Shotgun or AR15 ??
I have a 10 mm glock within reach as I lay here in bed for emergencies in case there?s no time to access a long gun. I have four AR15?s here in the house, a Colt,a Daniels Defense, a LWRC all in 5.56 and a Colt 9 mm. These are all great guns but; I just prefer a shotgun here in the house or anywhere else where the target is within say 40 yards. My Mossberg 590 here in the bedroom or the Remington 870 Police Magnum in the den I don?t care which. Loaded with hot Federal 00 buck I have a lot of confidence in either gun to stop pretty much anything. I don?t have kids running around and if I did my choice would probably switch to a 55 gr hp 5.56 round for it?s lack of penetration but I can use anything I want and that?s probably always gonna be a pump gun with full power buckshot.
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just me (with no real world experience ) I like having a shotgun(s) ready to go like you state 40 yards 00 buck even #4 buck no one is going to be too ambitious after having a round expelled on them . and the old saying hearing a pump shotgun rack into battery still carries a oooo crap actor
many years ago the LEO I met over time told me knowing they were facing someone with a shotgun was more scary when doing searches of a hidden suspect .
and yes if I go outside at night to check on the boogers then a AR goes with me
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have to pump it between shots. that isn't too slow for you? 0 -
Was it crossfire who made the combo AR / shotgun platform???
Makaila is looking to buy an AR platform chambered in .410 gauge or 28 gauge (she prefers the 28 gauge power wise over the .410 but I think combat and tactical 28 ammo will be limited in selection and availability)
Fiocchi used to offer or at least catalog a variety of combat ammo in 28 gauge (that's how I obtained my slugs and buckshot and trap loads)
The AR semi platform shotguns she has been looking at were featured in and frequently advertise in the firearms news - they even have a drum mag in addition to the standard mags (5 round and seven round and ten round are standard I believe...
She likes the AR clone shotgun because it allows her to swap parts easily and mount things easily - for the most part...
I made the girls zombie apocalypse combat shotguns out of a pair of browning A5's in sweet 16 and 20 gauge - they run well and handle / balance well and sport red dot and holosight optics
She just desires the AR variant in addition to her other guns
Mike0 -
It?s not slow at all if you know how to run a pump gun. My 590 holds 9 rounds and I can shoot it well. You pump the gun as you are pulling it back down from recoil and you are ready to go. That?s up to 81 33 caliber projectiles heading toward the target. I like it. 0 -
Pancor Jackhammer tactical semi with ammo cassettes designed to be used as ersatz poormans claymore mines...
And it does appeal visually...
French SPAS so you can select pump or semi mode...
Mike0 -
The Spas 12 is so damn complicated it?s hard to run. I took a LEO quail with one back in 1990. What a cool looking piece of junk. 0 -
Shepherds crook over folder and green emitter tube extension...
Yup.
Mike0 -
I was just test firing my Rossi coach gun. Had to put a red dot on it. Because I no longer could see the front bead, in the dark. 20 assorted slugs,buck shot and 1 1/2 ounces of #4's.
Reinforced my long ago bad experiences, with heavy duty shotgun loads. Between the recoil and muzzle rise. Very hard to control in rapid fire. Special at distances of over 10 yards.
Being you have AR's up the wazoo. I would forget the shotguns, and go with your AR's. For your potential, O dark 30 escapades.
We had one of the local low life's. Show up at our local range with a AR pistol. Fed with some kind of exotic double drum magazine. I don't know how many .223's it held? But it must have been at least 50? Using one of these double drums, in your AR Would negate any advantage of 9 rounds of double o buck. In a pump shotgun. And it would be way more effective, past the 25 yds, of double o buck.0 -
My primary home defense gun is a 8.5" .300 blk pistol with a light. If I have to protect myself I am grabbing a rifle caliber firearm everytime if possible. 0 -
Benelli M2 Field (21" bbl) with an extended mag. 1 in the chamber, 8 in the mag of 12 ga 00.
As said, it'll put a hurtin' on anything inside 40 yards.0 -
imo, extended tube shotgun in house. I have neighbors close by and don't want to put one through their house or them. Yes, I have two AR's close by, plus another pistol on the bedside table. SOME people don't realize that when you shoot the 223 it going places. Not anyone here but- 0 -
Personally, inside the house - in the dark, I prefer a Shotgun.
I somewhat collect Riot Pumps. I have a few to choose from. That being said, I have a couple somewhat inexpensive single shot Shotguns that live outside the safe, somewhat close by. (Iver Johnson Hercules, [18" solid rib barrel] Crescent Red Chieftain, etc.) All have butt stock reloads.
A couple 12's with Double 0, some #4 Buck, a few slugs if needed availabe. A double .20ga. With #4 high brass Heavy Field loads.
That is close at hand and available at a moments notice. I have a more than a few Riot Pumps loaded and in the safe, if I have time or the inclination to access them.
Beyond 40-50 yards, Yes - I will step up to an AR or my Marlin Camp nine with a barrel light and a Bushnell Red/Green T-dot M/P Trophy sight, or a Ruger .44 Carbine, or an M1 Carbine, etc.
It is really awful to have to choose from a wide selection.0 -
depending on your home layout, I would consider a short barreled shotgun for maneuverability. whether a pump or semi 0 -
Grasshopper wrote:imo, extended tube shotgun in house. I have neighbors close by and don't want to put one through their house or them. Yes, I have two AR's close by, plus another pistol on the bedside table. SOME people don't realize that when you shoot the 223 it going places. Not anyone here but-
Check out the U Tube vids. Of guys testing the penetration of various shotgun loads. Through double layer drywall, mounted on studs. To represent the wall of a standard home.
If unfortunately, you have to start shooting your shotgun, in your home. Your "close by" neighbors, could wind up severely ventilated.0 -
12 gauge shotgun is best home defense gun and hopefully it won't kill your neighbor by accident. I live in the city so if I have to shoot someone I don't want to kill anyone that don't deserve it. 0 -
I think it really comes down to proficiency.
At the end of the day it is harder to work a 12 gauge under pressure than an AR for most people.
I think its just easier to be good with an AR, in my opinion.0 -
If you've got close neighbors or someone sleeping in another part of the house a shotgun is the way to go. Keep a cheap pump shotgun for personal/home defense. Have a .223 folder but only for potential zombie invasions.
Never have kept any firearm worth more than $150 in an easily accessible location in the house. Guns Stolen, who cares.0 -
rufesnow wrote:Grasshopper wrote:imo, extended tube shotgun in house. I have neighbors close by and don't want to put one through their house or them. Yes, I have two AR's close by, plus another pistol on the bedside table. SOME people don't realize that when you shoot the 223 it going places. Not anyone here but-
Check out the U Tube vids. Of guys testing the penetration of various shotgun loads. Through double layer drywall, mounted on studs. To represent the wall of a standard home.
If unfortunately, you have to start shooting your shotgun, in your home. Your "close by" neighbors, could wind up severely ventilated.
You really need to make some tests with 00 on various pieces of clothing over a sandbag hung so it has a little give to it. IMO much more relevant than some other tests. I was tasked with thinning out the Fox population due to an outbreak of disease. I started out with 00 and quickly decided it just wasn't getting the job done, best guess it was something about the surface area of 00 shot and the fur, it just wasn't penetrating. A smaller shot, number 2 Goose shot or BB would put them down quick, I would have tried 4 Buck but couldn't find any at the time. I averaged around 20 Fox a year for half a decade, so I had a good sampling. Distance has a lot to do with it, inside of fifteen feet it really doesn't make a whole lot of difference what shot you use, it is all pretty much still a one ounce wad of shot. My confidence level for 00 went way down after my experience with the Fox.
I use a skeet round, followed by 3 Goose rounds, followed by three slugs. I use the skeet round for the simple reason that shooting to kill is against the law here and I can always say I used the weakest possible round first. And going back to what I said before, at really close range it is pretty much an ounce or so of shot and the size of the shot is largely irrelevant, it will put a decent neat hole in a 3/4" pine board at close range with most birdshot.
I've never been much at believing much of anything until I've tried it myself, I call it no bullchit testing.
As a side note I can do a lot of damage with a shotgun at close range without firing a shot, If you know how to use a rifle/shotgun in bayonet drill correctly it can be the next best thing to a baseball bat, maybe better. Think Blackbelt with a three foot stick and you get a feeling for what can be done with a rifle or shotgun. One reason I'm not fond of pistol grips, they just get in the way.0 -
You asked for opinions, so here's mine:
Just the wife and me, way out in the country. No houses withing shooting distance. Lots of wild critters.
In the house, I like a handgun. It can be operated with one hand, leaving the other hand free for a flashlight, opening doors, etc. It is easily maneuverable around corners and up and down stairs. You can pull it in close and maintain possession if someone should try to take it from you.
So I think the 10mm Glock by your bed gets the gold star.
I keep a Glock with a light/laser and a lanyard attached...on my nightstand. The lanyard works for me when I'm "dressed" for bed (no pockets or waistband) and stumbling around in the dark. I consider the light/laser a must-have for nighttime home defense (or clearing a varmint out of the henhouse in the middle of the night). Note: I now use a Glock 17 so I utilize the same 9mm ammo as my long gun -- see below.
Now to the shotgun/AR issue.
I keep a fully loaded 9mm Beretta CX4, with a light/laser, hanging on the wall. If I go outside, it goes with me. The 9mm gives me manageable recoil and high capacity and should handle everything from lawbreakers to small varmints to full-sized critters such as black bears. No fumbling with a hand light since it is attached to the carbine. With low recoil and attached laser the CX4 does not have to be shoulder-fired.
Sooo...in your situation I vote for the 9mm AR.0 -
Pocket carry a Ruger LC9S Pro during the day. Keep this one handy for night: 0 -
Shotgun wins my vote. Simply racking the beast strikes fear in the heart of the intruder.
The blast of 12 ga will clear a area of several miscreats in one shot. Sending any others on the trot.
The AR is more of the range or long shot gun.
With your 10mm in one hand and the shotgun in the other. How could you lose?0 -
buschmaster wrote:have to pump it between shots. that isn't too slow for you?
I can fire my old Winchester Model 12 pump shotguns faster than any of my semi auto shotguns because they, like the Winchester Model 97s, don't have a trigger dis-connector. Just hold the trigger down and it'll fire as fast as it can be pumped. It's a wonder the gun grabbers didn't get those old model 12s & 97s banned along with the Model 37 Ithica that also doesn't have a trigger dis-connector.0 -
With the 10 mm in one hand and the shotgun in the other you are invincible...
Go for the shotgun my brother. The AR is for the long shot.0 -
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sko shorty0 -
Not with 8 shot. I don't use buck or any type like that. Sorry to blow your theory.rufesnow wrote:Grasshopper wrote:imo, extended tube shotgun in house. I have neighbors close by and don't want to put one through their house or them. Yes, I have two AR's close by, plus another pistol on the bedside table. SOME people don't realize that when you shoot the 223 it going places. Not anyone here but-
Check out the U Tube vids. Of guys testing the penetration of various shotgun loads. Through double layer drywall, mounted on studs. To represent the wall of a standard home.
If unfortunately, you have to start shooting your shotgun, in your home. Your "close by" neighbors, could wind up severely ventilated.0 -
" Loaded with hot Federal 00 buck I have a lot of confidence "
There's absolutely no need for "hot 00 buck" in a home defense inside a dwelling scenario. Actually, @ 10' to 10 yards the "hot loads" don't do any better than the old time loads.0 -
I keep my Winchester Riot Pump Shotgun by my bedside loaded with different size shot. The first 2 rounds are #8 and the remaining rounds are 00 buck. I figure 2 shots of #8 ought to do it but if that's not enough to get the job done then the next ones surely will. 0 -
12 ga dbl bar 311 Stevens. lt works and HAS twice 0 -
I prefer a shotgun for just about anything that requires a gun. The choice of pump, auto-loader, single or double should depend on which one you are most familiar and proficient with.
My Navy uses pump shotguns for ?ship?s defense force? and ?repel boarders?, etc. and a lot of cops carry pumps in their cars, so I seriously doubt they are as useless as I think they are but I?ve never liked them.
I?ve always used auto-loaders since I reached a point in life that I could afford one, except on ships and for qualifications. When I was shooting the qualification course to be a corrections officer I was using a Remington 870 pump. For my second target I must have pulled the trigger at least twice before I remembered it was a pump. That was unacceptable performance on my part but I had time to recover so nobody noticed and I didn?t tell, but it reinforced my opinion of pump shotguns.
For home defense you will probably be facing one, maybe two or three junkies trying to get cash or trade items from you for their supplier and most likely willing to kill you to get it. However shooting an intruder is just the beginning. When you are thinking about shooting an intruder at 40 or more yards you are probably looking at some serious prison time.
If the corpse is torn up because you shot it at close range with a shotgun the judge might see that as normal behavior and a shotgun can do a lot of damage. If the corpse is torn up because you shot it fifteen or twenty times at 40 or more yards he is likely to think you shot him more for sport than ?fear for your life?.0
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