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Am I a wus?

thallman
Hey y'all,

I was out sighting in the Win. M-94 today and really got a chance to fire her more than a couple rounds. 21 rds to be precise. I was not using a recoil pad because everyone I've talked to says the 94's recoil is "mild!" Well, I feel like trading in my shoulder right now. :) I was using Federal ammunition.

Can anyone else whos shot the Model 94 confirm this strong recoil? I have a M-12 12ga Win coming in soon and can't wait to fire that (expecting a heck of a lot of recoil) but I didn't expect this from the Win .30/30...
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Comments

56 comments

Date Votes
  • MVP
    quote:Am I a wus?
    Yes
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  • MVP
    Just kidding Thallman.
    Remember... I do that once in a while[:o)]
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  • dan kelly
    maybe you wer`nt holding it tight enough against your shoulder or maybe you had something wrong with your shoulder but the recoil agravated it...i`ve never noticed the recoil from mine before, only thing that annoys me with it is the noise, scares all the game away and have to walk 2 miles before i see anything else to shoot.
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  • Nighthawk
    To be polite I wouldnt say your a wus as were all different. Next time use a recoil pad.
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  • David Nunn
    I thought the Winchester 94 had surprisingly stout recoil when I shot one.
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  • thallman
    quote:Originally posted by dan kelly
    maybe you wer`nt holding it tight enough against your shoulder...

    I kept telling myself to hold it tight to the shoulder, but after about 4-5 shots, with increasing pain, I started to delvelop a flinch that I really had to watch.

    quote:Originally posted by dan kelly
    or maybe you had something wrong with your shoulder...

    I do now -hehehe

    Now...I am 6ft 1in tall and weigh roughly 136lbs (a distance runner thing) so not having much fat around the shoulders doesn't help...
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  • bull300wsm
    quote:Originally posted by nunn
    I thought the Winchester 94 had surprisingly stout recoil when I shot one.


    +1..had one years ago and I thought it kicked like a mule...course back then I weighed a buck25, I wondered how we ever beat the Indians (no offense) with those..[8D]
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  • stevenrayspeck
    How long have you been shooting[?] How many rounds a day do you shoot[?] Do you have any compatition shooting backround[?] Does the gun fit you[?]

    The answers to these questions will greatly determine how much recoil a shooter is feeling.

    As for me, I have been shooting ever since i was 4, When i was seriously into compatition i would shoot ATLEAST 1,000 rounds every day(Although now i don't shoot near that much), i have a lot of compatition shooting backround, And yes my guns fit me.

    So for me, Shooting my 94 isn't realy a problem, Can put hundreds of rounds through it in a day if i wanted to.

    BUT, Before i started compatition shooting, I hadn't learned a lot about shooting form, Gun fit, and just hadn't put that many rounds down range yet. So a 30/30 would kick the Sh$$ out of me[B)]

    My point is, Do to many MANY different factors involved, Everyone will rate the recoil of the SAME rifle/shotgun/handgun differently.

    My recoil rating of a model 94 in 30/30 is...... Mild
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  • sarge_3ad
    quote:Originally posted by thallman
    quote:Originally posted by dan kelly
    maybe you wer`nt holding it tight enough against your shoulder...

    I kept telling myself to hold it tight to the shoulder, but after about 4-5 shots, with increasing pain, I started to delvelop a flinch that I really had to watch.

    quote:Originally posted by dan kelly
    or maybe you had something wrong with your shoulder...

    I do now -hehehe

    Now...I am 6ft 1in tall and weigh roughly 136lbs (a distance runner thing) so not having much fat around the shoulders doesn't help...


    I have plenty of blubber to spare. I would loan to you, but I just as soon not get it back.
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  • thallman
    quote:Originally posted by stevenrayspeck
    How long have you been shooting[?] How many rounds a day do you shoot[?] Do you have any compatition shooting backround[?] Does the gun fit you[?]

    The answers to these questions will greatly determine how much recoil a shooter is feeling.

    As for me, I have been shooting ever since i was 4, When i was seriously into compatition i would shoot ATLEAST 1,000 rounds every day(Although now i don't shoot near that much), i have a lot of compatition shooting backround, And yes my guns fit me.

    So for me, Shooting my 94 isn't realy a problem, Can put hundreds of rounds through it in a day if i wanted to.

    BUT, Before i started compatition shooting, I hadn't learned a lot about shooting form, Gun fit, and just hadn't put that many rounds down range yet. So a 30/30 would kick the Sh$$ out of me[B)]

    My point is, Do to many MANY different factors involved, Everyone will rate the recoil of the SAME rifle/shotgun/handgun differently.

    My recoil rating of a model 94 in 30/30 is...... Mild




    Good answer, thank you.

    How long have you been shooting[?] About one month :)
    How many rounds a day do you shoot[?] about 1-2 times a week
    Do you have any compatition shooting backround[?] no
    Does the gun fit you[?] I'm not sure. It feels good.

    I'm a newbie (and lightweight--tall and lanky at that!) so I'm sure I need to get adjusted. I have a .22 Henry Golden Boy that I use more often because it's more afordable and I think it teaches a person how to shoot and learn proper tech first. I bought the Win M-94 b/c it was always my dream gun, I just wasn't expecting this much recoil!
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  • daveald
    After reading stevenrayspeck's reply I got nothing left to say.
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  • stevenrayspeck
    quote:Originally posted by thallman
    quote:Originally posted by stevenrayspeck
    How long have you been shooting[?] How many rounds a day do you shoot[?] Do you have any compatition shooting backround[?] Does the gun fit you[?]

    The answers to these questions will greatly determine how much recoil a shooter is feeling.

    As for me, I have been shooting ever since i was 4, When i was seriously into compatition i would shoot ATLEAST 1,000 rounds every day(Although now i don't shoot near that much), i have a lot of compatition shooting backround, And yes my guns fit me.

    So for me, Shooting my 94 isn't realy a problem, Can put hundreds of rounds through it in a day if i wanted to.

    BUT, Before i started compatition shooting, I hadn't learned a lot about shooting form, Gun fit, and just hadn't put that many rounds down range yet. So a 30/30 would kick the Sh$$ out of me[B)]

    My point is, Do to many MANY different factors involved, Everyone will rate the recoil of the SAME rifle/shotgun/handgun differently.

    My recoil rating of a model 94 in 30/30 is...... Mild




    Good answer, thank you.

    How long have you been shooting[?] About one month :)
    How many rounds a day do you shoot[?] about 1-2 times a week
    Do you have any compatition shooting backround[?] no
    Does the gun fit you[?] I'm not sure. It feels good.

    I'm a newbie (and lightweight--tall and lanky at that!) so I'm sure I need to get adjusted. I have a .22 Henry Golden Boy that I use more often because it's more afordable and I think it teaches a person how to shoot and learn proper tech first. I bought the Win M-94 b/c it was always my dream gun, I just wasn't expecting this much recoil!




    Ok, After reading how tall you are i would be willing to bet that this is a gun fit issue.

    You probably have longer arms and the model 94 is a short LOP(length of pull) gun.

    Here is a easy and farely accurate way to measure your LOP,
    Put your elbow flat on a table with your arm and your trigger finger pointed straight up in the air.

    With your other hand, take a tape measure and measure from the bend in your elbow to the very top of your trigger finger.

    Normal LOP is betwean 13 1/2''-- 14 1/2''

    I've seen longer LOPs than this and i have seen shorter ones, Its different from one person to the next.

    The LOP on a model 94 is almost exactly 13'', Which means that it is to short of a rifle for most of the shooters out there.

    And believe me, Guns that are to short kick a LOT!!!

    Measure your LOP, Then take the gun to a gunsmith and have him make the gun longer to match your LOP.
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  • fishkiller41
    YES! Actually, you may want to have a GENDER test done.
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  • thallman
    quote:Originally posted by stevenrayspeck
    Here is a easy and farely accurate way to measure your LOP,
    Put your elbow flat on a table with your arm and your trigger finger pointed straight up in the air.

    With your other hand, take a tape measure and measure from the bend in your elbow to the very top of your trigger finger.

    Normal LOP is betwean 13 1/2''-- 14 1/2''

    I've seen longer LOPs than this and i have seen shorter ones, Its different from one person to the next.

    The LOP on a model 94 is almost exactly 13'', Which means that it is to short of a rifle for most of the shooters out there.

    And believe me, Guns that are to short kick a LOT!!!

    Measure your LOP, Then take the gun to a gunsmith and have him make the gun longer to match your LOP.



    When you say measure from the bend in your elbow to the top of the trigger finger you mean from the inside crevase of my arm, not from the table up, right?

    Here is what I measured.

    From the table to the tip of my finger: 18.4in
    From the inside crease of my elbow (elbow pit?!?! :P ) to the top of my trigget finger: 15.25in
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  • grumpygy
    Wus no. Twig yes put some meat on those bones, lucky it didn't knock you over being such a light weight.[:D]
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  • stevenrayspeck
    quote:Originally posted by thallman
    quote:Originally posted by stevenrayspeck
    Here is a easy and farely accurate way to measure your LOP,
    Put your elbow flat on a table with your arm and your trigger finger pointed straight up in the air.

    With your other hand, take a tape measure and measure from the bend in your elbow to the very top of your trigger finger.

    Normal LOP is betwean 13 1/2''-- 14 1/2''

    I've seen longer LOPs than this and i have seen shorter ones, Its different from one person to the next.

    The LOP on a model 94 is almost exactly 13'', Which means that it is to short of a rifle for most of the shooters out there.

    And believe me, Guns that are to short kick a LOT!!!

    Measure your LOP, Then take the gun to a gunsmith and have him make the gun longer to match your LOP.



    When you say measure from the bend in your elbow to the top of the trigger finger you mean from the inside crevase of my arm, not from the table up, right?

    Here is what I measured.

    From the table to the tip of my finger: 18.4in
    From the inside crease of my elbow (elbow pit?!?! :P ) to the top of my trigget finger: 15.25in



    LOL, Yes, From the " Elbow pit"... Sorry, my mind went blank as i was typing and couldn't think of a better way to describe it.

    Ok, 15 1/4''.... That means you have realy long arms.

    This also means that your model 94 is 2 1/4 inches too short for you and that is a LOT in the shooting world. this is probably the cause of your exessive recoil[B)]

    Take it to a gunsmith, Have him add a quality butt pad and tell him to make the LOP exactly 15 1/4''...... This should solve a big portition of your recoil problem.

    The rest is just in your shooting form, Which i can't help you with unless i am actualy there[:(]... Sorry[:(]
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  • thallman
    A little off subject, but here is a photo of the results of today's sighting in. This was the first time sighting the Williams FP sights (and my first time ever sighing in sights) I shot 21 rounds total. This was the first time I've really got a chance to shoot the Win 30-30 and I've only been shooting since Dec (a couple months)

    Tell me what you think. Is the spread really bad? The distance was 25yrds in mostly a prone position. The green arrow basically denotes the progression of shots taken in order.

    Thank you all!

    http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff55/justgumpit/CIMG2046.jpg
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  • guns-n-painthorses
    Get yourself a Winchester with a longer barrel. The extra weight will help reduce the kick!

    Them short 94's in 30-30 kick like a mule! God I love 'em!


    Got Guns?
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  • thallman
    quote:Originally posted by stevenrayspeck

    LOL, Yes, From the " Elbow pit"... Sorry, my mind went blank as i was typing and couldn't think of a better way to describe it.

    Ok, 15 1/4''.... That means you have realy long arms.

    This also means that your model 94 is 2 1/4 inches too short for you and that is a LOT in the shooting world. this is probably the cause of your exessive recoil[B)]

    Take it to a gunsmith, Have him add a quality butt pad and tell him to make the LOP exactly 15 1/4''...... This should solve a big portition of your recoil problem.

    The rest is just in your shooting form, Which i can't help you with unless i am actualy there[:(]... Sorry[:(]


    Great. Thank you. I know it will only add an inch or so, but I was thinking about adding a slip on Limbsaver recoil pad if I could find one cheap. I would really like to keep the gun sort of stock, though, the FP sights were highly recommended, I'm not sure if I like them or if I'm really getting the full benefit of it. I have bad eyesight to begin with :/
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  • stevenrayspeck
    quote:Originally posted by thallman
    A little off subject, but here is a photo of the results of today's sighting in. This was the first time sighting the Williams FP sights (and my first time ever sighing in sights) I shot 21 rounds total. This was the first time I've really got a chance to shoot the Win 30-30 and I've only been shooting since Dec (a couple months)

    Tell me what you think. Is the spread really bad? The distance was 25yrds in mostly a prone position. The green arrow basically denotes the progression of shots taken in order.

    Thank you all!

    http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff55/justgumpit/CIMG2046.jpg



    Thats not bad considering how long you have been shooting and the troubles you were having with recoil.

    A week with me though and i would have you shooting groups like that at 100 yards easy[8D]
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  • thallman
    quote:Originally posted by stevenrayspeck

    A week with me though and i would have you shooting groups like that at 100 yards easy[8D]


    I'm not sure I could see that paper target that far without a scope...
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  • stevenrayspeck
    quote:Originally posted by thallman
    quote:Originally posted by stevenrayspeck

    LOL, Yes, From the " Elbow pit"... Sorry, my mind went blank as i was typing and couldn't think of a better way to describe it.

    Ok, 15 1/4''.... That means you have realy long arms.

    This also means that your model 94 is 2 1/4 inches too short for you and that is a LOT in the shooting world. this is probably the cause of your exessive recoil[B)]

    Take it to a gunsmith, Have him add a quality butt pad and tell him to make the LOP exactly 15 1/4''...... This should solve a big portition of your recoil problem.

    The rest is just in your shooting form, Which i can't help you with unless i am actualy there[:(]... Sorry[:(]


    Great. Thank you. I know it will only add an inch or so, but I was thinking about adding a slip on Limbsaver recoil pad if I could find one cheap. I would really like to keep the gun sort of stock, though, the FP sights were highly recommended, I'm not sure if I like them or if I'm really getting the full benefit of it. I have bad eyesight to begin with :/


    The Limbsavers are GREAT pads, I highly recommend them.

    You'd be surpised at how much difference just a inch will make.

    Try it and if its still bothering you take it in to get it fitted.



    Also, Do you have any friends that reload[?] If so, have them load you some light loads. That should help you a lot.
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  • thallman
    quote:Originally posted by stevenrayspeck

    Also, Do you have any friends that reload[?] If so, have them load you some light loads. That should help you a lot.


    No, I wish I had a friend who reloads because 30-30 ammo (even the cheap stuff) is too much for a college kid like me to just spend on target practice. That's why I got the .22, but it's just not the same...
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  • thallman
    Stevenrayspeck,

    You said something about form, here are the only picture I have of me shooting a rifle (the .22 Henry Golden Boy)

    They are not great, but you get the idea.. I think in the second photo my cheek is to far away and obviously had my foot proped up on the RR tie which I wouldn't do shooting anything more powerful that than .22!

    http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff55/justgumpit/3500687298_ORIG.jpg

    http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff55/justgumpit/3500687418_ORIG.jpg
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  • fideau
    Get that elbow up. Using proper form may help. Are you old enough to be thinking Arthritis?( I see you're not) Rotator cuff? If it hurts deep it may be more than a bruise. Nope.
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  • mango tango
    Yep!
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  • br549
    some people are more recoil sensitive than others. perhaps the rifle didn't fit you very well. i have a Browning Gold 3 1/2" magnum and also a model 12 3" duck gun the Mod 12 hurts me when i shoot it where i hardly feel the recoil of the browning. shooting turkey loads.
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  • tacking1
    kinda a hijack here but anyway.

    I am 5'11" 260 and when I read your description about LOP I measured.: 15 1/4"

    because I am (how do I say this?) fat, I have a bad habit of not getting my shotgun all the wat to my actual shoulder, but end up with it between my bicep and shoulder. This hinders my ability to shoot a port to starboard crossing bird. I try to offset this habit by making sure my LOP is a bit shorter than what would constitute a perfect fit. Over several bazillion shots I have compensated for this mentality with practice, but still catch myself not mounting correctly when shooting european.

    Do any of you shotgunners have this problem?
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  • tacking1
    quote:Originally posted by thallman
    Hey y'all,

    I was out sighting in the Win. M-94 today and really got a chance to fire her more than a couple rounds. 21 rds to be precise. I was not using a recoil pad because everyone I've talked to says the 94's recoil is "mild!" Well, I feel like trading in my shoulder right now. :) I was using Federal ammunition.

    Can anyone else whos shot the Model 94 confirm this strong recoil? I have a M-12 12ga Win coming in soon and can't wait to fire that (expecting a heck of a lot of recoil) but I didn't expect this from the Win .30/30...


    and yes any 21YO distance runner is a wus. what letters are on your shirt in the pics and where do you go to school? Why not play a real sport?
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  • stevenrayspeck
    quote:Originally posted by tacking1
    kinda a hijack here but anyway.

    I am 5'11" 260 and when I read your description about LOP I measured.: 15 1/4"

    because I am (how do I say this?) fat, I have a bad habit of not getting my shotgun all the wat to my actual shoulder, but end up with it between my bicep and shoulder. This hinders my ability to shoot a port to starboard crossing bird. I try to offset this habit by making sure my LOP is a bit shorter than what would constitute a perfect fit. Over several bazillion shots I have compensated for this mentality with practice, but still catch myself not mounting correctly when shooting european.

    Do any of you shotgunners have this problem?


    Yes, This is a problem amongst a lot of the compatition shooters out there.

    There is two ways to solve it.

    First, Take all of your vacation days off and do nothing but shoot the shots that are giving you trouble all day long. Make sure to mentaly think about how you are mounting your shotgun each and every time. Have a friend there with you that is experience in shooting, He might catch you doing something that you are not even aware of.

    Second, Have the shotgun custom fitted. A custom fit is not just having the LOP adjusted to fit you. A good stock man will actualy take into account your shooting stance, Where you put your head on the gun, How you hold the gun, and will basicaly build that gun to fit your body.

    If your seirously into compatition i suggest getting your gun custom fitted to your body and then take all of your vacation days off and shoot it.
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