer units we would go a little less than 1/4 gallon to the refer tank (usually 50 gallon tanks).
The Unleaded gas keeps the fuel from gelling durring cold weather and cleans the fuel system very good.
But again talk to some people before trying in a pickup diesel. As I have not heard of anyone doing this in the smaller diesels and don't know if anything could be damaged in them by doing this.
Isn't the Cummins 5.9 orginally a semi-truck motor anyway?
It is a scaled down big truck motor, but I believe there were minor changes to the fuel delivery system to comply with smog standards.
They may have also changed seal types on the fuel system on them (I'm not sure).
A bit of MM in the system will not hurt if lubercation is what you are conserned about as it is a great product.
The gas thing we basically used durring winter months as with those big tanks being exposed like they are on a big truck sometimes in places like Wyoming and Montana we would have problems with the fuel gelling due to the cold.
I personally had a fuel system gel on me in Montana on my refer system once and it took a Thermoking shop in Billings about 10hrs to get me back up so I could go pick up my load. On that one I actually needed the refer unit to heat to keep the load from freezing.
If you do use gas make sure you don't use alot. Like I said we only used 1/2 gallon to 150 gallons diesel.0 -
Kerosene before you even think about gasoline to keep from gelling. Gasoline will make a diesel engine blow into pieces!!!!!! Even in small mixed amounts the damage caused will guarentee a new engine will be needed. I am running 1/2 gallon white kerosene per fillup in my Ford Powerstroke since it got cold here. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Pa Redneck
Kerosene before you even think about gasoline to keep from gelling. Gasoline will make a diesel engine blow into pieces!!!!!! Even in small mixed amounts the damage caused will guarentee a new engine will be needed. I am running 1/2 gallon white kerosene per fillup in my Ford Powerstroke since it got cold here.
I did say to do checking before trying in a pickup. I have only done it in Semi's and on the refer units.
Both of these are a different breed of motor. And most refer units are actually set up like the old military multifuel motor's as far as compression goes.
I still doubt very small amounts in a pickup would blow the motor (although accidently put a bit too much and it will). On a pickup I would be more concerned with the changes in the fuel delivery system that has been made for smog porposes as the gas may damage it.
And again like I said we only used about a 300:1 ratio so it would not damage the motors.
But Kerosen may do the trick too. I don't know if it has a tendancy to gel in the cold though, and that is what we were trying to prevent.0 -
I run MM oil in my diesel tractor. Off road diesel fuel is $1.69. But on road fuel diesel $2.69 plus the cost of MM oil and it is no bargain to drive a diesel pickup truck. 0 -
Sometimes I'll pour in some Ecentialube(sp?),sometimes I just pour in a couple quarts of ATF. 0 -
The Cummins 5.9 liter starting in 2003 went to the common rail fuel system. Also at this time the engine was designed to be used for low sulfur fuel. Now the engine starting in 2007 is a rediesigned 6.7 liter replacing the aged 5.9. The new 6.7's now have egr valves, exhaust gas coolers, particulate mufflers, along with reg mufflers. Also any 03 to date model year really likes the bio-diesel. MM would be good choice or lucas, provided you mix the additives according to directions. But you really dont need them. As far as worrying about lubrication problems, as long as you kepp oil changed with a good oil filter and oil things will be all good. Same goes for keeping the fuel filters changed. Power adders should be used conservatibly- bully dog, injectors...etc... 0 -
My favorite is Power Service, but each their own. Have successfully used gasoline when no power service was avaiable, but only small quanities quart to 30 gal or so in John deeres, my 92 dodge cummins,94 and 97 also, haven't blown them to pieces yet.
When I can I would rather run a mix of #2 and #1 diesel in winter at about 2 to 1 and not worry about any additive, but #1 is not available at all stations0 -
I just wanted to mention, in the plant we run these engines in a dyno room, under pretty harsh conditions. We run our audit engines(qualitycheck) harder than you can think of or even attempt. They are good engines and reliable. 0 -
have contracted up to 20k gallons of red diesel a year for irrig engines when supplier switched to low sulfur....he had 2-1/2 gallon jugs of additive on the shelf that they added to low sulfur fuel to replace old additive which acted as a lubricant....they WOULD NOT SELL IT TO ME to add to my all ready contracted fuel saying they only would use it in their new contracts.... i have have had to repair all injection pumps with new style seals....i also have switched suppliers 0 -
Stanadyne is what I use in my 2005 Dodge 3500 Cummins. Both Dodge and Cummins recommend it. This is the formula I use - http://www.dieselpage.com/add1.htm 0 -
Most additives that I have purchased in the past are quite expensive. If you are required to put this stuff in your fuel doesn't this erode the cost savings of having a diesel in the first place? I have never owned a diesel and am just curious.
What is the fuel savings on a diesel engine? 25% or more?
I have always heard that you could get 300-500,000 out of the Dodge Cummins engines but then I hear lots of maint issues with the injectors. Since maint on a diesel is many more times a gas engine does this also erode the fuel savings? Plus the purchase premium for a diesel is much higher. I wonder how the cost would track over say 150,000 miles, gas vs diesel?0 -
quote:Originally posted by sig232
Most additives that I have purchased in the past are quite expensive. If you are required to put this stuff in your fuel doesn't this erode the cost savings of having a diesel in the first place? I have never owned a diesel and am just curious.
What is the fuel savings on a diesel engine? 25% or more?
I have always heard that you could get 300-500,000 out of the Dodge Cummins engines but then I hear lots of maint issues with the injectors. Since maint on a diesel is many more times a gas engine does this also erode the fuel savings? Plus the purchase premium for a diesel is much higher. I wonder how the cost would track over say 150,000 miles, gas vs diesel?
Here are the numbers on my Cummins powered 2005 Dodge Ram 3500 SLT Quad Cab (single-axle) 4x4 w/8' box (it weighs in at a hefty 7,800 lbs).
My average fuel economy (based on the computer) for the first 40K miles has been 19.5 mpg. I get as much as 22.5 mpg cruising down the freeway @ 68 mph. The same truck with the 5.7L Hemi V-8 (the only gas engine option in the 1-Ton truck) gets 12 mpg (empty/unloaded) on the Hwy, and <9 mpg average commuting. For arguments sake, lets call it 8.5 mpg average commuting.
Now, and based on the gasoline being approximately $.30/gallon less than diesel, let us compute what it cost me to drive that 40,000 miles with my 5.9L I-6 Cummins versus what it would have cost the unfortunate owner of 5.7L Hemi V-8. All of the numbers I use are static, and assume that the price per gallon difference between gas and diesel stays the same.
40,000 miles divided by 8.5 mpg = 4705.88 gallons of gasoline
40,000 miles divided by 19.5 mpg = 2051.28 gallons of diesel
4705.88 gallons x $2.50/gal = $11,764.70
2051.28 gallons x $2.80/gal = $5,743.58
The difference is a whopping $6,021.12 in just the first 40K miles (two years of driving for me). If you compute it out to the 500K mile mark, the difference in fuel costs is an enormous $75,264.00 (the approximate cost of two entirely new trucks)[:0][:0][:0].
Now, to address the maintenance costs...
For the Cummins diesel engine, the recommeded oil change interval is 15K miles on Schedule A, or 7.5K miles on Schedule B (rough or harsh duty use). I have mine changed every 6K regardless. When I owned a gas powered truck, I had the oil changed every 3K miles (I am very diligent with my oil changes frequency). Conclusion... I have cut my oil change frequency in half. The only other maintenance required is a fuel filter change once a year, and the air filter went 25K miles before it indicated that it needed changing. Other than oil and filters, there has been no other maintenance required or needed. I add one bottle of Stanadyne ($6.00) to my fuel once every 6K miles (right after the oil change). Total cost for the fuel additive per year is <$20.00, and it greatly reduces the injector maintenance problems. To my way of thinking, it is much better to spend the $20 per year on an additive versus spending a few thousand $$$$ for a new injector pump and injectors maintenance.
I have been told (and seen) that the 5.9L I-6 Cummins engine will easily reach the 500,000 mile mark with no problems, and if properly cared for, 1,000,000 miles is not out of the question. At my present rate of 20K per year, it will take me (25) years to hit the 500K mark on the odometer.
I will never own a gasoline powered truck again[:0][^]0 -
Bert I don't see the same figures ...
My F250 does 13.5 average. 15,000 miles a year will do 1111gal of gas
at $2.50 = $2777 yr.
The Cummins will average 19.5 for 15k or 769 gal of diesel
at $3.00 gal in SC. It is at least .50 a gallon higher than gas Plus the additive. For a total of $2307 plus the additive which in all fairness is 3 cents a gallon more. I have used MM Oil and added every tank. Your $20 bucks is fairly correct. Total $2327
Or about $450 yr. difference. What you failed to mention was the cost of the Cummins as an option on the truck. What is it ? around $6000 more than the gasser?
I realize the gasser will not do the mileage a diesel will but most people trade in for a newer truck.0 -
You really dont need the additives, unless it is for anti-gelling in cold climates. Yes with regular maintenance the cummins should be good for 400000 miles. We had a truck stop in one day with 1.5 million miles on it. Original engine, 3 trans and the only thing ever done on engine was at 150000 miles the valve lash was adjusted. They were a older couple that Uses the truck to deliver campers coast to coast. I have seen many cummins powered dodges in the 300000 plus mileage still running great. Just gotta keep the fluids, filters changed as scheduled. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by select-fire
Bert I don't see the same figures ...
My F250 does 13.5 average. 15,000 miles a year will do 1111gal of gas
at $2.50 = $2777 yr.
The Cummins will average 19.5 for 15k or 769 gal of diesel
at $3.00 gal in SC. It is at least .50 a gallon higher than gas Plus the additive. For a total of $2307 plus the additive which in all fairness is 3 cents a gallon more. I have used MM Oil and added every tank. Your $20 bucks is fairly correct. Total $2327
Or about $450 yr. difference. What you failed to mention was the cost of the Cummins as an option on the truck. What is it ? around $6000 more than the gasser?
I realize the gasser will not do the mileage a diesel will but most people trade in for a newer truck.
You can not accurately compare your lightweight F250 truck to my Ram 3500 for fuel economy. Now, if you owned a 4x4 F350 4-door with an 8' box, then we might be getting closer. As for the difference in miles driven per year, that is an individual factor the each perspective truck buyer must consider. The fact remains, that I do drive 20K miles per year, and even using your figures, my savings would $607 per year.
Now, and this is a regional factor, there isn't a .50 cent per gallon difference in gas versus diesel here on the west coast. Right at the moment, the Shell station where I buy my fuel is actually less than .30 cents a gallon difference ($2.329 for regular gas, and $2.599 for diesel), so my current savings is even greater than my previous projection.
The added cost of the Cummins engine is $5500 (or was when I bought my truck) so yes, it is a factor to be considered. However, I believe that your logic is flawed in that "most people trade in for a newer truck". What difference in your favor would that make? You trade in for a newer gas truck, I trade in for a newer diesel truck... the same difference in fuel economy still applies, and most importantly, when we do trade in our trucks after say three years or so, my diesel powered truck has retained a lot more of its retail value than your gas powered truck has[^].
One other thing that you did not address, is the added maintenance costs involved with a gas engine. From my experience, it is more costly on a yearly basis to maintain a gas powered engine... in addition to the 2X frequent oil change & filters, you have a bunch of ignition components, and a host of other gizmos and gadgets that make a gas engine run correctly that are not present on a diesel engine (e.g. I have no distributor, coil, spark plugs & wires, and everything else associated with running them). There is really no such thing as a "tune-up" for a Cummins diesel engine.0 -
dad has a can of that MM oil around somewhere all the time .. so it must be good 0 -
quote:Originally posted by strokn47265
You really dont need the additives, unless it is for anti-gelling in cold climates. Yes with regular maintenance the cummins should be good for 400000 miles. We had a truck stop in one day with 1.5 million miles on it. Original engine, 3 trans and the only thing ever done on engine was at 150000 miles the valve lash was adjusted. They were a older couple that Uses the truck to deliver campers coast to coast. I have seen many cummins powered dodges in the 300000 plus mileage still running great. Just gotta keep the fluids, filters changed as scheduled.
I, and most of the Dodge service people will disagree with you. Most of the people who own a Cummins powered Dodge truck never work them like they should (myself included). According to the Tech Bulletins, the most frequent problem see by service departments is rough running (idling) and reduced fuel economy caused by "coking" of the injectors. This is caused by two things; (1) short trips (a.k.a. being driven as a "grocery getter" as my mechanic puts it) which does not allow the engine to come up to full operating temp, and (2) prolonged running at very minimal loads on the engine (running down the freeway with no load in the truck or behind it). One of the statistics that can be checked and read by a service technician is the % of load versus run time. Dodge has found that most Cummins owners never exceed more than 40% loading on their engines, and that 98% of the time, there is 0% loading in the 80 - 100% range. This does cause injectors to get dirty and not operate as efficiently as they should. The fuel additive I use (recommended by Dodge) helps to prevent "coking" of the injectors.0 -
Bert, right now diesel is 2.69 and gas is $1.83 here. Granted your diesel will pull more but don't underestimate my SuperDuty F-250. Actually the Frames on 250's and 350's are pretty much the same. Suspension wise your 350 is pretty close to a 250 cause you aren't a duelly. Throw the outside tires on your truck and the load capacity in the bed is greater. I never actually understood why someone would buy a one ton truck with single tires on the rear. Most everyone who knows trucks knows 1/2 ton trucks are in the 5-6K pound range. My Chevy HD 3/4 ton was 9200 and the Ford is 8850. Look at your sticker I believe it should read around 10K. If a Duelly it would read more. You may have one more leaf spring in the rears..
Frankly I highly doubt I ever own another diesel after my fiasco Bosch injector pump went out after warranty had expired. Just wait till you get to buy a transfer pump and injector pump and don't give me they last forever.. By the way oil changes in my Ford are 7,500 mile per owners manual. I change every 5K0 -
quote:Originally posted by select-fire
Bert, right now diesel is 2.69 and gas is $1.83 here. Granted your diesel will pull more but don't underestimate my SuperDuty F-250. Actually the Frames on 250's and 350's are pretty much the same. Suspension wise your 350 is pretty close to a 250 cause you aren't a duelly. Throw the outside tires on your truck and the load capacity in the bed is greater. I never actually understood why someone would buy a one ton truck with single tires on the rear. Most everyone who knows trucks knows 1/2 ton trucks are in the 5-6K pound range. My Chevy HD 3/4 ton was 9200 and the Ford is 8850. Look at your sticker I believe it should read around 10K. If a Duelly it would read more. You may have one more leaf spring in the rears..
Frankly I highly doubt I ever own another diesel after my fiasco Bosch injector pump went out after warranty had expired. Just wait till you get to buy a transfer pump and injector pump and don't give me they last forever.. By the way oil changes in my Ford are 7,500 mile per owners manual. I change every 5K
Aahh... you have a few misconceptions about the Dodge Ram 3500 series trucks!
First, the suspension on my Ram 3500 single-axle is identical to the dually version, and it has the identical 4400 lb bed load capacity.
Second, the rear springs on my truck are identical to the dually and are more beefy than the 2500 series truck. Both styles of the 1-ton Dodge Ram trucks have a full set of extra overload leaf springs (above the main leaf springs). The tires are E load rated Michellins, and are inflated to 65 psi. When I load 2-tons of wood stove pellets in the bed, I inflate them to the recommended 80 psi.
The sticker on my truck actually says 12,200 lbs.
The Schedule "A" oil change frequency for my truck is 15,000 miles, and I know a few fellows who use the high-end synthetic oil (with a particulate sensor) and they run 30K+ miles between oil changes[:0].
It is really quite amazing that fuel costs are so widely different in the various parts of the country, but I suspect it has a lot to do with how each individual states taxes fuel. We in western Washington pay much more for gasoline than you do, but less for the diesel?0 -
quote:Originally posted by Bert H.
quote:Originally posted by select-fire
Bert I don't see the same figures ...
My F250 does 13.5 average. 15,000 miles a year will do 1111gal of gas
at $2.50 = $2777 yr.
The Cummins will average 19.5 for 15k or 769 gal of diesel
at $3.00 gal in SC. It is at least .50 a gallon higher than gas Plus the additive. For a total of $2307 plus the additive which in all fairness is 3 cents a gallon more. I have used MM Oil and added every tank. Your $20 bucks is fairly correct. Total $2327
Or about $450 yr. difference. What you failed to mention was the cost of the Cummins as an option on the truck. What is it ? around $6000 more than the gasser?
I realize the gasser will not do the mileage a diesel will but most people trade in for a newer truck.
You can not accurately compare your lightweight F250 truck to my Ram 3500 for fuel economy. Now, if you owned a 4x4 F350 4-door with an 8' box, then we might be getting closer. As for the difference in miles driven per year, that is an individual factor the each perspective truck buyer must consider. The fact remains, that I do drive 20K miles per year, and even using your figures, my savings would $607 per year.
Now, and this is a regional factor, there isn't a .50 cent per gallon difference in gas versus diesel here on the west coast. Right at the moment, the Shell station where I buy my fuel is actually less than .30 cents a gallon difference ($2.329 for regular gas, and $2.599 for diesel), so my current savings is even greater than my previous projection.
The added cost of the Cummins engine is $5500 (or was when I bought my truck) so yes, it is a factor to be considered. However, I believe that your logic is flawed in that "most people trade in for a newer truck". What difference in your favor would that make? You trade in for a newer gas truck, I trade in for a newer diesel truck... the same difference in fuel economy still applies, and most importantly, when we do trade in our trucks after say three years or so, my truck diesel powered truck has retained a lot more of its retail value than your gas powered truck has[^].
One other thing that you did not address, is the added maintenance costs involved with a gas engine. From my experience, it is more costly on a yearly basis to maintain a gas powered engine... in addition to the 2X frequent oil change & filters, you have a bunch of ignition components, and a host of other gizmos and gadgets that make a gas engine run correctly that are not present on a diesel engine (e.g. I have no distributor, coil, spark plugs & wires, and everything else associated with running them). There is really no such thing as a "tune-up" for a Cummins diesel engine.
Bert H.
I use the FS 2500 bypass oil filter system on my 2000 cummins. Change filters every 10,000 miles. Truck has 181,000 on it now and keeps runnin' better. Oil is DELVAC 1 Synthetic, changed about every 80,000 miles or so. Oil is sent out every filter change for checking. It comes back as a new motor.
Old 500 PPM sulphur fuel gave 22.5 on the highway. The new stuff is about 2 MPG less.
I had tranny done this last Friday oil and pan were clean and looked fine. Had valve body put in for better shifting performance. Was told the VP44 fuel pump was a weak link but it will go at least 500,000 miles.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Bert H.
quote:Originally posted by select-fire
Bert, right now diesel is 2.69 and gas is $1.83 here. Granted your diesel will pull more but don't underestimate my SuperDuty F-250. Actually the Frames on 250's and 350's are pretty much the same. Suspension wise your 350 is pretty close to a 250 cause you aren't a duelly. Throw the outside tires on your truck and the load capacity in the bed is greater. I never actually understood why someone would buy a one ton truck with single tires on the rear. Most everyone who knows trucks knows 1/2 ton trucks are in the 5-6K pound range. My Chevy HD 3/4 ton was 9200 and the Ford is 8850. Look at your sticker I believe it should read around 10K. If a Duelly it would read more. You may have one more leaf spring in the rears..
Frankly I highly doubt I ever own another diesel after my fiasco Bosch injector pump went out after warranty had expired. Just wait till you get to buy a transfer pump and injector pump and don't give me they last forever.. By the way oil changes in my Ford are 7,500 mile per owners manual. I change every 5K
Aahh... you have a few misconceptions about the Dodge Ram 3500 series trucks!
First, the suspension on my Ram 3500 single-axle is identical to the dually version, and it has the identical 4400 lb bed load capacity.
Second, the rear springs on my truck are identical to the dually and are more beefy than the 2500 series truck. Both styles of the 1-ton Dodge Ram trucks have a full set of extra overload leaf springs (above the main leaf springs). The tires are E load rated Michellins, and are inflated to 65 psi. When I load 2-tons of wood stove pellets in the bed, I inflate them to the recommended 80 psi.
The sticker on my truck actually says 12,200 lbs.
The Schedule "A" oil change frequency for my truck is 15,000 miles, and I know a few fellows who use the high-end synthetic oil (with a particulate sensor) and they run 30K+ miles between oil changes[:0].
It is really quite amazing that fuel costs are so widely different in the various parts of the country, but I suspect it has a lot to do with how each individual states taxes fuel. We in western Washington pay much more for gasoline than you do, but less for the diesel?
Well look like Dodge has raised their limits. Mine was 10,000 on my 99 dueley. Of course some of the bed limit is given up with the 4wd. I need my 4wd and won't buy anything else. I believe a 3/4 ton 2 wd would have about the same load capacity as your one ton. Mine is at 37OO #. Not bad for a Ford. Diesel around here is expensive.0 -
quote:Originally posted by bpost1958
Bert H.
I use the FS 2500 bypass oil filter system on my 2000 cummins. Change filters every 10,000 miles. Truck has 181,000 on it now and keeps runnin' better. Oil is DELVAC 1 Synthetic, changed about every 80,000 miles or so. Oil is sent out every filter change for checking. It comes back as a new motor.
Old 500 PPM sulphur fuel gave 22.5 on the highway. The new stuff is about 2 MPG less.
I had tranny done this last Friday oil and pan were clean and looked fine. Had valve body put in for better shifting performance. Was told the VP44 fuel pump was a weak link but it will go at least 500,000 miles.
Very interesting on the length of time you can run on the synthetic oil. I have thought about using it, but then decided that I prefer to take my truck into the dealer for the oil change and inspection service every 6,000 miles. They rotate my tires for free, and conduct a complete under hood and under carriage inspection as well as change the oil & filter all for a whopping $39.99 (and they give me a free car wash voucher too[^]).
The 2004.5 and newer Cummins 5.9L I-6 (600 series) engines are much less affected by the new ULSD fuel (<15 PPM sulfur), and I believe that they were engineered with the ULSD fuel in mind. I lost very little of my fuel economy when the new ULSD replaced the older LSD (500 PPM) fuel last summer.
There is a big difference in the fuel delivery system on your Cummins engine versus the one used in mine. strokn47265 can probably explain it better than I can, but I believe that part of it is higher initial (idle) torque, and how quickly it hits peak torque (610 ft lb @1600 rpm).0 -
Thanks BertH for the diesel lesson. I do like the Dodge Cummins version a lot. I suspect a two year old vehicle might cut some depreciation off that high initial cost spread. I had no idea they got those kinds of mpg figures since they weigh close to 6-8,000 lbs. 0 -
I have to agree with Bert on the diesel vs gas. Owning both a gas 97 Chevy dully with 454 and a 03 Dodge dually with the 5.9HO.
The 454 I got 9 mpg, with a tow rating of 10,300. The Cummins gets 22 with a tow rating or 15,900. Within in 135,000 miles the 454 has had a new motor, fuel pump, front end rebuilt, heater core and blower, front universal joint, radiator all this to a tune of almost 8500. Lets face it when you get into big trucks gas or diesel it's all expensive.
The Cummins with 75,000 miles has have to have a new main drive shaft twice and the drivers window came of the clips holding it and the CD player had to be replace. All cost less than 1000 dollars.
Add to that I was spending over 600 a month on gas vs 200-240 on diesel. The money I'm saving on fuel is making my payment!!!
But I agree with Select-fire if you don't drive much and plan to trade in offend then a gas engine would be the way to go.
If you want to talk real bargarns my Vibe gets 34 mpg and in 34000 miles has had to have nothing ,but regular maintance.0 -
Bert, I did a little research on Kelly Blue Book. On a 2003 Dodge 3/4 with a Cummins identical options on both trucks... Cummins was $20855 Gasser was $15,100 with a difference of $5755. 2003 Ford was $21230 Gasser was $16200 with identical equipment. Difference of $5030. You gotta pay more to get the diesel but the return is somewhat the same on resale. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by sig232
Thanks BertH for the diesel lesson. I do like the Dodge Cummins version a lot. I suspect a two year old vehicle might cut some depreciation off that high initial cost spread. I had no idea they got those kinds of mpg figures since they weigh close to 6-8,000 lbs.
You are quite welcome. As I mentioned before, I love my Cummins, and will never own a gas powered truck again.
If you decide to buy a Dodge Cummins truck, go to Dave Smith Motors in Kellog Idaho... they will fly you into Spokane, WA, pick you up at the airport, drive you to Kellogg (about a 1:15 minute drive), and reimburse your flight cost up to $250. You will pay $500 over actual cost (not the bullcrap sticker or MSRP). In December of 2005 I paid $34,526 out the door for my Ram 3500 4x4 SLT Quad Cab 8' box. I ordered it with the following extras... Linex spray in bed liner, full length stainless steel tube step-up rail, mud flaps on all four corners, front tow hooks, overhead clearance lights, sliding rear window, and a chrome bug/rock guard. There is very little depreciation when you drive one off the lot, and I highly recommend Dave Smith Motors to anyone considering buying either a Dodge or Chevy/GMC truck.0
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