H R 45
HAS ANYONE READ THIS YET? THIS BILL WOULD GIVE THE A.G.THE POWER TO BAN ANY GUN OF HIS CHOOSING. COME ON GOOGLE IT.
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It sounds like my home state of Kali to me but on a Fed. level. [:(!] 0 -
This is just closing the 'gunshow loophole'. 120 million americans voted for a candidate that advocated this.
Why even bother to run it through Congress? The people have spoken. Complete registration, complete licensing, complete control, just as SCROTUS outlined in Heller. This is the inevitable result of the support of reasonable gun laws by reasonable gun owners and thier preferred 2nd Amendment Rights lobbying group. This is the inevitable result of the 'Compromise First' attitude that many on this board have supported. This is the inevitable result of accepting as reality that a right is fungible, and thus meaningless.
All you 2nd Amendment advocates who applauded Heller, and who accept the reasonable infringements on the 2nd by government have no beef, right? After all, if government needs to protect us from unlawfully owned guns, we must give them the proper tools with which to do the job.
This, if it passes, will be when civil disobedience (at the very least) will be required of all gun owners in this country. Force them to come to your door. Force them to get a warrant. Force them to 'describe the things to be seized' as stated in the 4th Amendment. Even if you choose to not physically resist the theft of your firearms, make damn sure you do not go quietly into servitude.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Don McManus
This, if it passes, will be when civil disobedience (at the very least) will be required of all gun owners in this country. Force them to come to your door. Force them to get a warrant. Force them to 'describe the things to be seized' as stated in the 4th Amendment. Even if you choose to not physically resist the theft of your firearms, make damn sure you do not go quietly into servitude.
More times than not they will bust into your home at 4:00 AM, stick the barrel of an MP-5 in your face and your families face demanding to know where you have hidden the contraband. There is no defense to that type of enforcement.
Only LEO's, understanding that gun laws are illegal and refusing to enforce them could stop it. Please don't count on the younger crowd of brain washed pigs to understand the difference.0 -
quote:Originally posted by bpost1958
More times than not they will bust into your home at 4:00 AM, stick the barrel of an MP-5 in your face and your families face demanding to know where you have hidden the contraband. There is no defense to that type of enforcement.
Only LEO's, understanding that gun laws are illegal and refusing to enforce them could stop it. Please don't count on the younger crowd of brain washed pigs to understand the difference.
That is correct, bpost. The point is to force action.
Civil disobedience, forcing action by not succumbing to the ridiculous and unconstitutional permitting process and by not turning in your weapons voluntarily when you refuse to get your papers. If even 10% of gun owners take this stand it will be a law enforcement nightmare, with or without any armed resistance. If half of us peacefully resist, it will be a non-starter.0 -
Historically, registration precedes confiscation.
Make NO mistake, their intentions could NOT be more clear.
Direct from the mouth of Senator Feinstein, concerning the "last" assault rifle ban.
And I QUOTE
"If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate of the United States
for an out-right ban,
picking up every one of them.....
Mr. and Mrs. America,
turn 'em ALL in......
I would have done it."
************
Do you think she was talking about "just" assault rifles?
Will she will have the votes.........this time?0 -
Prepare for what is coming folks, and decide what your intentions are right now![}:)] 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Marc1301
decide what your intentions are right now![}:)]
Why? what? again? I am pretty sure most have decided a long time ago.0 -
HAS ANYONE READ THIS YET? THIS BILL WOULD GIVE THE A.G.THE POWER TO BAN ANY GUN OF HIS CHOOSING.
The Constitution grants no such authority, hence, I do not recognize it.
I am a citizen; not a subject. I have neither lived the life of a slave, nor do I intend to.
Bans, whether they be past, present, or future, are not heeded by 100% of the populace.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rockatansky
quote:Originally posted by Marc1301
decide what your intentions are right now![}:)]
Why? what? again? I am pretty sure most have decided a long time ago.
Count me in. [:(!]0 -
Any guesses on what the "NRA" will have to water it down to, to get the sheep to accept it?
BTW, taverish, thanks for the post.0 -
My intentions are to support the Constitution of the United States as is written and intended!
That each individual has the right to keep and bear arms. It is the only thing keeping this once great country from becoming a tyrannical/socialistic state.
With my last breath I will defend her.
Lance0 -
quote:Originally posted by jpwolf
Any guesses on what the "NRA" will have to water it down to, to get the sheep to accept it?
Registration of "Black Rifles" along with a sales ban.
No confiscation yet....that will be attempted further down the line0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rack Ops
quote:Originally posted by jpwolf
Any guesses on what the "NRA" will have to water it down to, to get the sheep to accept it?
Registration of "Black Rifles" along with a sales ban.
No confiscation yet....that will be attempted further down the line
This seems to be the most plausible prediction for the initial step in the newest assault on the Republic.0 -
It would seem that it is time for our representatives to be deluged with phone calls, letters, and e-mails telling them we are not happy with this and its passage will mean they will become unemployed with the next election. The only thing a politician fears is not being re-elected. 0 -
quote:It would seem that it is time for our representatives to be deluged with phone calls, letters, and e-mails telling them we are not happy with this and its passage will mean they will become unemployed with the next election. The only thing a politician fears is not being re-elected.
Hhehehhehh;;;I love a good joke...hehehehhhhhhh0 -
I went through that monstrosity in some detail today. It gives an incredible amount of freedom to the Attorney General to interpret it largely as he sees fit. With Eric Holder at AG, we may be in big trouble if this one can't be stopped. It looks like a bad mix of Illinois' FOID requirements and New Jersey's system and the penalties for violation are extreme. 0 -
quote:It looks like a bad mix of Illinois' FOID requirements and New Jersey's system and the penalties for violation are extreme.
What do you think ought to be the penalties for passing such a bill ?0 -
I went through that monstrosity in some detail today. It gives an incredible amount of freedom to the Attorney General to interpret it largely as he sees fit. With Eric Holder at AG, we may be in big trouble if this one can't be stopped. It looks like a bad mix of Illinois' FOID requirements and New Jersey's system and the penalties for violation are extreme.
Per the Founders, so are the penalties for engaging in tyrannical practices.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Canary ass no. 1
quote:It looks like a bad mix of Illinois' FOID requirements and New Jersey's system and the penalties for violation are extreme.
What do you think ought to be the penalties for passing such a bill ?
What do I think? Hanging would be the appropriate penalty but the best we can probably hope for is to make those who support it unemployed.0 -
At what point for you, Rawhide, does 'passing laws' become a criminal offense against America ?
AT WHAT POINT do you decide that politicians just MERELY proposing some 'law' indicate to you there no longer is any possibilty of retaining the smallest hope of freedom ?
That phoning,writting, picketing, or other forms of folly are just wasted effort ?0 -
quote:Originally posted by Highball
At what point for you, Rawhide, does 'passing laws' become a criminal offense against America ?
AT WHAT POINT do you decide that politicians just MERELY proposing some 'law' indicate to you there no longer is any possibilty of retaining the smallest hope of freedom ?
That phoning,writting, picketing, or other forms of folly are just wasted effort ?
Highball,
I think you misunderstand me. You and I are generally in agreement and on the same team. My position is fundamentally the same as yours. My recommendation here is to use any possibility of correcting the wrongs through the system before resorting to an option from which there is no turning back. I can assure you that I have my own contingency plans that you would not disapprove of but I see no reason to broadcast them in a forum the opposition is monitoring.
I would, however, remind you that those same efforts you disdain, i.e. picketing, letter writing, propaganda, etc. are the tools the other side has used to gain their current position. For the past 40 years being shrill, loud, and using phony indignation has served those who would restrict our rights well. We need to become much more vocal to counteract them.
I only recommend using all other means FIRST because the problem with falling on your sword is that you can only do it once.0 -
quote: with falling on your sword is that you can only do it once.
I have not the sligest intention of falling upon my sword. Trust me about this.
I have not the slightest intention of falling upon my sword. Trust me about this.
The problem we face is simple ; Every time some child is killed with a weapon, we lose. Appeals to emotions are winners, when we live in an emasculated environment.
Every time there is a school shooting, a family wiped out, a daddy murdered by thugs with guns...we lose.
It is difficult if not impossible to call out to the manhood left in most `citizens' ..for they have been taught from the cradle that fighting is ALWAYS wrong...unless ordered to by government or codified by a badge.
When we speak about the Second as the bulwark against tyranny, the average `citizen' reacts with horror ..branding the speaker as a terrorist.
I have spent my time in the trenches of the `system' playing the game. I have lost every round. Even when we succeeded in placing what appeared to be a decent, honorable man in office...it only lasted a couple years before he stumped for mccain.
For me, the political game is over. We have lost in that arena.
The Court system is over. We lost Heller. We have lost in that arena.
We have lost the hearts and minds of our fellow `citizens';
We have lost in the jury box, simply because most refuse to educate themselves of their RESPONSIBILITES as a Juror...that they are there to judge the LAW as much as the law-breaker.
There is the Ballot Box, the Jury Box...and the Cartridge Box. Those three boxes are the legs upon which freedom rests.
Two of them are hopelessly corrupted.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Highball
quote: with falling on your sword is that you can only do it once.
I have not the sligest intention of falling upon my sword. Trust me about this.
I have not the slightest intention of falling upon my sword. Trust me about this.
The problem we face is simple ; Every time some child is killed with a weapon, we lose. Appeals to emotions are winners, when we live in an emasculated environment.
Every time there is a school shooting, a family wiped out, a daddy murdered by thugs with guns...we lose.
It is difficult if not impossible to call out to the manhood left in most `citizens' ..for they have been taught from the cradle that fighting is ALWAYS wrong...unless ordered to by government or codified by a badge.
When we speak about the Second as the bulwark against tyranny, the average `citizen' reacts with horror ..branding the speaker as a terrorist.
I have spent my time in the trenches of the `system' playing the game. I have lost every round. Even when we succeeded in placing what appeared to be a decent, honorable man in office...it only lasted a couple years before he stumped for mccain.
For me, the political game is over. We have lost in that arena.
The Court system is over. We lost Heller. We have lost in that arena.
We have lost the hearts and minds of our fellow `citizens';
We have lost in the jury box, simply because most refuse to educate themselves of their RESPONSIBILITES as a Juror...that they are there to judge the LAW as much as the law-breaker.
There is the Ballot Box, the Jury Box...and the Cartridge Box. Those three boxes are the legs upon which freedom rests.
Two of them are hopelessly corrupted.
I can't disagree.0 -
I guess Highball is right. I got an e-mail answer back from my US Representive regarding my question about whether he supports H.R. 45 and this nonsense about banning guns for the elderly. It was a canned answer about the importance of the stimulus package. BUT, being as stubborn as I am, I'm going to call his office Monday and keep at them until I get a straight answer and, if I don't like his answer, I'm going to post it on everwhere I can to make as many people as I can aware of what a lying SOB he is. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by rawhide54
I got an e-mail answer back from my US Representive regarding my question about whether he supports H.R. 45 and this nonsense about banning guns for the elderly. It was a canned answer about the importance of the stimulus package.
Do you ever get the feeling that they DID NOT EVEN READ your email??? [:(!][:(!][:(!]0 -
quote:Originally posted by pickenup
quote:Originally posted by rawhide54
I got an e-mail answer back from my US Representive regarding my question about whether he supports H.R. 45 and this nonsense about banning guns for the elderly. It was a canned answer about the importance of the stimulus package.
Do you ever get the feeling that they DID NOT EVEN READ your email??? [:(!][:(!][:(!]
I learned along time ago unless you get 'face' time with them in person, or on the phone you have little to no impact. Even face time is mostly a waste because they will tell you 'what you want to hear'![:(!]0 -
quote:Originally posted by Jim Rau
quote:Originally posted by pickenup
quote:Originally posted by rawhide54
I got an e-mail answer back from my US Representive regarding my question about whether he supports H.R. 45 and this nonsense about banning guns for the elderly. It was a canned answer about the importance of the stimulus package.
Do you ever get the feeling that they DID NOT EVEN READ your email??? [:(!][:(!][:(!]
I learned along time ago unless you get 'face' time with them in person, or on the phone you have little to no impact. Even face time is mostly a waste because they will tell you 'what you want to hear'![:(!]
In red above.
If GOA or the SAF had 42 millions members, (only half of the 84 million gun owners in America) I predict that if a representative from GOA or SAF wanted "face time" with witch Pelosi, that representative would get that face time and Pelosi would listen to him/her.
Of course for that to happen, we gun owners would have to work together so it is nothing but a pipe dream.0 -
quote:Originally posted by tr fox
quote:Originally posted by Jim Rau
quote:Originally posted by pickenup
quote:Originally posted by rawhide54
I got an e-mail answer back from my US Representive regarding my question about whether he supports H.R. 45 and this nonsense about banning guns for the elderly. It was a canned answer about the importance of the stimulus package.
Do you ever get the feeling that they DID NOT EVEN READ your email??? [:(!][:(!][:(!]
I learned along time ago unless you get 'face' time with them in person, or on the phone you have little to no impact. Even face time is mostly a waste because they will tell you 'what you want to hear'![:(!]
In red above.
If GOA or the SAF had 42 millions members, (only half of the 84 million gun owners in America) I predict that if a representative from GOA or SAF wanted "face time" with witch Pelosi, that representative would get that face time and Pelosi would listen to him/her.
Of course for that to happen, we gun owners would have to work together so it is nothing but a pipe dream.
Precisely why we do need to start working together better. We need the politicians to fear our vote as much as they seem to fear our guns. Right now they fear the votes of the "I want a government handout" crowd more than they fear our votes and that needs to change. We're the ones paying the taxes so we need to get organized so we'll be heard.0 -
'Shall Not Be Infringed".
Four words that divide us.
Some of us believe in them...some do not.
I no longer rub shoulders with those that do not believe in them. Nor will I send money, nor will I vote for them.
Contempt is the only thing they will get from me.0 -
We all need to get involved and call your Congress person and make sure they vote against this horrible bill.
All of you out there that have been talking bad about California people and saying we don't do anything to protect our rights, looks like the same people are after your rights too.
It is not about if these new laws or programs will work to reduce crime, they don't care about that. It is all about control. Same as this stimulus bill crap. It is all about control. The more people they can put on the government programs the less fight thye will have whne they want to tax us more.
Get out and do something. California is pretty much a lost cause. We have too many liberals and us conservatives have a tough fight.
I have written many letters to my local politicians. When talking about gun control I always ask them if the gang members that are killing each other and shooting little kids have registered guns.
Do they also have CCW's because they all are packing?
They caught a 15 year old with an AK-47 stuck in his sweat pants with a 30 round clip in the middle of Oakland, California on a school day.
How many things are wrong with that one.
Bring up the existing laws that are being broken when you talk to these people. We don't need more laws just better enforcement.
We have a tough fight ahead.0
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