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They're trying to unionize us.....advice please

spurgemastur
I was sitting in my office preparing to teach (I'm a grad student/teaching assistant at a university) when a knock came at my door.

It was a United Auto Workers' rep (who woulda thunk they'd be a TA union?) wanting me to sign on and get the TA's at my university unionized.

The short story: she had no literature for me to look over, no website I could look at to see what they were offering, and no arguments for why I should sign up, but a fairly aggressive stance that I should sign her card, stating that I was authorizing them to negotiate on my behalf.

Why should I sign, I asked. "What are your concerns," she asked. Fees? Yeah, well, those are negotiated as part of the bargain.

When I realized she had nothing to offer by way of an argument (other than that they could negotiate for "better working conditions"), I told her to leave the card with me, and that I'd think it over and where should I send it if I decided to sign it? Nothing doing! She wouldn't even leave me with the sign-up card.

She's coming back tomorrow for my answer. My answer is no unless somebody convinces me otherwise between now and 18 hours from now.

Bottom line: our salary is reasonable relative to other TA's across the nation, our benefits are reasonable, and I've never had a workplace problem that I didn't think could be resolved directly between me and my supervisors. So the union seems unnecessary to me. Maybe they'd increase my wage to offset their fees, but I don't leave the water running in a public restroom, either....no need to generate that cost, even if I'm not paying for it out of pocket.

So I know most on this board are not pro-union. Does anybody have an argument for why I should get behind a unionization drive?
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Comments

45 comments

Date Votes
  • savage170
    none here
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  • jtmarine0831
    Unless she can show you some hard proof of what they are after(benefits, pay, etc..) I wouldn't mess with her. As a union worker, I am still skeptical about the way we are represented sometimes just for that reason. I can't say anything bad about my union because the union(the people) are wonderful, but we haven't been represented very well in the past few years. That and being a Mechnical Skilled Laborer in a Union with Clerical workers doesn't help much either. But Unions are a definate benefit to a job, I should say a career. Sometimes!

    I do think the usefulness of a union is coming back though. Especially with the growing number of illegals flowing into this country. I think that they might just prove themselves worth again. Please forgive me if I offend another Union worker, I do not make reference to all unions, just the ones I have worked in and with.
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  • bhale187
    I am a union member, and very happy with what they have accomplished for us. However, if you are already happy with pay, benefits, and the way you are treated, why do you need a union?
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  • 1911a1-fan
    i don't know was she hot?




















    seriously if you and your colleagues are happy, and get treated well why the heck give them money, and pizz off your employers, unions are not what they used to be, they are big business now with little concern for the work place, find out if they want you to join a existing contract {see it of course} or want to write a new one, you may actually loose
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  • spurgemastur
    quote:Originally posted by 1911a1fan
    i don't know was she hot?

    seriously if you and your colleagues are happy, and get treated well why the heck give them money, and pizz off your employers, unions are not what they used to be, they are big business now with little concern for the work place, find out if they want you to join a existing contract {see it of course} or want to write a new one, you may actually loose


    Hehe. She IS hot (might be the best thing she's got going in this deal).

    I agree about not pizzing off mgmt. Maybe it doesn't need to be this way, but my impression is that unions come with a lot of baggage, and that the interaction btw union and management will necessarily start off as a needlessly confrontational interaction.

    And another thing: does this not add one more layer of bureaucracy to an already complicated organization? Jeez.....TA's shouldn't even be keeping their jobs for six years: we're here to get in and get out, as fast as possible! More layers of bureaucracy probably do not grease the wheels!

    Edit: I got the sense that they were offering to negotiate a new contract, rather than asking me to join an existing contract, but that's a good point that would never have occurred to me. I'll ask her tomorrow.
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  • spurgemastur
    quote:Originally posted by jtmarine0831
    Unless she can show you some hard proof of what they are after(benefits, pay, etc..) I wouldn't mess with her. As a union worker, I am still skeptical about the way we are represented sometimes just for that reason. I can't say anything bad about my union because the union(the people) are wonderful, but we haven't been represented very well in the past few years. That and being a Mechnical Skilled Laborer in a Union with Clerical workers doesn't help much either. But Unions are a definate benefit to a job, I should say a career. Sometimes!

    I do think the usefulness of a union is coming back though. Especially with the growing number of illegals flowing into this country. I think that they might just prove themselves worth again. Please forgive me if I offend another Union worker, I do not make reference to all unions, just the ones I have worked in and with.


    Thanks for that. I'm interested in just what you mean by the idea that unions might become relevant again due to the illegal immigrant population....how would a union help that? (I gotta say, I might be naive, but I don't think we have too many illegal TA's in the US). Still, I'd be interested to hear more about what you're thinking on that.
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  • grdad45
    I work for a company that would really be hard to put up with if it wasn't for the union. I know that because I have talked to employees who worked at the same company's non-union places. I say that if you are satisfied with your pay and benifits, don't sign the card. It seems to me that you probably won't gain much with their representation.
    You also MAY be quietly be discriminated against when you apply at a permanent teaching job.
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  • bhale187
    The entire purpose of unions was and is to make sure empolyees getting their fair share, if you are already getting that then there's really no need to unionize is there?
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  • MVP
    I would just tell her NO until she can produce some information and a list of benifits that the union will bargain for with the University.

    I would not blindly sign on until the union rep could recruit with a profesional presention.
    The UAW is big enough they have money to print even the most basic brochure with the key points they will Bargain for.
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  • 180A
    Are you sure she's with the union?

    Why didn't she leave you paperwork to look over, is she afraid you'll show it to management?

    If I were in your shoes, I'd contact the highest person at the university you have access to and tell them what happened and tell her to get stuffed.
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  • spurgemastur
    Thanks all for the input. My summary of your responses is like this:

    Even those of you who are happy union members don't seem to think this is a good idea for me.

    I'm still open to ideas if you've got something to offer.


    Meanwhile...

    quote: Are you sure she's with the union?

    Why didn't she leave you paperwork to look over, is she afraid you'll show it to management?

    If I were in your shoes, I'd contact the highest person at the university you have access to and tell them what happened and tell her to get stuffed.

    First off, the first thing I did was to talk to management. My adviser happens to be the grad student 'boss' in my unit, and he came by about 10 minutes after this chick left. I've got a good relationship with him so the first thing I did was to pick his brains about past union recruiting attempts.

    Second, she might well NOT be a union employee. You know how universities are....she might just be a sociology student with a 'cause.' It had occurred to me to ask her that.


    At any rate, I'm pretty darn sure she's not getting my signature.
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  • nemesisenforcer
    Forget it. Unions were a great device in the early industrial revolution when laborers were actually exploited and had infinitely fewer options than any reasonable person has today in the form of increased choices and employment opportunities.

    The whole idea of collective bargaining is to give the workers (who lack the power or leverage of managment individually) greater footing and relative bargaining position. If you feel you already have enough "power" so to speak in your position, then there's no need for collective bargaining as any deal can be reached on an individual level. Any fees you pay would be a waste of money without this one salient feature of a "real" union.
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  • givette
    No. Short and sweet. Does the Taylor Law prevent you from striking? I worked as a federal employee. (FAA). No strikes allowed. Without strike capability, there is no real power to a union. Worked an entire career un-unioned. Here's a tidbit on union benefits:

    I had the union dues equivalent taken out of my salary. Put it into a Roth IRA. Upon retirement, I had a bundle. Just a thought. Joe
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  • spurgemastur
    quote:Originally posted by givette
    No. Short and sweet. Does the Taylor Law prevent you from striking? I worked as a federal employee. (FAA). No strikes allowed. Without strike capability, there is no real power to a union. Worked an entire career un-unioned. Here's a tidbit on union benefits:

    I had the union dues equivalent taken out of my salary. Put it into a Roth IRA. Upon retirement, I had a bundle. Just a thought. Joe


    I'm a WA state employee (not federal), and I know nothing about the Taylor Law. But my situation is good enough that a strike is the last thing I'd want!

    Good idea on using the union dues as a benchmark for saving, though!
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  • Wolf.
    --
    Hey, just tell her you'll sign up and help her sign up other TAs if she will........... She probably gets paid good bucks for every TA that signs up, so who knows? Then give her a phony cell phone number and call the campus cops on her butt. [}:)][:D] [:X]

    You don't want to join a union. You know what happened to Jimmy Hoffa don't you?? On second thought, you probably don't! [:D]
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  • gruntled
    Bad example. The Truck drivers were much better off when Jimmy Hoffa was around.
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  • spurgemastur
    quote:Originally posted by Wolf.
    --
    Hey, just tell her you'll sign up and help her sign up other TAs if she will........... She probably gets paid good bucks for every TA that signs up, so who knows? Then give her a phony cell phone number and call the campus cops on her butt. [}:)][:D] [:X]

    You don't want to join a union. You know what happened to Jimmy Hoffa don't you?? On second thought, you probably don't! [:D]


    Uhhh, I was under the impression that nobody was sure what happened to Jimmy Hoffa.
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  • Colt Super
    I'M sure about what happened to good ol' Jimmy-Me-Boyo.

    Doug
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  • select-fire
    Just simply tell her you will pass on the UAW Union and join a Teachers Union in the near future.
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  • use enough gun
    I belonged to a union 25 years ago. First and LAST time I'll ever make that mistake. They cost me more money and grief than I could make up for the rest of my life. If you're happy the way things are they won't be improving things. Dave
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  • Gotteskrieger
    i have been in 4 unions.the money has always been great and good benefits.i retired from a big unionized company. i made top money, out of this world benefits BUT it was always an adversarial enviroment. grievance after grievance. the company cut the workforce down to almost zip. i dreaded going to work and when they offered a buyout i split. i don't know how the company can afford the benefits. the union also was as left wing as they come, solid democrat. in the union meetings they would openly deride republicans. they didn't care about guns but would fight for gay right and abortion. as far as grievances i never won one. they would bargain away some poor sap to get something they wanted.if the union gets in there will be a chill between management and the workers. if you are being treated fairly i strongly recomend NO.

    NO
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  • LKB3rd
    quote:Originally posted by jtmarine0831
    Unless she can show you some hard proof of what they are after(benefits, pay, etc..) I wouldn't mess with her. As a union worker, I am still skeptical about the way we are represented sometimes just for that reason. I can't say anything bad about my union because the union(the people) are wonderful, but we haven't been represented very well in the past few years. That and being a Mechnical Skilled Laborer in a Union with Clerical workers doesn't help much either. But Unions are a definate benefit to a job, I should say a career. Sometimes!

    I do think the usefulness of a union is coming back though. Especially with the growing number of illegals flowing into this country. I think that they might just prove themselves worth again. Please forgive me if I offend another Union worker, I do not make reference to all unions, just the ones I have worked in and with.


    I am in a union too, and this sort of echo's my experience. I wouldn't blindly sign the vote as a yes. I'd want to know what the dues would be, and what they specifically think they could get for me in my specific job. I would ask them for a plan in writing of what they plan to work for and what they propose to spend my dues on.
    My union has been getting browbeaten by the company mercilessly lately to the point where i often ask "what the hell are my dues paying for, someone to agree to take it up the a$$ on my behalf?"
    If you feel as if you are effective settling your own disputes with your employer then i'd be inclined to vote no. Unless a union put a specific list of things they said they could get better than what i had in front of me, and convinced me they would be successful in getting them.
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  • mijelo
    I am very pro union, have been from 1958
    thru retirement in 2002,BUT in your instance
    and your stated conditions I would politely
    say no to her offer.
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  • mrseatle
    Is it a Union or a "collective bargaining agreement"? I believe that management is usually in kahootz with the leaders of any collective bargaining agreement, to turn the rest of the workers into easly managed drones. Why negotiate with a hundred workers when you can get them all together?

    also a TA union???????????

    is there a union for automotive shop helpers now too?
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  • Tailgunner1954
    The unization drive was probably started by some TFU (Total F*** Up) that is about to lose their job for incompatance. Going union is the only hope this person has of holding on.
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  • bpost
    Unions time has passed. OSHA and anti-discrimination laws have negated any POSITIVE effect they had. Now the protections offered are for people that in reality should be fired to begin with. Unions support the lowest common denominator at the expense of the above average and average workers. Unions in a publically funded job are un-American as hell imho.
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  • hk-91
    I'm a union member and i can tell you that i'm not by choice. i could think of a lot better things to spend my 42.oo a month on union dues on. the only thing i every see them doing is helping the lazy sobs keep there job. they force you to be in the union by basically black listing anyone not it the union. they post up scab lists all over the factory of non union members. which out of over 1300 people only about 10 are non union.
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  • use enough gun
    A lot of the discriptions mirror my experiences. You are FORCED to join, I saw tires slashed, people threatened, lazy SOBs kept on the job when they did nothing. The BIGGEST complaint I had was they took MY money and used it to promote politicans that were trying to take my second amendment rights away.[:(!]Dave
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  • jtmarine0831
    quote:Originally posted by spurgemastur
    quote:Originally posted by jtmarine0831
    Unless she can show you some hard proof of what they are after(benefits, pay, etc..) I wouldn't mess with her. As a union worker, I am still skeptical about the way we are represented sometimes just for that reason. I can't say anything bad about my union because the union(the people) are wonderful, but we haven't been represented very well in the past few years. That and being a Mechnical Skilled Laborer in a Union with Clerical workers doesn't help much either. But Unions are a definate benefit to a job, I should say a career. Sometimes!

    I do think the usefulness of a union is coming back though. Especially with the growing number of illegals flowing into this country. I think that they might just prove themselves worth again. Please forgive me if I offend another Union worker, I do not make reference to all unions, just the ones I have worked in and with.


    Thanks for that. I'm interested in just what you mean by the idea that unions might become relevant again due to the illegal immigrant population....how would a union help that? (I gotta say, I might be naive, but I don't think we have too many illegal TA's in the US). Still, I'd be interested to hear more about what you're thinking on that.



    Spurgemastur, I wasn't refering to just the TA's. Look around, most all the brick layers, carpenters, automotive assembly works, etc. are union workers. I also work in Research and Development for one of the top Diesel engine manufacturers in the world. Do you want some under-educated illegal working on the development of emmissions, endurance and cost reduction testing to hopefully provide a better end product for people like you. If is wasn't for unions a lot of Americans with jobs like mine would be forced out so the Corparates could make more money by hiring under-educated, unskilled laborers to try and fill their spots. What happens if you have someone that is not as qualified as you doing your job? The end result is not what it should be is it. I don't have problem with therse people wanting to live here, BUT if they are going to then THEY must assimilate themselves into OUR culture, not theirs and work under the same rules a we do. Does that answer yor question a little? I just have a feeling that the Union's influence will help quite a few Americans from losing their jobs like that. And as fore-mentioned, a Union is good at keeping peoples jobs, even if they don't deserve it, I see it everyday.
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  • Rack Ops
    Once they get in, you'll never get rid of them......
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