Mall Shooter-What would you do-
-if you saw that happening and were carrying. Knowing that you were probably breaking the law, at least where I live even if you have a CCW, any business can post no concealed weapons signs and most do here. Would you try to stop the shooter, if you were in position to do so? I am sure if you were about to be one of his victims you would act, I would. But if you were in the clear, would you try to stop him? It seems this could happen anywhere anytime these days. Its something to think about. Having spent half my life in law enforcement, it has been my habit to think about this sort of thing all the time. When I go into a restaurant I try to sit in a position where I can see most of the area, try to not put my back to the door, scan those around for suspicious actions, etc. Its a sad situation when you have to consider that you could save a life and then become a criminal yourself. CCW is practically useless in NC, where you can't carry in the most likely places you need to, banks, any place that posts a sign, public gatherings, schools, gov. buildings, places that serve alcohol, etc. Not much left. Most people just break the law and take their chances. When CCW was passed, the AG opinion was that places not prohibited by the original bill couldn't post signs to prevent it, but the Democrats changed that. Watch now for most all CCW states to ban it from malls, if they haven't already. I know its not a fair question, you can't know what you will do until it happens. I just think people like us who are probably heeled should think about it. So would you shoot and take your chances, shoot and try to slip away? What?
0
-
I would run for cover and get out of the mall ASAP! Im not a policeman, I would call the cops. 0 -
IF I was close to him and had a good shot, i would probably try to take him out! more than likly the law would go litely on you, and probably all charges would be droped.. 0 -
I don't have a permit, so I never carry.
However, if I was carrying, legally or illegally, I don't see how I could NOT TRY to act. It's kind of like: would you have slit Hitler's infant throat if you had the chance? Of course you would.
And then the legal system runs its course.
All that assumes that I have a shot. If I'm unarmed and there's a gunman somewhere else in the mall.....I'm not dumb. I'm going to find a dark corner or close exit!0 -
I'll never know unless I'm in that situation.
If I had a clear shot or could get a clear shot, with minimal risk of an innocent person getting hurt, I'd definitely take it.
The difference between me stopping the perp and the cops setting up and taking him down could be a few lives.
I'm willing to risk my life to stop him than have others die because I didn't try.0 -
If I had a clear shot, I would have tried to take it (or at least I like to think I would have - who knows?).
But I'm pretty confident in saying that if I did not have a clear shot or was too far away that I would have made for the nearest exit with my loved ones.0 -
If you had the drop on the guy and an appropriate weapon it would be regrettable to do nothing. After all, he is attempting to murder several people.
It is also regrettable that you live in a state that doesn't trust it's citizens. [V]very sad0 -
Report on this one was pretty specific - Police got a 911 call, arrived SIX MINUTES later, by which time it was all over.
I'm near him, I'd make an effort to take him out. No long or difficult shots, not into a populated backstop. I would have to be in a spot where I could see clearly that he was shooting unarmed/random civilians, that I was shooting into the ceiling or walls if I missed. That might give him three or more shots before I responded. I would try to shoot from cover.0 -
Iam always armed at the mall. I would go after him and stop him as quickly as possible. 0 -
What would I do? I would unleash all of my ninja powers and moves on the perp, he wouldn't know what hit'im.
C'mon, srsly, this is the same type of question as "when did you stop beating your wife?".0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
What would I do? I would unleash all of my ninja powers and moves on the perp, he wouldn't know what hit'im.
C'mon, srsly, this is the same type of question as "when did you stop beating your wife?".
"When did you stop beating your wife?"?
Wow...that's a new one to me. It's pretty pithy, but I'm still trying to get my head around just what it means!0 -
hard ????
i would hope to do the correct thing
i always carry were i can, try not to shop were i cant [:(!].
if i was close enough to make a difference i would have to take the shots (prob M T the gun). one thing for sure while he was messing with me he would be leaving others alone, could bide for some time till the law got there or The BAD guy could think for a minute, (HAY THERE SHOOTING BACK AT ME, I'D BETTER HURRY AND KILL MY SELF NOW)
this said ,it would have to be the worst day of my life [:(][:(][:(]0 -
he had a rifle. with a ccw, I would have had a pistol. it would have been a very dumb thing to try to take that on.
anyways, since I would have been "not allowed" to take my CCW peice with me into the shopping mall, I really think I would have let them have it their way; I'm not going to pop up like frikkin' superman and say "ya! I broke your rules, I brought my peice anyways, I'm here to save your asses!" nope. sorry. that's what they want, that's what they get.
I'd have my pistol ready, and use it to get me and mine out of there. as soon as we're out of the danger zone it goes back into concealment and we get as far away from that place as possible.
and I'll bet, that's exactly what happened there with a few people.0 -
chevelle427 has a good point though. with a handgun, you could stay far enough away to shoot at him (you probbaly won't hit him) to force him to take cover, that gives other people time to flee. when your mag is empty run like hell. ...if that's what you want to do. 0 -
The Golden Rule is the rule to look to here. You know the "do unto others thingy that Jesus laid down...
So here is how I look at it, If that were my loved ones being shot at and you were there with a gun, I would have you risk your life to save them...Frankly, I expect it of you!!! Therefore, feeling as I do I am pretty much obligated to fire until I'm either out of ammo or until I or he is dead!!!
As far as being worried about going to prison for getting involved, I can't see that being a reality, but even if it is, it would be better than looking into a mothers eyes and having her know that her child is gone cause I showed yellow!!! Hell, I rather be dead myself than face that...If running is the right thing to do, then I am too big a coward to do the right thing!!!0 -
i bet about 35-40 years ago this [?] would have not been needed to be asked .someone (right or wrong, strong or weak) would just have done something.
how things change in a short time.
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
/
of course this most likely would not have been a problem 35-40 years ago
/
/
/
most people valued LIFE more back then.0 -
I live in NC. I am not aware of the malls having any prohibition on carrying. I really only ever go to one called Triangle Town Center and I have not seen any signs on any of the doors I entered. I always look too for the purpose of not taking my business to such places.
I am not sure what the policy is in the Westroads Mall in Omaha. In NC you are allowed to protect your own or another's life. Duty to retreat is also part of it. Given this guy was threatening the lives of so many that were not able to retreat, that obligation was nullified. I do not think that running down the hallway of the mall to get to the store so you could get a shot off at this piece of excrement would be allowed but if you were within range and could get a shot off you would be within the law. I bet those people who have holes in them sure wish someone had been able to do such a thing. The cops who taught the CCW class I took said that 8 minutes it took for the uniforms to arrive is exactly why citizens should carry.0 -
I don't do to malls. Haven't only been to a mall once in the past few years.
If I was ANYWHERE and this happened I would try to stop the guy with any available weapon, Colt 1911 being the weapon of choice.0 -
quote:Mall Shooter-What would you do-
After I took cover I would shoot him. I don't carry my weapon for any nebulus reason. I carry to eliminate a threat to good people, my family in particular. No ambiguity allowed.0 -
Without seeing the lay of the land, it's hard to establish a good tactic.
If one could position oneself behind the shooter, and get in close, one could shoot him in the back of the head.
If that isn't possible, perhaps one could find solid cover and concealment and shoot or shoot at the shooter. It would take him a few seconds to figure out where the rounds were coming from, but he would know he was being fired on. Maybe even if one's rounds didn't kill the shooter, he might become discouraged and shoot himself.
The last option is the least desirable. If one were caught in the wide open, with no cover, in the shooter's field of fire, with oneself and one's loved ones in harm's way, one might have to just stand and fight it out, hoping for the best.
One would have a small element of surprise in any case The shooter probably thinks he is the only person at the mall with a gun, and it would surprise/alarm/frighten him to meet armed resistance. He would have to react to your action, and action usually beats reaction.
If one tried, and failed, to stop the shooter, one would deserve an eloquent epitaph. Not everyone has the opportunity to die in such an honorable manner. My children are grown, I am old, and I am ready to see what lies beyond this plane of existence. To die fighting evil would be preferable to dying a lingering death hooked up to tubes and in pain.
Jesus said something like: "Greater love has no man than to lay down his life for his friends."
I would like to think that I have the courage to do the right thing. I could be wrong, but I would like to think that.0 -
well I was an Army photographer... so I usually have a camera with me. 0 -
Originally posted by chaoslodge
I live in NC. I am not aware of the malls having any prohibition on carrying. I really only ever go to one called Triangle Town Center and I have not seen any signs on any of the doors I entered. I always look too for the purpose of not taking my business to such places.
Sorry, my friend, TTC does prohibit firearms except for certified LEOs. So take care if you go there armed. Also don't take your fly rod, they also ban fishing. I don't know of any malls in the area that allows civilians to carry firearms.0 -
Please take the time to re-read this post.
Sums it up pretty neatly.
The only thing being..in the open..going prone may well give you the edge needed to win. Stops your mobility..but harder to hit, also..and steadying your own aim.
The temptation to walk away would be strong.."Let 'em suffer what hell they wrought, with their insane laws"..but when people are dying, and you have the means to stop it...welll.
quote:nunn
Administrator
USA
15653 Posts
Posted - 12/06/2007 : 10:29:45 AM
Without seeing the lay of the land, it's hard to establish a good tactic.
If one could position oneself behind the shooter, and get in close, one could shoot him in the back of the head.
If that isn't possible, perhaps one could find solid cover and concealment and shoot or shoot at the shooter. It would take him a few seconds to figure out where the rounds were coming from, but he would know he was being fired on. Maybe even if one's rounds didn't kill the shooter, he might become discouraged and shoot himself.
The last option is the least desirable. If one were caught in the wide open, with no cover, in the shooter's field of fire, with oneself and one's loved ones in harm's way, one might have to just stand and fight it out, hoping for the best.
One would have a small element of surprise in any case The shooter probably thinks he is the only person at the mall with a gun, and it would surprise/alarm/frighten him to meet armed resistance. He would have to react to your action, and action usually beats reaction.
If one tried, and failed, to stop the shooter, one would deserve an eloquent epitaph. Not everyone has the opportunity to die in such an honorable manner. My children are grown, I am old, and I am ready to see what lies beyond this plane of existence. To die fighting evil would be preferable to dying a lingering death hooked up to tubes and in pain.
Jesus said something like: "Greater love has no man than to lay down his life for his friends."
I would like to think that I have the courage to do the right thing. I could be wrong, but I would like to think that.0 -
My motto "if someone tries to kill you, you try and kill them right back" 0 -
Who said it? I don't know, but it is a good motto:
"Better to die on your feet than to live on your knees."0 -
This is not advice or a suggestion, only one man's decision and I was a cop for 11 years. We have license to carry in Missouri, I am licensed, and I have carried in a grocery store that prohibits such practices. First of all, it is concealed and no one would ever know. Second, according to my attorney:
You are not violating law, only the preferences of the property owner. The worst crimes I have committed is trespass and can be asked to leave and not return. Second, in the mall, I would take him down. If I am charged, I want a jury trial to explain why I chose to ignore the mall prohibition in order to save many lives and stop the rampage. There is never a guarantee, but just maybe, the jury will recognize that the life saved could have been their own. Again, this is me. If you don't agree I have no problem with that. A man's got to know his limitations.0 -
Depends on the exact situation at that exact time. If close enough and no escape possible, one would be inclined to take a shot or shots. If you saw people being murdered and was in a position to do so, the inclination would be to try and stop it. If you had your wife and/or children with you, the inclination would be get them to safety. IMHO 0 -
would depend entirely on the situation!
. am i with family/friends
. if i act would it put them in danger
. are they in any imminent danger(is the shooter nearby or at the other end of the mall)
. what are the concealed carry laws (do i have to be in imminent threat or can i act in defense of others)
. Are the police already on the scene (if so it is their job not mine)0 -
if I would have a rifle on me, entirely different situation. the dude would be meat waffles in no time. I don't care what whoever else would say afterwards. 0 -
"Sorry, my friend, TTC does prohibit firearms except for certified LEOs. So take care if you go there armed. Also don't take your fly rod, they also ban fishing. I don't know of any malls in the area that allows civilians to carry firearms."
Well it sure is not placarded very well. I suppose I rarely enter through the mall entrances. I went in through the Macy's entrance this past weekend and there was no sign I could see. Same with the B&N sign.
Other than the B&N I am rarely there anyhow.
Thanks for the heads up.0 -
Well he had an SKS suposedly with the fixed 10 round mag. Some witnesses even sais they heard 8-10 shots and then silence and a few seconds later more shots. So- if I was there and armed I would wait for him to reload his rifle. Figure he is not an ex-military guy and his reload would take a few seconds. Even longer if he was not using stripper clips. Could probably take him alive that way- draw down on him while he is reloading and make him surrender. Fortunately for the tax-payers he took his own life. 0
Please sign in to leave a comment.
Comments
60 comments