Winchester Model 94, 55, & 64 Survey update
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Hello all.
I am researching/surveying all of the pre WW II production through post WW II era production Model 94s, Model 55s, and Model 64s that I can locate. For those of you who are interested and would like to participate in a survey concerning several different production changes made to the Models 94, 55, and 64, please review the information that I am specifically looking for, and then post your information here on this topic, or you can send it to me directly at Win1885@msn.com.
5/24/202 Edit 4: Well, here I am again, and still at it. As of today, I now have logged (surveyed) just shy of 25,000 specimens, and I still looking for more. For the past number of years, I have been collaborating with Robert (Bob) C. Renneberg, and have written and published a number of articles of my own discussing the Model 1894(94), Model 55, and Model 64 production. I have added serial numbers 1 - 7499 to my survey list (looking for the semi-rare "First" models. Please get in touch with me via email if you have an interest in supporting the research survey.
12/8/2014 Edit 3: I have surpassed 10,500 total serial numbers in this research survey, and I am still working towards reaching the 16,000 mark. Due to a welcome increase in the number of people who are actively assisting me with this research, I plan to continue this survey well beyond my original goal. Sometime early next year (2015), I will post the current results of the survey in an easy to read format.
9/24/2011 Edit 2: I am rapidly closing in on (5,000) total serial numbers in this survey, and I would like to surpass that mark before the end of this month. The various production numbers represented in the survey have firmed up considerably in this past year, and I do not believe that they will change by any significant % as the survey continues to progress. Still, it is my intention to keep this survey alive and growing until I reach the (16,120) total serial numbers surveyed mark (1% of the total numbers in the survey range). At that point, I will publish a statistical analysis reference document detailing my findings.
Edit 1: I have come to the realization that I need to ask all of the following questions...
1. The complete serial number (please, no partial serial numbers).
2. The exact caliber stamp marking.
3. The specific type of butt plate, e.g. Carbine, serrated steel shotgun style, flat checkered steel, hard rubber, or the checkered steel plate with the widows peak and diamond surrounding the lower screw hole.
4. The type (style) of the upper tang marking, e.g. type 5, 6, or 7, or if it is blank.
5. Is the left side of the receiver factory drilled & tapped for a peep sight?
6. Does it have U.S. martial or Canadian PCMR markings on the receiver frame?
7. Does it have a Nickel Steel or a Proof Steel marked barrel?
8. Does it have a saddle ring?
9. If in the 1,200,000 - 1,270,000 serial range, is the bottom of the receiver marked with a "W"?
10. If in the 1,260,000 - 1,330,000 serial range, does the leading "1" digit look like an "L"?
11. If in the 1,370,000 - 1,560,000 serial range, does it have a flat-band or a milled front barrel band?
12. If in the 1,700,000 - 1,770,000 serial range, does it have the long or the short forend stock?
13. If it is a Model 55, is it a Take Down or Solid frame?
14. If it is a Model 64, is it standard Rifle, a Deer Rifle (deluxe), a standard Carbine, or a deluxe Carbine?
More specifically, I am trying to determine the serial number transition points for the caliber markings on the barrel...
(1) "30 W.C.F." versus "30-30 WIN" marked barrels,
(2) "32 W.S." versus "32 WIN. SPL."
(3) "25-35 W.C.F." versus "25-35 WIN."
(4) The transition point from the traditional curved steel carbine butt plate, to the steel shotgun style with the horizontal cut lines (serrated), and again the later transition to the flat checkered steel plates.
(5) Upper Tang roll stamp types (e.g. Type 5, 6, 7, or blank)
(6) Those guns that were factory drilled & tapped for a receiver mounted peep sight (Lyman or Redfield).
(7) The transition from the milled front barrel band to the flat-band, and then back to the milled band.
(8) The exact serial range for the "W" stamped guns...
(9) The exact serial range for the leading "L" digit serial number stamped guns...
And finally, I am attempting to determine the precise serial number transition points for the Models 55 and 64.
If you own (or know of) a Model 94, 55, or 64 in the 1,000,000 - 2,700,000 serial range, please take a close look at it, and then either post, or send the information directly to me. Your name and information will remain anonymous if you email the information to me. I will post updated results in this Sticky topic as the survey progresses.
In closing, I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this survey, and to all who particiapte in the future. [:)].
Bert H.
I am researching/surveying all of the pre WW II production through post WW II era production Model 94s, Model 55s, and Model 64s that I can locate. For those of you who are interested and would like to participate in a survey concerning several different production changes made to the Models 94, 55, and 64, please review the information that I am specifically looking for, and then post your information here on this topic, or you can send it to me directly at Win1885@msn.com.
5/24/202 Edit 4: Well, here I am again, and still at it. As of today, I now have logged (surveyed) just shy of 25,000 specimens, and I still looking for more. For the past number of years, I have been collaborating with Robert (Bob) C. Renneberg, and have written and published a number of articles of my own discussing the Model 1894(94), Model 55, and Model 64 production. I have added serial numbers 1 - 7499 to my survey list (looking for the semi-rare "First" models. Please get in touch with me via email if you have an interest in supporting the research survey.
12/8/2014 Edit 3: I have surpassed 10,500 total serial numbers in this research survey, and I am still working towards reaching the 16,000 mark. Due to a welcome increase in the number of people who are actively assisting me with this research, I plan to continue this survey well beyond my original goal. Sometime early next year (2015), I will post the current results of the survey in an easy to read format.
9/24/2011 Edit 2: I am rapidly closing in on (5,000) total serial numbers in this survey, and I would like to surpass that mark before the end of this month. The various production numbers represented in the survey have firmed up considerably in this past year, and I do not believe that they will change by any significant % as the survey continues to progress. Still, it is my intention to keep this survey alive and growing until I reach the (16,120) total serial numbers surveyed mark (1% of the total numbers in the survey range). At that point, I will publish a statistical analysis reference document detailing my findings.
Edit 1: I have come to the realization that I need to ask all of the following questions...
1. The complete serial number (please, no partial serial numbers).
2. The exact caliber stamp marking.
3. The specific type of butt plate, e.g. Carbine, serrated steel shotgun style, flat checkered steel, hard rubber, or the checkered steel plate with the widows peak and diamond surrounding the lower screw hole.
4. The type (style) of the upper tang marking, e.g. type 5, 6, or 7, or if it is blank.
5. Is the left side of the receiver factory drilled & tapped for a peep sight?
6. Does it have U.S. martial or Canadian PCMR markings on the receiver frame?
7. Does it have a Nickel Steel or a Proof Steel marked barrel?
8. Does it have a saddle ring?
9. If in the 1,200,000 - 1,270,000 serial range, is the bottom of the receiver marked with a "W"?
10. If in the 1,260,000 - 1,330,000 serial range, does the leading "1" digit look like an "L"?
11. If in the 1,370,000 - 1,560,000 serial range, does it have a flat-band or a milled front barrel band?
12. If in the 1,700,000 - 1,770,000 serial range, does it have the long or the short forend stock?
13. If it is a Model 55, is it a Take Down or Solid frame?
14. If it is a Model 64, is it standard Rifle, a Deer Rifle (deluxe), a standard Carbine, or a deluxe Carbine?
More specifically, I am trying to determine the serial number transition points for the caliber markings on the barrel...
(1) "30 W.C.F." versus "30-30 WIN" marked barrels,
(2) "32 W.S." versus "32 WIN. SPL."
(3) "25-35 W.C.F." versus "25-35 WIN."
(4) The transition point from the traditional curved steel carbine butt plate, to the steel shotgun style with the horizontal cut lines (serrated), and again the later transition to the flat checkered steel plates.
(5) Upper Tang roll stamp types (e.g. Type 5, 6, 7, or blank)
(6) Those guns that were factory drilled & tapped for a receiver mounted peep sight (Lyman or Redfield).
(7) The transition from the milled front barrel band to the flat-band, and then back to the milled band.
(8) The exact serial range for the "W" stamped guns...
(9) The exact serial range for the leading "L" digit serial number stamped guns...
And finally, I am attempting to determine the precise serial number transition points for the Models 55 and 64.
If you own (or know of) a Model 94, 55, or 64 in the 1,000,000 - 2,700,000 serial range, please take a close look at it, and then either post, or send the information directly to me. Your name and information will remain anonymous if you email the information to me. I will post updated results in this Sticky topic as the survey progresses.
In closing, I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this survey, and to all who particiapte in the future. [:)].
Bert H.
0
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quote:Originally posted by vdms55
model 94
1. ser.#1118944
2.30 wcf
3. carbine style
(pictures aren't showing)
4. Winchester
-trade mark-
-made in u.s.a.-
5. small screw near hammer, large screw near rear of tang
6. no markings of these type
7. proof steel
8. no ring
9. (nothing applicable 9 through 14)
Thank you for participating in my research survey. Your Model 94 is a "transitional" Carbine, manufactured on December 22nd, 19360 -
Wow, Bert - lots of interesting information in this thread! I'm a bit late to the party because I just joined the forum but I would like to add a gun to it and find out what I can. It is a Winchester Model 53 lever action, nickel steel, .32 W.C.F., chambered in .32-20, solid (not takedown). The S/N is 5517. The tang has 3 lines: WINCHESTER; -Trademark-; and - Made in U.S.A.-, top of hammer is checkered. This rifle belonged to my grandfather who often used it to hunt woodchucks in Western NYS with his buddies. I'm now 71 and I think the Model 53 was manufactured between 1924 and 1932 in the caliber above plus .44-40 and .25-20.
When I inherited the rifle the only thing I noticed that it needed was a replacement of the lever pivot pin, which I had done by a gunsmith to insure that everything remained genuine. The rifle has been well cared for but bears the character of one that has seen some use! The bluing is pretty much gone but there is no rust. The bore is shiny bright and the wood has a nice patina gained only through age and with the dings and dents that probably have some stories behind them. The butt plate is also nickel steel, plain at the top and bottom with horizontal lines in the center.
If pictures would be helpful I can e-mail some, the forum doesn't seem to have a way to load them. Any light you can shed on this is appreciated . thanks! Dave (Hoovak1)0 -
Hello Dave,
Thanks for posting the information on your Model 53. Based on the serial number, it was manufactured on 11/27/1925. I intend to forward the information on your Model 53 to a fellow Winchester collector friend of mine who is actively researching the Model 53. If you can do so, please send pictures of your rifle to my personal email address (listed in the opening post).0 -
quote:Originally posted by Bert H.
Hello Dave,
Thanks for posting the information on your Model 53. Based on the serial number, it was manufactured on 11/27/1925. I intend to forward the information on your Model 53 to a fellow Winchester collector friend of mine who is actively researching the Model 53. If you can do so, please send pictures of your rifle to my personal email address (listed in the opening post).
I'll sure do that, and I appreciate the info you gave me on the manufacture date. Dave0 -
Just purchased a Winchester Model 94 Carbine marked -30 WCF-, serial # 1549703, "proof steel", blank top tang, long forearm, flat checkered steel butt plate with a very-very slight curvature, not drilled for scope or peep sight, hooded ramp sight, standard milled barrel band. Hope this helps some [;)] 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Junkballer
Just purchased a Winchester Model 94 Carbine marked -30 WCF-, serial # 1549703, "proof steel", blank top tang, long forearm, flat checkered steel butt plate with a very-very slight curvature, not drilled for scope or peep sight, hooded ramp sight, standard milled barrel band. Hope this helps some [;)]
It does. Can you tell me if it has the flat type front barrel band?0 -
quote:Originally posted by Bert H.
quote:Originally posted by Junkballer
Just purchased a Winchester Model 94 Carbine marked -30 WCF-, serial # 1549703, "proof steel", blank top tang, long forearm, flat checkered steel butt plate with a very-very slight curvature, not drilled for scope or peep sight, hooded ramp sight, standard milled barrel band. Hope this helps some [;)]
It does. Can you tell me if it has the flat type front barrel band?
No, it's not the flat barrel band.......standard I guess is what it would be called.0 -
Pre war transitional variation. 
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I have a pair of pre64's.
Model 64 Standard Rifle DOM 1951 I believe
1. 1782286
2. 30 WCF
3. Checkered steel with widows peak and diamond.
4. Blank
5. Drilled/tapped for peep.(This I assume, as it has a Lyman in place)
6. no
7. Proof Steel marked barrel
8. no
9-13 N/A
14 Model 64 Standard Rifle.
Model 94 Carbine DOM 1963
1. 2586117
2. 30-30 Win
3. serrated steel shotgun style
4. Blank
5. yes
6. No
7. Winchester Proof Steel
8. No
9-14 N/A0 -
quote:Originally posted by callaojoe
I have a pair of pre64's.
Model 64 Standard Rifle DOM 1951 I believe
1. 1782286
2. 30 WCF
3. Checkered steel with widows peak and diamond.
4. Blank
5. Drilled/tapped for peep.(This I assume, as it has a Lyman in place)
6. no
7. Proof Steel marked barrel
8. no
9-13 N/A
14 Model 64 Standard Rifle.
Model 94 Carbine DOM 1963
1. 2586117
2. 30-30 Win
3. serrated steel shotgun style
4. Blank
5. yes
6. No
7. Winchester Proof Steel
8. No
9-14 N/A
1951 is the correct year for your Model 64 standard rifle.
Thank you very much for participating in the survey [^]0 -
Hi Bert,
Hope you are still amassing info. This one is serial 1344397 (last number may be off a bit,pics don't show) I'm not in possession of the rifle yet so I'll link the closed auction.
Regards,
Dennis Rooney
http://www.GunBroker.com/item/5629487920 -
quote:Originally posted by bodydenny
Hi Bert,
Hope you are still amassing info. This one is serial 1344397 (last number may be off a bit,pics don't show) I'm not in possession of the rifle yet so I'll link the closed auction.
Regards,
Dennis Rooney
http://www.GunBroker.com/item/562948792
Hello Dennis,
Yes, I am still surveying the Model 94s. After you get it in hand, please update this post with the verified serial number.0 -
1. 1,344,391
2. 30-W.C.F
3. Butt plate is steel with horizontal rows in the center
4. Tang is blank.
5. no peep sight holes
6. No martial markings.
7. Barrel proof is covered by a marbles rear sight,but at lowest setting appears to be the intertwined WP logo
8. No saddle ring
Thanks for any info!!!!!0 -
quote:Originally posted by bodydenny
1. 1,344,391
2. 30-W.C.F
3. Butt plate is steel with horizontal rows in the center
4. Tang is blank.
5. no peep sight holes
6. No martial markings.
7. Barrel proof is covered by a marbles rear sight,but at lowest setting appears to be the intertwined WP logo
8. No saddle ring
Thanks for any info!!!!!
Per the original Winchester factory serialization records, your Model 94 Carbine was manufactured very shortly after production resumed at the end of WW II, on 10/17/1945. It is completely standard.0 -
Thanks Bert,
I pulled the magazine tube and the date "42" was stamped on the barrel. Could the barreled receiver have been left as an assembly and then finished in 1945?0 -
quote:Originally posted by bodydenny
Thanks Bert,
I pulled the magazine tube and the date "42" was stamped on the barrel. Could the barreled receiver have been left as an assembly and then finished in 1945?
No. The serial number clearly indicated that the receiver was not manufactured until October of 1945. Production of the Model 94 was temporarily halted in late August of 1942 to support the WW II efforts. At the time production was halted, Winchester had a stock pile of "42" barrels ready to use. When Production resumed in September of 1945, new receiver frames were made, and the remaining stock of 1942 barrels were used to assemble them.0 -
Thanks for the info,Bert!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 0 -
Bert. I have 101626. Deluxe pistol grip,with checkered non-select wood. 26" full Oct/full mag, type 1A receiver. Smooth rifle crescent butt, 30 WCF top flat of barrel close to receiver. "Manufactured by the Winchester Arms ..." On the top of barrel and two-line "Nickel steel barrel specially for smokeless..." on the top left flat. (No saddle ring, no extra tang or receiver holes) Small profile silver front sight with screw on right side to secure to barrel and two leaf flip up rear with no elevator. 0 -
G 0 -
quote:Originally posted by MrGnA
Bert. I have 101626. Deluxe pistol grip,with checkered non-select wood. 26" full Oct/full mag, type 1A receiver. Smooth rifle crescent butt, 30 WCF top flat of barrel close to receiver. "Manufactured by the Winchester Arms ..." On the top of barrel and two-line "Nickel steel barrel specially for smokeless..." on the top left flat. (No saddle ring, no extra tang or receiver holes) Small profile silver front sight with screw on right side to secure to barrel and two leaf flip up rear with no elevator.
The serial number on your Model 1894 identifies it as a November 1900 production rifle. More than likely it has the I-pattern checkering, which would make it a "semi-deluxe" rifle.0 -
Bert,
I also am e-mailing you some pictures.
1. 1371234
2. 30-W.C.F
3. Flat checkered steel
4. Blank
5. No
6. ?
7. Proof Steel
8. No
11. Milled
Let me know if you need any other info.
Thanks0 -
quote:Originally posted by hipshoot
Bert,
I also am e-mailing you some pictures.
1. 1371234
2. 30-W.C.F
3. Flat checkered steel
4. Blank
5. No
6. ?
7. Proof Steel
8. No
11. Milled
Let me know if you need any other info.
Thanks
Thanks! The only question I have is which hammer type it has... knurled (checkered) or serrated?0 -
Knurled 0 -
Hope you still need this info on my recently acquired Model 94.
1. 1373057
2. 30 W.C.F.
3. Checkered Steel
4. Blank
5. No
6. No
7. Proof Steel
8. No
9. N/A
10.N/A
11.Flat Band
12.N/A
13.N/A
14.N/A
Hammer is checkered with a matte finish on top.
46 under barrel.
Is it possible to narrow the DOM in 1946?0 -
quote:Originally posted by lancerdg
Hope you still need this info on my recently acquired Model 94.
1. 1373057
2. 30 W.C.F.
3. Checkered Steel
4. Blank
5. No
6. No
7. Proof Steel
8. No
9. N/A
10.N/A
11.Flat Band
12.N/A
13.N/A
14.N/A
Hammer is checkered with a matte finish on top.
46 under barrel.
Is it possible to narrow the DOM in 1946?
I do, and yes it is... your Model 94 Flat-band was manufactured in July 1946.
Thank you for adding your Model 94 to the list for the research survey [^]0 -
Bert,
I just sold this a few days ago, in fact it's still here waiting for payment but all boxed up. I still have high res copies of the pics if you can't get what you want from the auction pics.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/808162465
Recoil Rob0 -
Beautiful gun
0 -
Bert H.
Model 94 carbine from earlier I posted pictures of
1. 1,105,441
2. 30 WCF
3.Carbine type
4.Type 6 tang marking with dashes
5.No
6.No
7.Winchester Proof Steel
8.No
0 -
Bert H.
Here is anouther carbine I have.Does have serrated hammer and long wood forend.Milled band.
1. 1,590,090
2. 30 WCF
3. Flat checkered steel
4. Tang is blank
5. NOT drilled for peep
6. No US or markings
7. Winchester Proof Steel
8. No saddlering
0 -
Model 94
- 1617251 ( alegedly from 1949 ) still all original, plain jane
- 32 W.S.
- Flat checkered steel
- don't see any mark
- not prepped for peep
- no Marshal or PCHR
- proof steel ( oval with P W overlayed in oval )
- No ring
the rest are N/A by S/N or model
milled bands
0
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