Aux. Cop is above the law in ILL.
Creve Couer chief says man who shot at carjacker should be commended
http://www.pjstar.com/stories/122007/TRI_BF8O0QTJ.013.php
Related stories
Officer 'was scared to death' (12/20/2007)
He would do it over again (12/20/2007)
Thursday, December 20, 2007
By MICHAEL Smothers and Leslie Fark
of the Journal Star
CREVE COEUR - Even if he was an average citizen, Chad Hjortshoj had the right to shoot twice at a carjacker, not only to protect himself but a woman the thief had beaten and appeared ready to run over, Creve Coeur's police chief said Wednesday.
As one of the village's auxiliary police officers, Hjortshoj, 34, performed correctly within his training when he reacted to the crime rapidly unfolding before him Monday night in a Peoria shopping center parking lot, said Chief Mike Button. Button also served on the Peoria police force, retiring as assistant chief.
Hjortshoj, a rural Hanna City resident who works in construction and has served 18 months as a Creve Coeur auxiliary officer, should be both commended and cleared of any allegations of wrongdoing, Button said. He's confident Peoria County State's Attorney Kevin Lyons will agree.
"I support what he did because he was trying to save a woman's life" and protect his own when William Ransom appeared prepared to back an SUV over a Karen L. Kinsey, whom he had assaulted, then tried to run him down, Button said.
Hjortshoj "was not suffering from John Wayne syndrome" and overreacting, Button said, when he fired two shots at the vehicle, one when the man turned the vehicle toward him and one after it struck him with a glancing blow.
In fact, "He was scared to death," Button said.
Hjortshoj was justified in his actions because he was reacting in response to a "forcible felony" as any citizen, legally carrying a firearm in his vehicle, as Hjortshoj was, has the right to do, Button said.
Lyons said after Ransom's bond hearing Wednesday he would not charge Hjortshoj, saying, rather, he would give him a "round of applause."
The county's top prosecutor said it appeared the officer was trying to assist Kinsey as well as stop a career criminal who had struck two cars as he tried to flee the Northwoods Mall parking lot. That said, Lyons said he wasn't in favor of a conceal and carry law which would allow private citizens to carry a firearm.
Such a move, in this situation, could have meant someone could have fired at the police officer, thinking he was the perpetrator.
Creve Coeur has employed five volunteer auxiliary officers over the past two years.
According to Illinois law, it is illegal for auxiliary police officers to carry firearms on their person if they are not in uniform and performing job duties, unless they have permission from the police chief.
Directing traffic, keeping order during a natural or man-made disaster and assisting in civil disorder as directed by the police chief are the only duties the state says municipalities can assign auxiliary police officers.
Based on those guidelines, municipalities that choose to activate an auxiliary unit can adopt their own ordinance and set parameters based on the community's need.
Though the village has auxiliary officers, the Illinois Law Enforcement Training and Standards Board had no record Wednesday of the municipality registering the unit.
"The board doesn't recognize auxiliary officers from a municipality that does not have an ordinance on file with us authorizing them to have auxiliaries," said a board spokesperson who asked to remain anonymous. "They may have an ordinance, but they have not furnished documentation to us."
The spokesperson added the board sent a letter in October 2006 to all law enforcement administrators in Illinois, stating if they opt to have conservators of the peace or auxiliary police they needed to send the board an ordinance detailing the officers' duties.
Button insisted he's registered the necessary documents with the board, but it has lost the documents.
"We've registered twice," he said.
Michael Smothers can be reached at 686-3287 or msmothers@pjstar.com. Leslie Fark can be reached at 686-3188 or lfark@pjstar.com. Andy Kravetz contributed to this story.
http://www.pjstar.com/stories/122007/TRI_BF8O0QTJ.013.php
Related stories
Officer 'was scared to death' (12/20/2007)
He would do it over again (12/20/2007)
Thursday, December 20, 2007
By MICHAEL Smothers and Leslie Fark
of the Journal Star
CREVE COEUR - Even if he was an average citizen, Chad Hjortshoj had the right to shoot twice at a carjacker, not only to protect himself but a woman the thief had beaten and appeared ready to run over, Creve Coeur's police chief said Wednesday.
As one of the village's auxiliary police officers, Hjortshoj, 34, performed correctly within his training when he reacted to the crime rapidly unfolding before him Monday night in a Peoria shopping center parking lot, said Chief Mike Button. Button also served on the Peoria police force, retiring as assistant chief.
Hjortshoj, a rural Hanna City resident who works in construction and has served 18 months as a Creve Coeur auxiliary officer, should be both commended and cleared of any allegations of wrongdoing, Button said. He's confident Peoria County State's Attorney Kevin Lyons will agree.
"I support what he did because he was trying to save a woman's life" and protect his own when William Ransom appeared prepared to back an SUV over a Karen L. Kinsey, whom he had assaulted, then tried to run him down, Button said.
Hjortshoj "was not suffering from John Wayne syndrome" and overreacting, Button said, when he fired two shots at the vehicle, one when the man turned the vehicle toward him and one after it struck him with a glancing blow.
In fact, "He was scared to death," Button said.
Hjortshoj was justified in his actions because he was reacting in response to a "forcible felony" as any citizen, legally carrying a firearm in his vehicle, as Hjortshoj was, has the right to do, Button said.
Lyons said after Ransom's bond hearing Wednesday he would not charge Hjortshoj, saying, rather, he would give him a "round of applause."
The county's top prosecutor said it appeared the officer was trying to assist Kinsey as well as stop a career criminal who had struck two cars as he tried to flee the Northwoods Mall parking lot. That said, Lyons said he wasn't in favor of a conceal and carry law which would allow private citizens to carry a firearm.
Such a move, in this situation, could have meant someone could have fired at the police officer, thinking he was the perpetrator.
Creve Coeur has employed five volunteer auxiliary officers over the past two years.
According to Illinois law, it is illegal for auxiliary police officers to carry firearms on their person if they are not in uniform and performing job duties, unless they have permission from the police chief.
Directing traffic, keeping order during a natural or man-made disaster and assisting in civil disorder as directed by the police chief are the only duties the state says municipalities can assign auxiliary police officers.
Based on those guidelines, municipalities that choose to activate an auxiliary unit can adopt their own ordinance and set parameters based on the community's need.
Though the village has auxiliary officers, the Illinois Law Enforcement Training and Standards Board had no record Wednesday of the municipality registering the unit.
"The board doesn't recognize auxiliary officers from a municipality that does not have an ordinance on file with us authorizing them to have auxiliaries," said a board spokesperson who asked to remain anonymous. "They may have an ordinance, but they have not furnished documentation to us."
The spokesperson added the board sent a letter in October 2006 to all law enforcement administrators in Illinois, stating if they opt to have conservators of the peace or auxiliary police they needed to send the board an ordinance detailing the officers' duties.
Button insisted he's registered the necessary documents with the board, but it has lost the documents.
"We've registered twice," he said.
Michael Smothers can be reached at 686-3287 or msmothers@pjstar.com. Leslie Fark can be reached at 686-3188 or lfark@pjstar.com. Andy Kravetz contributed to this story.
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He would do it over again
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Related stories
Officer 'was scared to death' (12/20/2007)
He would do it over again (12/20/2007)
Thursday, December 20, 2007
BY FRANK RADOSEVICH II
OF THE JOURNAL STAR
Creve Coeur - Seated in his truck at the Northwoods Mall parking lot Monday night, Chad R. Hjortshoj thought he heard what sounded like a scream. After opening his door, the muffled noise became clearer - a woman's voice yelling for help.
Hjortshoj, 34, had finished shopping before his wife and was reading a magazine when he heard the shouts. A Creve Coeur auxiliary police officer and off duty at the time, Hjortshoj unlocked his glove box, grabbed his unloaded pistol and badge and headed toward the commotion.
In the span of what he estimated was about one minute, Hjortshoj confronted a carjacker and fired two shots at the man who nearly ran him over. Though left shaken, Hjortshoj has mulled over the events of that night and said he would not change a thing.
"I yelled at him to stop and to put his hands where I could see them," he said Wednesday during a telephone interview. "I was shooting to stop him from killing me."
Authorities would later arrest 52-year-old William H. Ransom, who Hjortshoj and the victim, Karen L. Kinsey, 50, of Varna later identified as the attacker.
According to police, Ransom tried to take Kinsey's purse and struck her repeatedly when she refused to let go, eventually grabbing the keys to her sport-utility vehicle.
Hjortshoj said he saw Ransom dragging and beating Kinsey as he ran the 100 or so feet to confront him. Before he could reach them, Ransom jumped into the SUV, leaving Kinsey lying at the rear of the vehicle and tended to by other bystanders.
Coming around to the driver's side window, Hjortshoj flashed Ransom his gun, now loaded, and badge and told him to get out of the car. Ransom, locked inside, did not budge.
"He knew I was a police officer, looked me dead in the eyes and wasn't going to stop," Hjortshoj recalled.
Ransom put the SUV in gear and quickly reversed out of the parking spot. As the vehicle hopped a short curb and rammed two parked vehicles, Hjortshoj approached the hood of the SUV, blocking Ransom's escape, or so he thought. There, Hjortshoj said, he could see Ransom trying to shift the SUV into drive.
Thinking Ransom had just backed over Kinsey and not knowing if he was armed, Hjortshoj said he feared for his life. As Ransom shifted and stepped on the gas, Hjortshoj fired once - with the bullet lodging itself in the windshield - and tried to slide out of the way.
He did not fire as Ransom fled the parking lot, as previously stated in the Journal Star. "That's not something I would have done nor did I do," he said.
Apparently still trying to leave, Ransom then began turning his tires toward Hjortshoj. Hjortshoj said he squeezed off a second shot and dodged the SUV's bumper, thinking Ransom was aiming the SUV to again try to run him over. That bullet pierced the driver's side window and ended up in Ransom's coat pocket.
"Between those two (shots), it was very fast," he said. "You don't have the option to think about anything else."
Once he moved clear of the vehicle, Ransom sped off and Hjortshoj headed to help Kinsey, who was not struck by the SUV.
In the end, Hjortshoj said he was glad that no one, including Ransom, was seriously wounded and hoped others in his shoes would act similarly.
"I would hope anyone would do that for my wife, daughter or mother," he said.
Frank Radosevich II can be reached at 686-3142 or fradosevich@pjstar.com.
Have a tho0 -
As an "average" resident of Illinois I cannot decide if I should be pissed that this guy clearly broke Illinois' conceal carry laws and got away with it...partly because he is a traffic cop at the fair or should I be glad that this shows Illinois needs less restrictive CCW laws. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Captplaid
As an "average" resident of Illinois I cannot decide if I should be pissed that this guy clearly broke Illinois' conceal carry laws and got away with it...partly because he is a traffic cop at the fair or should I be glad that this shows Illinois needs less restrictive CCW laws.
average citizens in Illinois are inferior to law enforcement, and cannot be trusted with a firearm, i know i'd be in jail on multiple charges, and loose my right to own a gun in Illinois0 -
The paper did a job on selling the readers on this guys hero attributes inspite of Illinois' laws. 0 -
It happens in other places also. This incident was not dangerous or anything like that. Three guys walk into the Post Office to ask directions. When they got out of their car I noticed one of them had a holstered pistol on his belt so I watched them closely as they entered. They stated their question and I gave the directions. We chatted a little and I reminded them that it is illegal to enter a Post Office carrying a firearm. The pistol packer identified himself as a St. Louis area policeman and I guess he thought that gave him amnesty. I gently told him that it worked that way only if he was in uniform, on the job, and had a reasonable need to enter my building armed. He took it well and thanked me for enlightening him. 0 -
those 2 stories from the news are so full of holes it reeks of cover up. of course his glove box was locked and his gun was unloaded. he grabbed his gun and his badge, and the gun loaded itself? sure, when the carjacker turned his tires toward him, the spring loaded bumper shot out and grazed his leg. sure he shot at the carjacker because he was afraid for his life! he was sooo wrong when he thought the safest place for him to be was directly in front of a fleeing carjacker.
sure, they filed twice. uh huh.
quote:That said, Lyons said he wasn't in favor of a conceal and carry law which would allow private citizens to carry a firearm.
Such a move, in this situation, could have meant someone could have fired at the police officer, thinking he was the perpetrator.that's too frikkin' bad isn't it?! I'd like to hear what he thinks about the possibility of cops firing on the wrong people as well.0 -
When is Illinois going to get their crap together, if the people are law abiding citizens and pass a in depth background check, knowledgeable, and pass a range test, what is the problem, it works for every other state, I will never move back as long as I can not carry in that state legally.........funny thing is I think it has the most firearm manufactures of any state, could be wrong about that. 0 -
the problem is the coneheaded politicians/self-appointed-herdsmen don't want them to. 0 -
because the democrats got a choke hold on that state, and when you realize
1. it's part of their party platform to "have a gunless society",
2. when you vote democrat, you don't get that politician, you're going to get a representative of the democrat party
it makes sense, doesn't it?0 -
Illinois laws are bunk, along with Wisconsin they are the only two states that have absolutely no faith/trust in their citizens.
I wonder what he was shooting with to get a bullet stuck in the windshield?0 -
To bad it ain't 1 less carjacker in the world. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Mobuck
It happens in other places also. This incident was not dangerous or anything like that. Three guys walk into the Post Office to ask directions. When they got out of their car I noticed one of them had a holstered pistol on his belt so I watched them closely as they entered. They stated their question and I gave the directions. We chatted a little and I reminded them that it is illegal to enter a Post Office carrying a firearm. The pistol packer identified himself as a St. Louis area policeman and I guess he thought that gave him amnesty. I gently told him that it worked that way only if he was in uniform, on the job, and had a reasonable need to enter my building armed. He took it well and thanked me for enlightening him.
39 CFR 232.1(i) ends with "except for official purposes". Many PDs require officers to carry their firearm off duty while within their jurisdiction, thus making it "for official purposes".
By the way when did a post office become YOUR building.[:o)]0 -
Good for him, too bad he wasn't packing something with enough power to take this dirtbag out. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by leftytwoguns
Illinois laws are bunk, along with Wisconsin they are the only two states that have absolutely no faith/trust in their citizens.
I wonder what he was shooting with to get a bullet stuck in the windshield?
And the other went through the side window and landed in the perps pocket.
.25 or .32?
Don0 -
Illinois biggest problem is Cook county and Chicago, and the Daly clan. They run the rest of the state from there instead of out of Springfield. Too bad the whole county can't fall into Lake Michigan. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by sarge_3ad
Illinois biggest problem is Cook county and Chicago, and the Daly clan. They run the rest of the state from there instead of out of Springfield. Too bad the whole county can't fall into Lake Michigan.
Exactly why I despise the democraps.0 -
quote:Originally posted by sarge_3ad
Illinois biggest problem is Cook county and Chicago, and the Daly clan. They run the rest of the state from there instead of out of Springfield. Too bad the whole county can't fall into Lake Michigan.
Agreed, IL would be a nice place if we lost cook county.0 -
quote:Originally posted by bhale187
quote:Originally posted by sarge_3ad
Illinois biggest problem is Cook county and Chicago, and the Daly clan. They run the rest of the state from there instead of out of Springfield. Too bad the whole county can't fall into Lake Michigan.
Agreed, IL would be a nice place if we lost cook county.
We'd probably have CCW too. [:)]0 -
Living in N. IL we call it the mistake on the lake. Yes the state would be better off in so many ways, if it was gone or it's own state (confusion). We even have to pay so they can ride a train.
Jim0 -
The gov has called a special session for legislature to return to work immediately after the new year in order for them to find a way to fund the Chicago mass transit system.
Why does the entire state have to pay for Chicagoians to have cheap public transit?
http://www.sj-r.com/News/stories/22309.asp0 -
Well , as Ive stated before , just another reason I will never move back to that state , reason # ??? that I moved away in the first place ...More people sould grow a "SET" , and do as I did , Move far away from that mess ...
Thanks !!!
d.a.stearns
Gunsmith / LEO a.k.a. SKEEZIX
Niota , Tn0 -
quote:Originally posted by abcguns2
Well , as Ive stated before , just another reason I will never move back to that state , reason # ??? that I moved away in the first place ...More people sould grow a "SET" , and do as I did , Move far away from that mess ...
Thanks !!!
d.a.stearns
Gunsmith / LEO a.k.a. SKEEZIX
Niota , Tn
How does running away from a problem qualify as "growing a set". I prefer to fight for my rights in my home.0 -
quote:Originally posted by leftytwoguns
Illinois laws are bunk, along with Wisconsin they are the only two states that have absolutely no faith/trust in their citizens.
I wonder what he was shooting with to get a bullet stuck in the windshield?
Hey hey hey! Let's not forget my good 'ole state of Maryland! No CCW here either! And NO resiprosity for any neighboring state!0 -
quote:Originally posted by bhale187
quote:Originally posted by Mobuck
It happens in other places also. This incident was not dangerous or anything like that. Three guys walk into the Post Office to ask directions. When they got out of their car I noticed one of them had a holstered pistol on his belt so I watched them closely as they entered. They stated their question and I gave the directions. We chatted a little and I reminded them that it is illegal to enter a Post Office carrying a firearm. The pistol packer identified himself as a St. Louis area policeman and I guess he thought that gave him amnesty. I gently told him that it worked that way only if he was in uniform, on the job, and had a reasonable need to enter my building armed. He took it well and thanked me for enlightening him.
39 CFR 232.1(i) ends with "except for official purposes". Many PDs require officers to carry their firearm off duty while within their jurisdiction, thus making it "for official purposes".
By the way when did a post office become YOUR building.[:o)]
not auxilary officers as this guy was
http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/fulltext.asp?DocName=006500050K3.1-30-20
Auxiliary police officers shall not carry firearms, except with the permission of the chief of police and while in uniform and in the performance of their duties0 -
quote:Originally posted by 1911a1fan
quote:Originally posted by bhale187
quote:Originally posted by Mobuck
It happens in other places also. This incident was not dangerous or anything like that. Three guys walk into the Post Office to ask directions. When they got out of their car I noticed one of them had a holstered pistol on his belt so I watched them closely as they entered. They stated their question and I gave the directions. We chatted a little and I reminded them that it is illegal to enter a Post Office carrying a firearm. The pistol packer identified himself as a St. Louis area policeman and I guess he thought that gave him amnesty. I gently told him that it worked that way only if he was in uniform, on the job, and had a reasonable need to enter my building armed. He took it well and thanked me for enlightening him.
39 CFR 232.1(i) ends with "except for official purposes". Many PDs require officers to carry their firearm off duty while within their jurisdiction, thus making it "for official purposes".
By the way when did a post office become YOUR building.[:o)]
not auxilary officers as this guy was
http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/fulltext.asp?DocName=006500050K3.1-30-20
Auxiliary police officers shall not carry firearms, except with the permission of the chief of police and while in uniform and in the performance of their duties
1911a1fan,
We are talking about 2 entirely different things. I was refering to Mobuck's story of an off duty officer entering a Post Office with a not-so-concealed weapon, and Mobuck incorrectly sighting federal law pertaining to weapons in a federal building/post office.0 -
gotcha! 0 -
Didn't know thier was such a thing as an off duty officer ! 0 -
quote:Originally posted by BT3
Didn't know thier was such a thing as an off duty officer !
you've never seen one drinking?0
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