I am humbled by officers restraint
It's easy to say all cops are bad, that they are trigger happy, they shoot 1st and are reckless. I was watching "COPS" on fox.com and I saw something that shocked me. There was 8-9 police officers asking, begging a man with a knife to drop it, they asked easily 20 times giving him space telling him "please drop the knife buddy" and it wasn't until he did swing at an officer that only 1 officer did shoot him and I believe it was in the leg in the or the gut. Even after that they explained they will help and were gentle lowering him to the ground. I kind of wish more people could see that and know that not all police are trigger happy. thanks for listening
Matt
Matt
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-Unfortunately, the majority are trigger happy. I was talking to a local police lieutenant who told me that if he had to use his weapon he would make sure the victim was shot dead, because he did not want to be involved in any litigation. So, in other words, this man had already made plans to commit murder and hide behind his badge.
Remember Bruce Springsteen's protest song, 41 Shots, protesting the shooting by 3 policemen of an unarmed black immigrant they cornered in a doorway? The 3 were cleared of any wrong-doing.
So, it is unusual and good to see that they are not all the same.0 -
quote:was shot dead, because he did not want to be involved in any litigation
I can assure you if I ever need to shoot someone in self defence I will be the very same way,If I fire it will be to kill ,not to wound,,and by the way,I'm not a cop and not trigger happy,but I dont want a low life piece of crap that broke into my house suing me because I only wounded him0 -
quote:Originally posted by cantbecivil
It's easy to say all cops are bad, that they are trigger happy, they shoot 1st and are reckless. I was watching "COPS" on fox.com and I saw something that shocked me. There was 8-9 police officers asking, begging a man with a knife to drop it, they asked easily 20 times giving him space telling him "please drop the knife buddy" and it wasn't until he did swing at an officer that only 1 officer did shoot him and I believe it was in the leg in the or the gut. Even after that they explained they will help and were gentle lowering him to the ground. I kind of wish more people could see that and know that not all police are trigger happy. thanks for listening
Matt
That show has been airing for 5 years. I have seen it 2 times, and turned the channel on it 6 times, and i hardly ever watch TV.
They did, what they did because their was 10 cams on em.
Had it been me .I would have put a CANOE, right down the middle of his WIG! Then ask the camera man if that was good'nuff!!
That's what they wanted to see anyhow0 -
quote:Originally posted by sharpshooter039
quote:was shot dead, because he did not want to be involved in any litigation
I can assure you if I ever need to shoot someone in self defence I will be the very same way,If I fire it will be to kill ,not to wound,,and by the way,I'm not a cop and not trigger happy,but I dont want a low life piece of crap that broke into my house suing me because I only wounded him
If you ever need your gun to save the life of yourself or your loved ones, you better shoot to kill. Reason being that even if you shoot to kill, you will most likely only make a "wound only" hit. The most important thing to do when trying to shoot someone that is coming at you with the intention of doing death/serious bodily harm, is to shoot to kill. Even if you are lucky you will likely only slow or stop the perp, but you will not kill him/her.
To test this statement, the next time you encounter some "road rage" action, at the peak of the altercation try to imagine just how well you would be able to handle your firearm and place your shots if your mind and body was under similar stress.0 -
I watched it a few years ago. The cops really had cool heads were very responsible and. As I remember they were not in a great deal of danger due to fact of the mans range and the weapons trained on him. The guy was mentally ill and they saved his life. Heroes indeed. 0 -
I can tell all of you this, after almost ten years on the military and over 17 years with the local P.D., if I ever get into a critical incident and have to fire my weapon I will fire dead center mass. Not because I want to "murder" anyone but because that is how I have been trained. I firmly believe that if you are put into a critical situation you will fall back on training as you will not have time to analyze all the facts and make a lengthy decision on what to do. If you hesitate you will die.
I believe that most of the folks that bad mouth the Police about being trigger happy would stand and talk on the phone to the local 911 dispatch while someone, especially a Police Officer, were being beat to death and not lift a finger to help. I better quit now, this is pi**ing me off.
Bode0 -
Why don't the cops use a net for these knife cases. A guy is standing there waving the knife, the cops could get a net, like a fishing net, say five feet high and thirty feet long. Two cops stretch the net out, and bum rush the guy. You would need some young, strong athletic cops to work the net.
Neither cop is within fifteen feet of the guy, he is pinned to the ground by the net, it would not be too hard to disarm him at that point.
Walk right up and empty a full can of pepper spray in his face, for starters.
You could make the net of thin steel cable, the psycho couldn't cut it.0 -
I love ignorant statements about most cops being trigger happy. I have worked in and around law enforcement for over 25 years. I have seen weapons drawn and seen situations where the police would have been justified in shooting in self defense. They instead kept talking and working with the individual until it was resolved without shots being fired
I personally stood in with the local ERT team a few years back and talked a guy out of the house where he was holed up. He had eariler injured two LEO's with a homemade bomb. They could have taken him out but did not.
So before you paint all cops as trigger happy, maybe you better quit listening to Bruce Springstein and see what the facts really are.0 -
I am a police officer and I am not trigger happy. I've had to pull
my weapon several times. One being on a man with a knife. It would
have been a clean shoot. But I showed restraint and did not pull
the trigger. He finally submitted and was arrested peacefully.
All of the people saying what they will or will not do probably haven't been in life threatening situations where split second
decisions have to be made. There's no time to think and you have
to fall back on training. You don't shoot to kill, you shoot to
neutralize the threat, if the perp lives or dies, that's up to a
higher power. People who second guess the police or military
have no right to because they haven't walked in their shoes.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Wolf.
--
-Unfortunately, the majority are trigger happy. I was talking to a local police lieutenant who told me that if he had to use his weapon he would make sure the victim was shot dead, because he did not want to be involved in any litigation. So, in other words, this man had already made plans to commit murder and hide behind his badge.
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."-Albert Einstein0 -
I'm not surprised anymore when I hear some people say "they could do that or this instead of --" Everyone is an instant expert. People still say OJ couldn't have killed two people with a knife--" why, he couldn't stab two people before they could run away or grab him" ---BSBSBS. In firearms training we used to have an officer stand with holstered weapon (training gun of course) 21 feet away from the instructor with a knife (rubber of course). Without warning the instructor would charge the officer. I never saw anyone get his holstered handgun out and shoot before he was "stabbed" at least twice. When the bad guy knows what and when he is going to act you are disadvantaged. It happens quicker than you realize. What do you think the bad guy is going to do while you are getting your "net" or whatever ready, not just stand there and let you get him. Something else really grips me, when people say "it took 5 cops to catch that one little guy". Get some of your buddies together, 6-8 will do, pick the smallest one there and all you guys try to catch and hold him. If he really resists you will learn something. It ain't so damn easy. You don't know everything if you ain't been there. 0 -
The net would only be viable in a situation like the one in this thread, when there are lots of cops on the scene.
If the guy charges while two cops are getting the net ready, the other seven cops shoot him, just as they would have done anyway.0 -
quote:Why don't the cops use a net for these knife cases. A guy is standing there waving the knife, the cops could get a net, like a fishing net, say five feet high and thirty feet long. Two cops stretch the net out, and bum rush the guy. You would need some young, strong athletic cops to work the net.
Neither cop is within fifteen feet of the guy, he is pinned to the ground by the net, it would not be too hard to disarm him at that point.
Walk right up and empty a full can of pepper spray in his face, for starters.
You could make the net of thin steel cable, the psycho couldn't cut it.
[:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]
That's funny right there. I don't care who ya are. Bad guy/deranged person/murderer with a knife, and two cops are supposed to run up to him with a 30 foot by 6 foot net made of steel cables and throw it over him. Maybe on TV...if The Twilight Zone ever comes back. [:D][:D][:D]
quote:-Unfortunately, the majority are trigger happy...Remember Bruce Springsteen's protest song, 41 Shots, protesting the shooting by 3 policemen of an unarmed black immigrant they cornered in a doorway? The 3 were cleared of any wrong-doing.
How about "Four Dead In Ohio?" The National Guard must be trigger happy, too, if we form our judgements based on the lyrics of popular rock & roll songs. [xx(]
Two things I know:
1. If "most cops" really were trigger happy, police shootings would be so commonplace that they wouldn't even be newsworthy.
2. If I were trigger happy, there would be at least four fewer people walking around today.
Thank you, Armchair Experts of America.0 -
quote:Originally posted by fideau
I'm not surprised anymore when I hear some people say "they could do that or this instead of --" Everyone is an instant expert. People still say OJ couldn't have killed two people with a knife--" why, he couldn't stab two people before they could run away or grab him" ---BSBSBS. In firearms training we used to have an officer stand with holstered weapon (training gun of course) 21 feet away from the instructor with a knife (rubber of course). Without warning the instructor would charge the officer. I never saw anyone get his holstered handgun out and shoot before he was "stabbed" at least twice. When the bad guy knows what and when he is going to act you are disadvantaged. It happens quicker than you realize. What do you think the bad guy is going to do while you are getting your "net" or whatever ready, not just stand there and let you get him. Something else really grips me, when people say "it took 5 cops to catch that one little guy". Get some of your buddies together, 6-8 will do, pick the smallest one there and all you guys try to catch and hold him. If he really resists you will learn something. It ain't so damn easy. You don't know everything if you ain't been there.
The 21 feet is used because that is known as the Tueller Drill, which shows that a person can traverse 21 feet, in an average of 1.5 seconds!0 -
"them and us"
Doug0 -
You would make the net with thin steel cable, 1/8 inch. It wouldn't weigh over 30 pounds.
I realize that most female cops couldn't handle an end of that net, but an agile young man could.
fideau said:"When the bad guy knows what and when he is going to act you are disadvantaged."
That's right. The cops are standing around waiting for the bad guy to do something. He has the initiative.
The net gives the initiative to the cops.
You make the net black, with black poles. At night the bad guy wouldn't even see it.0 -
And of course the "net" would be issued to every officer and carried
in a cute little case on their duty belts, right? We could whip it out and deploy it while engaging in some light hearted conversation
on the meaning of life. Yeah right. And so the officers trying
to deploy the net have to approach the subject with this net placing
themselves in more danger. Sooo..... you want to try this?
Why not just use the tazer and it's over with. Non-lethal and
nobody gets hurt.0 -
It would be best to carry the net in the trunk.
If deployed right, the officer would not get closer to the bad guy than fifteen feet.
If you are afraid of dangerous situations, you should get a new job.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Doug Wilson
"them and us"
Doug
That's bout what it boils down to. All us decent folks against those who would wave knives around in public.
Even if I wasn't a cop I'd say just shoot the bastage. He dealt that hand and there's no reason for anyone else's life to be in danger.0 -
quote:It would be best to carry the net in the trunk.
If deployed right, the officer would not get closer to the bad guy than fifteen feet.
If you are afraid of dangerous situations, you should get a new job.
You just don't get it, do you? Tell you what...Soon as you have a prototype net made up, ship it here and we'll test it for you.
Doo-doo-doo-doo----Doo-doo-doo-doo...(Twilight Zone theme tune)
No offense, but it does appear that you might be happier if police in this country went unarmed, as their counterparts in England do. But, then England is a more "civilized" country, since no one, not even the crooks, are allowed to carry guns.
Afraid of dangerous situations? Just afraid enough to always wear two pistols and body armor, and to wait for backup when prudent. How afraid are you? You ever don the badge and gun and pull a night shift?0 -
quote:Originally posted by allen griggs
Why don't the cops use a net for these knife cases. .....
That damned Marlin Perkins.
Never there when you need him.0 -
quote:Originally posted by allen griggs
If you are afraid of dangerous situations, you should get a new job....he said from the safety and security of his keyboard.
Sounds like maybe you should have your local agency keep your phone number on file in case they get a suicidal nutjob with a knife call. You can show them how it should be done. [B)]0 -
quote:Originally posted by nunn
You ever don the badge and gun and pull a night shift?
I have not but every time the alarm at the plant goes off, I am the one leading the cops thru the plant looking for the reason. If you cops are so brave, why don't you take the lead? You guys are human, not super human, get over it. Jeeze, I have even had to put down road hit cattle because the cops just couldn't. Don0 -
...The restraint shown by the VAST majority of LEO's, is one reason why I am NOT an LEO today. Congrats to all the great cops out there, so I DON'T have to fight my way thru town.
..Or if the person is a whacko, a contributing, caring member of society, LEO, should take the CHANCE of dieing, to see that the whacko is safe???? BS!! Life ain't fair, get past it.
...Nets?? Screw the scum-bags! While good honest people WORK, these sub-humans "work" at stealing what an honest person WORKS for. I have no sympathy for the POS, kick the trash to the curb Officer's...you won't hear me sniveling when you do, thank you all and be safe...[;)]
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Brain fart 101. Point a gun at a cop, die. That's fair! Point one at me, I'm going to try to do the same thing! 0 -
IF ANYBODY HAS A PROBLEM WITH THE COPS MAYBE IT IS BECAUSE YOU ARE THE PROBLEM,I HAVE SEEN ALOT OF THE CRAP LEO HAVE TO GO THRU AND PUT UP WITH AND I SHOW THEM NOTHING BUT THE HIGHEST RESPECT.I HEAR PEOPLE BITCH ABOUT THE COPS BUT IF YOU WERE IN A BURNING PILE OF WRECKEGE AND A COP CAME ALONG TO DRAG YOU TO SAFTY I BET YOUR BUTT YOU WOULD BE THANKFUL..I THINK PEOPLE WHO TRASH TALK THE LEO NEED TO WISE UP AND LOOK AT ALL THEY DO.[:(!][:(!] 0 -
I agree, a taser could have prevented the use of a pistol in that particular situation. Too bad they didn't have any on hand. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Wolf.
--
-Unfortunately, the majority are trigger happy. I was talking to a local police lieutenant who told me that if he had to use his weapon he would make sure the victim was shot dead, because he did not want to be involved in any litigation. So, in other words, this man had already made plans to commit murder and hide behind his badge.
Remember Bruce Springsteen's protest song, 41 Shots, protesting the shooting by 3 policemen of an unarmed black immigrant they cornered in a doorway? The 3 were cleared of any wrong-doing.
So, it is unusual and good to see that they are not all the same.
I'm going to disagree with you. In the last few months of my schooling to become a police officer, I have had the privalege to get to know many officers from all over the state, i.e. different departments, and I don't think any one of them is trigger happy. Most police officers, in my experience, are police officers not for the oppertunity to legally kill someone, but because they truely believe, deep in their heart and soul, that their role in the community as a police officer is making a difference, and making the lives of the people who live in their community better in some way.0 -
quote:Originally posted by cantbecivil
It's easy to say all cops are bad, that they are trigger happy, they shoot 1st and are reckless. I was watching "COPS" on fox.com and I saw something that shocked me. There was 8-9 police officers asking, begging a man with a knife to drop it, they asked easily 20 times giving him space telling him "please drop the knife buddy" and it wasn't until he did swing at an officer that only 1 officer did shoot him and I believe it was in the leg in the or the gut. Even after that they explained they will help and were gentle lowering him to the ground. I kind of wish more people could see that and know that not all police are trigger happy. thanks for listening
Matt
If COPS ever showed cops in a bad light, do you think any department would cooperate and let them ride in the cars? Lots of times, police officers, not on camera, do show great restraint in not shooting people. Unfortunately, lots of times they don't. The citizens shot that are unarmed are the ones I really question. "I thought he had a weapon so I shot". Does that really fly? Do hunters say "I thought I saw a deer so I shot" What kind of idiot would do that? Never fire unless you are sure of your target. Anyone ever heard that before? Seems like when dealing with a human life, a little more justification than "I thought" is needed.0 -
Hey I watch TV. 15 cops all yelling at once just like screw balls. DROP THE GUN, DROPTHEGUN, DOPTEUN, DPHTUNGTOPEJKLFI, DPEHGYHTMDSH, ETC, ETC, and you just know if it is on tv it must be true! I just don't know what is wrong with LEOs around here, because none of them do that. I keep telling them they have to watch more TV to see how it is supposed to be done. 0
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