A little hipocracy?
Many members of this forum have expressed their intention to vote for the better of the two presidential candidates. They figure that it is better to support the best candidate who has an actual shot of winning. This makes sense to me. I would love to be able to cast my vote for a candidate that I truly believed in but that doesn't seem likely given they current state of our political system. Sadly, voting for a third party candidate is equivelant to not voting at all.
But this morning I had this thought. Why do so many members refuse to support the NRA because it isn't perfect? Sure there are better gun rights organizations but not with the size and lobbying power of teh NRA. At least the NRA is standing against the Brady's and their ilk. Isn't it our best chance for progress in the gun rights movement?
I might be wrong. They people who refuse to support the NRA might also be the people who will vote for whoever they think is best, regardless of their chance of winning, but I don't think so. In that case I applaude them for at least sticking to a logically defensible position even if I happen to disagree.
But this morning I had this thought. Why do so many members refuse to support the NRA because it isn't perfect? Sure there are better gun rights organizations but not with the size and lobbying power of teh NRA. At least the NRA is standing against the Brady's and their ilk. Isn't it our best chance for progress in the gun rights movement?
I might be wrong. They people who refuse to support the NRA might also be the people who will vote for whoever they think is best, regardless of their chance of winning, but I don't think so. In that case I applaude them for at least sticking to a logically defensible position even if I happen to disagree.
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"A thing moderately good is not so good as it ought to be. Moderation in temper is always a virtue; but moderation in principle is always a vice." -Thomas Paine 0 -
The problem with that logic is that all will be forced to deal with "very anti-gun" leaders, instead of "moderately anti-gun" leaders. I see a very big problem with that.
If it's all or nothing for them, then the antis will gain more power, and be harder to remove in the end.0 -
"In that case I applaude them for at least sticking to a logically defensible position even if I happen to disagree."
there's no other way! how can voting for a third party candidate, be like not voting at all??? You vote for who you believe would be the best for the job, not for who you think will win?!?!?!
If it comes down to Hillary or Obama - guess who i'll vote for. NEITHER ONE!
And as for the NRA... I just don't feel the need to give them my money. I'd rather buy more guns! [;)]0 -
I find it difficult to distinguish the NRA from the Brady folks, except NRA is always looking for my money as well as my guns. 0 -
I once read that refusing to vote is the same as voting for the winner. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by tysonagreen
Many members of this forum have expressed their intention to vote for the better of the two presidential candidates. They figure that it is better to support the best candidate who has an actual shot of winning. This makes sense to me. I would love to be able to cast my vote for a candidate that I truly believed in but that doesn't seem likely given they current state of our political system. Sadly, voting for a third party candidate is equivelant to not voting at all.
But this morning I had this thought. Why do so many members refuse to support the NRA because it isn't perfect? Sure there are better gun rights organizations but not with the size and lobbying power of teh NRA. At least the NRA is standing against the Brady's and their ilk. Isn't it our best chance for progress in the gun rights movement?
I might be wrong. They people who refuse to support the NRA might also be the people who will vote for whoever they think is best, regardless of their chance of winning, but I don't think so. In that case I applaude them for at least sticking to a logically defensible position even if I happen to disagree.
i don't understand this logic on voting. you see if people keep saying well candidate A doesnt have a chance why vote for him. well so many people do think that way and since they do and the media portrays it that way, they don't vote for who they think should be president. But if people would step outside the box and voted for who they believe and not who the media portrays as the front runners we would have a totally different president than Clinton/Obama/and the Mormon guy.
STOP WATCHING THE NEWS, ITS FED FROM THE GOVERNMENT. NEWS ISN'T NEWS ANYMORE ITS ALL CORRUPT AND MANLUPLATED BY GOVERNEMENT. LISTEN TO YOUR INDEPENDENT NEWS PAPERS/REPORTS.0 -
quote:Originally posted by He Dog
I find it difficult to distinguish the NRA from the Brady folks, except NRA is always looking for my money as well as my guns.I'm not defending the NRA, but if you really, truly, down deep in your soul, honestly believe that; then I just don't know what to say!!!!!!!0 -
quote:Originally posted by Alpine
The problem with that logic is that all will be forced to deal with "very anti-gun" leaders, instead of "moderately anti-gun" leaders. I see a very big problem with that.
I see a very big problem with folks that think supporting "moderately anti-gun" canidates is a viable solution.
Let's use Romney as an example.
Would he support a general gun ban? I strongly doubt it.
Would he support an "Assault Weapons" Ban? Based on his record, I think "yes" is a pretty safe bet.
If I get stabbed in the back and have to give up my guns (pretty much all "assualt rifles"), I'll be first in line to make sure Mr. Fudd does too.
We're all in this together, like it or not.0 -
I know what to say............HE DOG IS RIGHT!
Take the blinders off.....the NRA is screwing us just as bad as the Bradys! It's true. After this last vote they did, you can't deny it.
Merc
quote:Originally posted by Old-Colts
quote:Originally posted by He Dog
I find it difficult to distinguish the NRA from the Brady folks, except NRA is always looking for my money as well as my guns.I'm not defending the NRA, but if you really, truly, down deep in your soul, honestly believe that; then I just don't know what to say!!!!!!!0 -
quote:Originally posted by joker5656
[br
i don't understand this logic on voting. you see if people keep saying well candidate A doesnt have a chance why vote for him. well so many people do think that way and since they do and the media portrays it that way, they don't vote for who they think should be president. But if people would step outside the box and voted for who they believe and not who the media portrays as the front runners we would have a totally different president than Clinton/Obama/and the Mormon guy.
STOP WATCHING THE NEWS, ITS FED FROM THE GOVERNMENT. NEWS ISN'T NEWS ANYMORE ITS ALL CORRUPT AND MANLUPLATED BY GOVERNEMENT. LISTEN TO YOUR INDEPENDENT NEWS PAPERS/REPORTS.
In a perfect world we would all vote for the candidate that we think is best. The reality in which we live, however, dictates that one of the two candidates from the major parties will win. I'm not saying I like it, that's just the way it is. If you can come up with a good plan to change it, let me know.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Mercury
I know what to say............HE DOG IS RIGHT!
Take the blinders off.....the NRA is screwing us just as bad as the Bradys! It's true. After this last vote they did, you can't deny it.
Merc
quote:Originally posted by Old-Colts
quote:Originally posted by He Dog
I find it difficult to distinguish the NRA from the Brady folks, except NRA is always looking for my money as well as my guns.I'm not defending the NRA, but if you really, truly, down deep in your soul, honestly believe that; then I just don't know what to say!!!!!!!
Is there something I missed. Can you cite evidence of the NRA actively working agianst pro gun legislation? Sometimes I think people expect too much out of the NRA. They operate in a political and flawed world. They can't win every battle.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Mercury
I know what to say............HE DOG IS RIGHT!
Take the blinders off.....the NRA is screwing us just as bad as the Bradys! It's true. After this last vote they did, you can't deny it.
Mercquote:Originally posted by Old-Colts
quote:Originally posted by He Dog
I find it difficult to distinguish the NRA from the Brady folks, except NRA is always looking for my money as well as my guns.I'm not defending the NRA, but if you really, truly, down deep in your soul, honestly believe that; then I just don't know what to say!!!!!!!Well, it's one thing to disagree with their position and not support them, but to make a statement that there is no difference and believe it? As my comment clearly stated, I'm not defending the NRA!! I do find it interesting that when it comes to the NRA some folks misconstrue just about any statement a forum member makes unless it completely supports their anti NRA agenda!0 -
quote:Originally posted by tysonagreen
quote:Originally posted by joker5656
[br
i don't understand this logic on voting. you see if people keep saying well candidate A doesnt have a chance why vote for him. well so many people do think that way and since they do and the media portrays it that way, they don't vote for who they think should be president. But if people would step outside the box and voted for who they believe and not who the media portrays as the front runners we would have a totally different president than Clinton/Obama/and the Mormon guy.
STOP WATCHING THE NEWS, ITS FED FROM THE GOVERNMENT. NEWS ISN'T NEWS ANYMORE ITS ALL CORRUPT AND MANLUPLATED BY GOVERNEMENT. LISTEN TO YOUR INDEPENDENT NEWS PAPERS/REPORTS.
In a perfect world we would all vote for the candidate that we think is best. The reality in which we live, however, dictates that one of the two candidates from the major parties will win. I'm not saying I like it, that's just the way it is. If you can come up with a good plan to change it, let me know.
yeah its called vote for who u believe in. free mind is a beautiful thing. if u voted for who the media portrays, then your a little ike man in my books. i voted RON PAUL, i know he wasn't going to win but at least i'm not afraid to admit it, and know i have an unwashed mind.0 -
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
I once read that refusing to vote is the same as voting for the winner.
that's retarded.0 -
I agree with whatever HBBG says!
Besides, i'm still trying to figure out what "MANLUPLATED" means.0 -
Personally. I also find the statement ' The NRA and the Brady bunch are the same' offensive.
The Brady bunch, you see, are openly, violently, stridently anti-gun.
Honest, in other words, about their dislike for the Second Amendment.
The NRA, on the other hand, makes MUCH of their support for and 'fighting for' that Amendment..all the time they are sitting down with the Beast and hammering out yet MORE gun control. (Veterans Disarmament Act, anyone ?)
I prefer my enemies HONEST.
Much the same thing about presidential candidates.
ONE candidate has stood FOR America since he started..20 years ago.
Why would I want to vote for somebody that I believe.and can prove..has sold out American ideals ?
Since Electronic balloting doesn't allow for write-ins.I expect I will be voting for the most honest candidate out there. Hillary. She makes no secret that she hates EVERYTHING I hold dear..and everything America stands for.
You party faithful knee-pad experts can suck eggs, as far as I am concerned. You sell me out for a rotten apple..I will give you one equally rotten. No difference..except Republicans wrap themselves in the flag, motherhood, and freedom.while they do the bush thing.0 -
quote:Originally posted by tysonagreen
Can you cite evidence of the NRA.....
tysonagreen,
Have you read this thread?
The first page at least.
http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2637950 -
quote:Originally posted by hisbigbootygirl
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
I once read that refusing to vote is the same as voting for the winner.
that's retarded.
Not really.0 -
tysonagreen, I don't see the connection between your post and hypocrisy. 0 -
quote:
Originally posted by hisbigbootygirl
quote:
Originally posted by callktulu
I once read that refusing to vote is the same as voting for the winner.
that's retarded.
Not really
Actually..it IS retarded. When asked to choose between garbage and offal..the sensible person walks away.
Only the desperate, the weak, or those that love to wallow in filth could POSSIBLE be comfortable with those picks.0 -
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
quote:Originally posted by hisbigbootygirl
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
I once read that refusing to vote is the same as voting for the winner.
that's retarded.
Not really.
i really can't see how it is right to vote for the better of two people you don't want to be your president!?!? please help me understand highball's reasoning as well... he's gonna vote for hillary??
so if it's hillary or obama, i'm supposed to choose one of them and vote?? what if i am totally against both of them? if i don't vote, i voted for the winner?? did i not vote for the loser as well??0 -
quote:Originally posted by tysonagreen
quote:Originally posted by Mercury
I know what to say............HE DOG IS RIGHT!
Take the blinders off.....the NRA is screwing us just as bad as the Bradys! It's true. After this last vote they did, you can't deny it.
Merc
quote:Originally posted by Old-Colts
quote:Originally posted by He Dog
I find it difficult to distinguish the NRA from the Brady folks, except NRA is always looking for my money as well as my guns.I'm not defending the NRA, but if you really, truly, down deep in your soul, honestly believe that; then I just don't know what to say!!!!!!!
Is there something I missed. Can you cite evidence of the NRA actively working agianst pro gun legislation? Sometimes I think people expect too much out of the NRA. They operate in a political and flawed world. They can't win every battle.
Not exactly the NRA actively working against pro gun legislation, but an example of the NRA actively working FOR ANTI-GUN legislation is the "Veterans Disarmament Act." Remember that a couple months ago? BOTH the Brady bunch and the NRA made press releases about how great it was that it got passed.
THings that make you go "hmmm...."0 -
quote:Originally posted by Highball
Since Electronic balloting doesn't allow for write-ins.I keep seeing this statement and to the best of my knowledge this just isn't factual and I've used the electronic systems. Here are excerpts from a site regarding the write-in procedure:
3a. Select Candidates or Issues OR Select Write-In if Desired
Touch the box on the screen next to your choice. An "X" will appear, designating your selection. To change or cancel your selection, touch the box again and make another selection. If there are write-in candidates for whom you wish to vote, select "Write-In" and a keyboard will appear on the screen.
3b. Select Write-In Candidate
Separately type the name of each person you want to write-in, then select "Record Write-In." The normal voting screen will return and the name you entered will appear as the choice for that particular race. touch "Back" to review previous pages.
Unless you know something I don't, the system does allow electronic write-in's.0 -
The NRA actively works to strip us of our Second Amendment rights. They are no better than the Brady Campaign...in fact, they are far worse. The Brady Bunch is forthcoming with their goals and intentions, while the NRA is a wolf in sheep's clothing. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by JamesRK
tysonagreen, I don't see the connection between your post and hypocrisy.
i luv ur signature!0 -
Well, I see others have made the same point I was trying to make...should have read the thread first.[^] 0 -
sorry highball, i understand what you were saying now. i read that a little too fast. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by hisbigbootygirl
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
quote:Originally posted by hisbigbootygirl
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
I once read that refusing to vote is the same as voting for the winner.
that's retarded.
Not really.
i really can't see how it is right to vote for the better of two people you don't want to be your president!?!? please help me understand highball's reasoning as well... he's gonna vote for hillary??
so if it's hillary or obama, i'm supposed to choose one of them and vote?? what if i am totally against both of them? if i don't vote, i voted for the winner?? did i not vote for the loser as well??
Good thing we're not limited to choosing just one firearm in order to exercise our 2nd Amendment Right. Otherwise no one here would ever buy one because 1 gun doesn't fit all needs (much like the Presidential candidates).0 -
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
quote:Originally posted by hisbigbootygirl
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
quote:Originally posted by hisbigbootygirl
quote:Originally posted by callktulu
I once read that refusing to vote is the same as voting for the winner.
that's retarded.
Not really.
i really can't see how it is right to vote for the better of two people you don't want to be your president!?!? please help me understand highball's reasoning as well... he's gonna vote for hillary??
so if it's hillary or obama, i'm supposed to choose one of them and vote?? what if i am totally against both of them? if i don't vote, i voted for the winner?? did i not vote for the loser as well??
Good thing we're not limited to choosing just one firearm in order to exercise our 2nd Amendment Right. Otherwise no one here would ever buy one because 1 gun doesn't fit all needs (much like the Presidential candidates).
that's a funny way to put it. we are going to compare our president to our firearm. which (president)firearm would make you feel safe in combat??? Hillary or Obama?0 -
quote:Good thing we're not limited to choosing just one firearm in order to exercise our 2nd Amendment Right. Otherwise no one here would ever buy one because 1 gun doesn't fit all needs (much like the Presidential candidates).
More nonsense.
Is it REALLY too much to ask...that a presidental candidate actively support the Comstitution ?
Whatever does that have to do with 'our guns', chosing one. ect ?
Beyond the fact that you urge support for leaders that intend taking away firearm..
HBBG is indeed on the right track..and thinking about the issues. Perhaps you, too, could spend some time doing so.
HBBG;
Don't know if I will vote Hillary. I do enjoy shoving it in the face of the party hacks that cannot see their nose on the end of their faces, tho...probably not vote for pres. at all.0
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