Interesting antique single shot
Antique Custom Remington Rolling Block .44 Magnum Real Beauty 44Mag No FFL - Antique Guns at GunBroker.com : 969942625
Buy Antique Custom Remington Rolling Block .44 Magnum Real Beauty 44Mag No FFL : GunBroker is the largest seller of Antique Guns Collectible Firearms All: 969942625
Way past my budget but I like it.
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If I were listing this gun it would never have occurred to me that it could legally ship direct.
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Okay. So now I am pretty thoroughly confused as to the legality of direct ship. Looks like it would be more on the FFL Shipping it out, than a non-FFL receiving it?
I'm not an FFL. The guy shipping it, is.
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My reading of the atf regs would point me to the same conclusion that Allen reached. Once converted it loses its antique designation . I would be very hesitant on shipping and transfer .
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When in doubt, FFL all the way.
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Okay, another Stupid question, I have posted here above.
Would it not be on the FFL/Seller to know the Legalities/Law on shipping this item, as opposed to the receiver - who is a non-FFL purchasing it?
*I sent a PM to the Seller/FFL, requesting he read this thread and get back to me.
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@...: 30364634587035/comments/
Okay, another Stupid question, I have posted here above.
Would it not be on the FFL/Seller to know the Legalities/Law on shipping this item, as opposed to the receiver - who is a non-FFL purchasing it?
*I sent a PM to the Seller/FFL, requesting he read this thread and get back to me.
Yes it is Ken, if he doesn't know the rules, i don't see how it would be your fault.
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I'm no expert but,
I thought with all the modifying/remanufacture of a gun it now has to have a serial number issued to it by the ATF, even if the original never had a serial number, because it is no longer original.
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montanajoe: 30364634587035/comments/
I'm no expert but,
I thought with all the modifying/remanufacture of a gun it now has to have a serial number issued to it by the ATF, even if the original never had a serial number, because it is no longer original.
That would be a major concern to me. If the serial number has been removed, I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole. Removing a serial and manufacturer markings is a major no-no for any firearm according to BATF.
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Y'all remember when Sportsman's Guide was selling antique Mauser rifles converted to 308 Winchester straight to your door? I do. I'd say that was 15 to 20 years ago.
There is an Antique category here on Gunbroker that is somewhat fun to search through. All those guns can go direct to your door - no FFL required.
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Firearms - Guides - Importation & Verification of Firearms, Ammunition - Gun Control Act Definitions - Antique Firearm | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives
Previous Page Download this Section Download the Guidebook Next Page Firearms Verification Gun Control Act Definitions Antique Firearm 18 U.S.C., § 921(A)(16) The term “Antique Firearm” means: A. Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; and B.(16) The term “antique firearm” means—
(A) any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or before 1898; or
(B) any replica of any firearm described in subparagraph (A) if such replica—
(i) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or
(ii) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade; or
(C) any muzzle loading rifle, muzzle loading shotgun, or muzzle loading pistol, which is designed to use black powder, or a black powder substitute, and which cannot use fixed ammunition. For purposes of this subparagraph, the term “antique firearm” shall not include any weapon which incorporates a firearm frame or receiver, any firearm which is converted into a muzzle loading weapon, or any muzzle loading weapon which can be readily converted to fire fixed ammunition by replacing the barrel, bolt, breechblock, or any combination thereof.
U.S.C. Title 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
(1) The term “person” and the term “whoever” include any individual, corporation, company, association, firm, partnership, society, or joint stock company.There is no caliber requirement in the law. If the firearm was manufactured before 1898, it is considered an Antique.
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) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or
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OK then. I learned here.
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Grasshopper: 30364634587035/comments/
) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition, or
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That section (portion) deals with replicas.
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"If the firearm was manufactured before 1898, it is considered an Antique."
You meant, if it was manufactured before 1899.
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The whole OMG "There is No Serial #," thing is just silly. Firearms were manufactured for a Looong time before being required to have them. Apparently there are those here who are unaware of that. Yes "All Stampings were removed." Since this firearm never had a Serial #, No Serial was removed."
The FFL/Seller and I communicated via E-mail last night. He assured me he had received clarification by the ATF and the firearm is considered an "Antique." The Receiver was manufactured prior to 1899.
The FFL/Seller has apprx 3300A+ Sales via Gunbroker. He is not a noob.
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Ken, take it easy man. I didn't make the stupid laws, merely stated that one exists. Don't want to see any trouble over it is all.
Enjoy your new toy if you win.
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Not upset at all @Gregor62. I appreciate the comments from those more knowledgeable than myself as to the Legality. My comment was directed more to those posting about a Serial # being removed. It was not.
FFL/Seller and I had a nice conversation last night. Nice guy willing to answer any questions I put forward. (Again) With apprx 3300 A+ Gunbroker Sales, proven track record and Not a noob.
I appreciate the comments put forward on this thread. Did not mean to sound like I did not.
- Ken -
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What you are seeing is exactly what the alphabet agency seems to want. Confusion, uncertainty, and asking permissions from government.
There was a poor fellow on here the other day asking whether he needed to use an FFL to sell ammo. Sickening where we are in regards to the never ending ridiculous laws.
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I am pretty sure a Remington Rolling Block shipped with a serial number and if that number has been removed then yes that is a problem. If that gun shipped to my shop, there is no way I would transfer it. There is a process where ATF will assign a serial number to a weapon where the serial number is missing. I had to do this on a Win 1894 that I bought for the store a few years back. As I understand the law concerning antique weapons, this one does not qualify. Just as I stated earlier. Having said this, I really matters not at all to me how the transaction is handled.
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IMO Ken it's pretty simple, if the FFL will ship it directly to you, then by all means do it. If there's a problem, it's on him. He's the one who should know all the rules.
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I might be wrong but any firearm that was in original condition as an antique. Then changed to something new is not an antique anymore. Being it is in 44magnum would make it a new firearm. Therefore it would need to be transferred. It could be listed as no serial number found. It's just my understanding.
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Oh ohhh, got out bid
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Only by a couple of bucks?
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Oh Well.
Someone wants it worse than I do.
No Worries.
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I'll lend you the other $25.00 if you really want it,,,
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Quitter! C'mon, Ken! You can do it!
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OMG, big nose kate is trying to snipe it and cummins aint gonna have that,,,
Bid War
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$1600 ????
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SOLD
$1625
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Don't feel bad Ken. For that money you can get a lever action & have change left over.
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drobs: 30364634587035/comments/
Y'all remember when Sportsman's Guide was selling antique Mauser rifles converted to 308 Winchester straight to your door? I do. I'd say that was 15 to 20 years ago.
There is an Antique category here on Gunbroker that is somewhat fun to search through. All those guns can go direct to your door - no FFL required.
Thanks. Now I have 125 pages of listings to pour through. Time to fire up the pot of coffee. Might be a long night.🤣
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