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Viper on the Driveway

allen griggs

I was going for my 3 mile walk with the Beagle today and I spotted this beast on the driveway.  Is this a Mongrolian Cobra, or what?
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Comments

32 comments

Date Votes
  • austin20

    Snake in the grass


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  • pulsarnc

    According to my wife it would soon be a dead snake ! Non poisonous

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  • Brookwood
    I'd call it a Jowl-less viper!   Without jowl's there is not much food value to this northern hillbillie! :D
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  • chiefr
    Garter snake, non poisonous. 
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  • bustedknee
    chiefr said:
    Garter snake, non poisonous. 

    CORRECTION:
    Garter Rattler (Ingrassius Snakus)  also called the Silent Rattler.
    Very common in eastern US.
    Extremely dangerous!

    Many historians believe this is the snake in the book of Genesis that tempted Adam and Eve, subsequently getting them banned from the Garden of Eden.

    Perchance, did the snake offer you an apple?



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  • allen griggs
    I don't kill snakes, except for copperheads.
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  • Butchdog2
    Garter snake, harmless unless you call dirty drawers harmful.
    AKA snow snake? Be careful they might crawl up your butt and freeze you to death.
    On a different note I was mowing the yard a couple days ago, there was a small frog in the yard and every time I made a round I had to wait for him to hop out of the way. After several stops I said that is it, I ran over him with the mower and stopped right where he was sitting, ya'll know when you run over something it usually makes a big mess, not this time. I got off the mower to see what was going on. You won't believe this but he was jumping the blade.
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  • iceracerx
    That might be a lot of things, but a Garter snake it AIN'T!   (there's no yellow stripe down it's back)
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  • Grasshopper
     I agree 100% , that's not how they look in Illinois. 

    I looked up some pics, I guess they are many types, colors of garters.
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  • chiefr
    Another for...that is NOT a garter snake!
    All garter snakes have a stripe down their spine.  It may not always be yellow, but it's always present.
    It doesn't look poisonous based on the shape of its head, but I'm not an expert.
    HeDog should be around to give his synopsis.  
    I say it is a Thamnophis  Sirtalis better known as an Eastern Garter Snake. This one is a lighter colored than I an used to seeing Seen hundreds of them when I lived in NC.
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  • montanajoe
    • Community moderator
    I'm holding it at gunpoint til HeDog gets here,,,
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  • spasmcreeksrun
    never seen a greenish bull snake ... 2-1/2 years a go i picked up the second longest bull snake in my life about  3 miles from home ...little over 6' long , heavy and in great shape.....rare as machinery and chemicals are thinning  em  out here
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  • David Nunn
    Question:  Where was it?  Geographically speaking.

    I see a light stripe on its dorsum, and agree with chiefr.   Need location to help further identify it.


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  • chiefr
    nunn said:
    Question:  Where was it?  Geographically speaking.

    I see a light stripe on its dorsum, and agree with chiefr.   Need location to help further identify it.


    We have seen many variation of snake species as far as color. Even Lindheimeri out west or range are more yellow rather than black. Same with thamnophis and you probably remember the great variations with natrix .   
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  • David Nunn
    There are no more Pantherophis obsoleta lindheimeri.   Lindheimeri has been absorbed into obsoleta.  No subspecies.   Taxonomists with nothing productive to do.
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  • He Dog
    iceracerx said:
    That might be a lot of things, but a Garter snake it AIN'T!   (there's no yellow stripe down it's back)


    A garter snake it most certainly is, there are a number of species and most do not have a yellow stripe down the back.  And to set the record straight, garter snakes are in fact venomous.  They have enlarged teeth at the rear of the mouth connected to the Duvernoy's gland.  They produce a very mild neurotoxic venom, of no medical consequence to humans.  Because the gums are larger than the fang they almost never inject venom with bites, but some people have experienced classic if mild signs of envenomation. 

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  • Rocky Raab
    Round pupils, no pits, no triangular head=non-poisonous (at least in this part of the world). I'm going to veto the garter snake ID because I've never heard of a garter with that scale pattern/coloration. I'm not a herpetologist, but that's my opinion.
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  • allen griggs
    North Carolina mountains.
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  • jimdeere
    In the driveway.
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  • iceracerx
    He Dog said:
    iceracerx said:
    That might be a lot of things, but a Garter snake it AIN'T!   (there's no yellow stripe down it's back)


    A garter snake it most certainly is, there are a number of species and most do not have a yellow stripe down the back.  And to set the record straight, garter snakes are in fact venomous.  They have enlarged teeth at the rear of the mouth connected to the Duvernoy's gland.  They produce a very mild neurotoxic venom, of no medical consequence to humans.  Because the gums are larger than the fang they almost never inject venom with bites, but some people have experienced classic if mild signs of envenomation. 

    As always, I defer to your knowledge.  Thanks for clearing this up.  I must say that I've also never seen a Garter Snake with a body that thick.  No harm in learning something new.
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  • chiefr
    He Dog said:
    iceracerx said:
    That might be a lot of things, but a Garter snake it AIN'T!   (there's no yellow stripe down it's back)


    A garter snake it most certainly is, there are a number of species and most do not have a yellow stripe down the back.  And to set the record straight, garter snakes are in fact venomous.  They have enlarged teeth at the rear of the mouth connected to the Duvernoy's gland.  They produce a very mild neurotoxic venom, of no medical consequence to humans.  Because the gums are larger than the fang they almost never inject venom with bites, but some people have experienced classic if mild signs of envenomation. 

    I have found garter snakes in a number of places I have lived and been bitten by them with no adverse effect. That is when I was young. Probably the act of smearing feces and musk all over anyone's hands and arms who picked one up was far worse than being bitten. Any Natrix was worse.   
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  • Rocky Raab
    Well, I'll be darned. Thanks, HeDog. Still learning something every day (but at age 73, I can learn the same thing every day!)
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  • pulsarnc

    Spent a while googling and drew a blank . Does not match anything I could find for nc , va or tenn . Must be a juvenile coloration of something but just what I don’t know . Sure from head it is non poisonous

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  • Butchdog2
    You must have not Googled just right. That snake is in the garter snake line up. Yes to western NC, that is where we se'um and I am as far west NC as one can get
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  • pulsarnc
    I admit my google talents at times are lacking 🤠
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  • montanajoe
    • Community moderator
    Thanks HeDog
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  • Grasshopper
      The ones around here look "harmless." That thing looks bad azz.
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  • He Dog
    chiefr said:
    He Dog said:
    iceracerx said:
    That might be a lot of things, but a Garter snake it AIN'T!   (there's no yellow stripe down it's back)


    A garter snake it most certainly is, there are a number of species and most do not have a yellow stripe down the back.  And to set the record straight, garter snakes are in fact venomous.  They have enlarged teeth at the rear of the mouth connected to the Duvernoy's gland.  They produce a very mild neurotoxic venom, of no medical consequence to humans.  Because the gums are larger than the fang they almost never inject venom with bites, but some people have experienced classic if mild signs of envenomation. 

    I have found garter snakes in a number of places I have lived and been bitten by them with no adverse effect. That is when I was young. Probably the act of smearing feces and musk all over anyone's hands and arms who picked one up was far worse than being bitten. Any Natrix was worse.   

    Cheifr, like you I have been bitten perhaps 20 or 30 times by several species of garters in the US and Mexico.  I too never experienced a venom reaction.  Venom delivery has arisen at least three times in snake evolution, and in the ophistoglyphs, those with "rear fangs" it appears from position of the grooved teeth near the back of the maxilla that it evolved as a way to subdue prey rather than for defense.  In the vipers/pit vipers and cobras and their relatives the frontal position of the fangs indicates they are used both for defense and subduing prey.  I have known of one envenomation by a garter, and consulted with the doctor treating the bite.  There are a couple of published accounts of bites by a captive hognose snake resulting in envenomation.  There are a few such species that have mouths quite large enough to inflict a bite on a human, and those are feared, such as the mangrove snake and some of the Asian and Latin American vine snakes.  And Natrix is now Nerodia. ;)
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  • Ditch-Runner
      thanks he dog  I never knew  about there poison 
     like a lot of people ?  I have been bitten more times that I can remember by garter snakes even a few black and water snakes but all my fault for not just leaving them alone and having to chase the girls with them LOL  I have had blood on my fingers/ hand from the bites  but never gave it a thought as I was always more interested in washing off there other defense system wow how they can stink up your hand and arm . I was more concerned with infection in a open wound 
      around us poison snakes are rare as hens teeth . 
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  • gartman
    Just when I thought you guys were yanking my chain I found a picture of a "narrow-headed garter snake". No stripes and spots like the one pictured. Didn't get the scienterrific name.
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