GM's New Employees make much less
This should solve a lot of issues in the future in competition. Ford and Chysler will probably follow.
UAW wins job security pledges in GM deal By DEE-ANN DURBIN and TOM KRISHER, AP Auto Writers
2 hours, 28 minutes ago
DETROIT - Local union leaders on Friday endorsed a tentative agreement between General Motors Corp. and the United Auto Workers that requires GM to pay out at least $35 billion for retiree health care, establishes lower wages for thousands of new employees and offers an unprecedented number of promises for future work at U.S. plants, according to a summary of the agreement provided by the UAW.
The agreement still is subject to a vote of GM's 74,000 UAW members, which should be completed by Oct. 10. UAW President Ron Gettelfinger said he's confident members will support the agreement and that Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC will match many of its terms.
"We're happy with this stuff," he said.
GM spokesman Dan Flores said both UAW workers and the company benefit from the agreement. GM didn't release any specifics of the contract Friday; the company typically waits until the contract is ratified to make detailed comments.
"Not only does this new agreement enhance the security for employees and retirees, it enables GM to close competitive gaps in our business, and the projected competitive improvements will allow us to maintain a strong manufacturing presence in the U.S. with significant future investments," Flores said.
Gettelfinger said he hadn't yet decided whether the union would negotiate with Ford or Chrysler next, but he expects to make that call next week. Both automakers have extended their contracts with the union indefinitely.
The linchpin of the deal is a trust fund for retiree health care, known as a Voluntary Employees Beneficiary Association, or VEBA. GM, which has around 340,000 retirees and spouses, wanted to form the VEBA in order to get $51 billion in retiree health care debt off its books. The VEBA will be run by an independent board overseen by the UAW.
GM will put $24.1 billion into the VEBA in January 2008 and will pay an additional $5.4 billion to cover retirees' health care costs until the VEBA takes over in January 2010. GM also will make up to 20 additional $165 million payments - to a maximum of $1.6 billion - to the VEBA anytime the fund's level is insufficient to provide benefits for at least 25 years.
GM also will be required to pay cash interest on a $4.37 billion convertible note for the benefit of the VEBA. The fund's trustees will be able to convert that note to GM stock, which could be a windfall for the fund if GM's share price goes up. GM's active workers also will be required to contribute a small amount of their cost-of-living increases to the VEBA.
In a two-page letter to retirees sent Friday, the UAW sought to calm retirees' fears about the VEBA, saying the union supports the fund because it protects retirees' benefits in the event of a downturn or bankruptcy. Retirees don't get to vote on the contract.
The UAW was seeking to protect jobs and slow its falling membership in this contract, and Gettelfinger said GM responded with "unprecedented product guarantees." GM committed to building current or existing products at 16 of its 18 U.S. assembly plants, according to the UAW's summary. GM already has announced the closure of a plant in Doraville, Ga., in 2008. A midsize sport utility vehicle plant in Moraine, Ohio, wasn't listed because its workers are represented by the International Electronics Workers-Communications Workers of America.
The 16 factories either will continue building their current products or, in most cases, the next generation of those products. A plant in the Detroit area is scheduled to begin producing the electric Chevrolet Volt, one of GM's most anticipated products, in 2010, while a plant in Lordstown, Ohio, is set to get a new subcompact.
"The whole thing looks fantastic," said Dave Green, president of one of two local unions in Lordstown. The agreement, he said, preserves wages and health care for active workers "and we've done creative stuff that's going to make the company profitable in North America."
But the future of some plants may be in jeopardy.
GM's Orion Township plant, which will make the Pontiac G6 mid-sized car until 2013, and the Wilmington, Del. plant, which makes the Pontiac Solstice and Saturn Sky roadsters until 2012, do not have new vehicles listed on the UAW's summary.
Eldon Renaud, head of United Auto Workers Local 2164 in Bowling Green, Ky., said production of the Pontiac Solstice and Saturn Sky will move from Wilmington to his plant, leaving Wilmington's future in doubt.
The union said assembly line workers will get economic gains totaling $13,056 over the life of the four-year contract. They will get bonuses in each year of the contract, including a $3,000 bonus when the contract is ratified, as well as cost-of-living increases.
But some workers will be making less than before.
New hires who are doing what are considered noncore functions, such as combining parts from suppliers to prepare them for the assembly line, managing parts and chemicals and driving finished vehicles, will make between $14 and $16.23 an hour, or about half the starting wage of $28.12 that assembly workers would make under the new contract. Those workers also would get a 401(k)-style retirement plan instead of a fixed pension, according to the summary.
There are more than 16,000 people doing noncore work in U.S. plants right now, the UAW said in its summary. Gettelfinger said there would be a buyout plan to replace noncore workers with new hires, but he said the details still were being worked out. A person briefed on the contract said earlier this week that GM plans to offer early retirement and buyout packages of $35,000. The person requested anonymity because the buyout plans haven't been made public.
Under the tentative contract, 3,000 temporary workers also will get permanent jobs at the full-time wage rate, according to the union's summary. GM also would in-source 3,000 jobs now contracted to parts suppliers, the union said.
If the company's UAW members ratify the deal, its provisions likely will save the company about $3 billion per year, which it can pump into the development of new products, according to several industry analysts.
GM shares rose 24 cents, or less than 1 percent, to close at $36.70 Friday on the New York Stock Exchange.
___
UAW wins job security pledges in GM deal By DEE-ANN DURBIN and TOM KRISHER, AP Auto Writers
2 hours, 28 minutes ago
DETROIT - Local union leaders on Friday endorsed a tentative agreement between General Motors Corp. and the United Auto Workers that requires GM to pay out at least $35 billion for retiree health care, establishes lower wages for thousands of new employees and offers an unprecedented number of promises for future work at U.S. plants, according to a summary of the agreement provided by the UAW.
The agreement still is subject to a vote of GM's 74,000 UAW members, which should be completed by Oct. 10. UAW President Ron Gettelfinger said he's confident members will support the agreement and that Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC will match many of its terms.
"We're happy with this stuff," he said.
GM spokesman Dan Flores said both UAW workers and the company benefit from the agreement. GM didn't release any specifics of the contract Friday; the company typically waits until the contract is ratified to make detailed comments.
"Not only does this new agreement enhance the security for employees and retirees, it enables GM to close competitive gaps in our business, and the projected competitive improvements will allow us to maintain a strong manufacturing presence in the U.S. with significant future investments," Flores said.
Gettelfinger said he hadn't yet decided whether the union would negotiate with Ford or Chrysler next, but he expects to make that call next week. Both automakers have extended their contracts with the union indefinitely.
The linchpin of the deal is a trust fund for retiree health care, known as a Voluntary Employees Beneficiary Association, or VEBA. GM, which has around 340,000 retirees and spouses, wanted to form the VEBA in order to get $51 billion in retiree health care debt off its books. The VEBA will be run by an independent board overseen by the UAW.
GM will put $24.1 billion into the VEBA in January 2008 and will pay an additional $5.4 billion to cover retirees' health care costs until the VEBA takes over in January 2010. GM also will make up to 20 additional $165 million payments - to a maximum of $1.6 billion - to the VEBA anytime the fund's level is insufficient to provide benefits for at least 25 years.
GM also will be required to pay cash interest on a $4.37 billion convertible note for the benefit of the VEBA. The fund's trustees will be able to convert that note to GM stock, which could be a windfall for the fund if GM's share price goes up. GM's active workers also will be required to contribute a small amount of their cost-of-living increases to the VEBA.
In a two-page letter to retirees sent Friday, the UAW sought to calm retirees' fears about the VEBA, saying the union supports the fund because it protects retirees' benefits in the event of a downturn or bankruptcy. Retirees don't get to vote on the contract.
The UAW was seeking to protect jobs and slow its falling membership in this contract, and Gettelfinger said GM responded with "unprecedented product guarantees." GM committed to building current or existing products at 16 of its 18 U.S. assembly plants, according to the UAW's summary. GM already has announced the closure of a plant in Doraville, Ga., in 2008. A midsize sport utility vehicle plant in Moraine, Ohio, wasn't listed because its workers are represented by the International Electronics Workers-Communications Workers of America.
The 16 factories either will continue building their current products or, in most cases, the next generation of those products. A plant in the Detroit area is scheduled to begin producing the electric Chevrolet Volt, one of GM's most anticipated products, in 2010, while a plant in Lordstown, Ohio, is set to get a new subcompact.
"The whole thing looks fantastic," said Dave Green, president of one of two local unions in Lordstown. The agreement, he said, preserves wages and health care for active workers "and we've done creative stuff that's going to make the company profitable in North America."
But the future of some plants may be in jeopardy.
GM's Orion Township plant, which will make the Pontiac G6 mid-sized car until 2013, and the Wilmington, Del. plant, which makes the Pontiac Solstice and Saturn Sky roadsters until 2012, do not have new vehicles listed on the UAW's summary.
Eldon Renaud, head of United Auto Workers Local 2164 in Bowling Green, Ky., said production of the Pontiac Solstice and Saturn Sky will move from Wilmington to his plant, leaving Wilmington's future in doubt.
The union said assembly line workers will get economic gains totaling $13,056 over the life of the four-year contract. They will get bonuses in each year of the contract, including a $3,000 bonus when the contract is ratified, as well as cost-of-living increases.
But some workers will be making less than before.
New hires who are doing what are considered noncore functions, such as combining parts from suppliers to prepare them for the assembly line, managing parts and chemicals and driving finished vehicles, will make between $14 and $16.23 an hour, or about half the starting wage of $28.12 that assembly workers would make under the new contract. Those workers also would get a 401(k)-style retirement plan instead of a fixed pension, according to the summary.
There are more than 16,000 people doing noncore work in U.S. plants right now, the UAW said in its summary. Gettelfinger said there would be a buyout plan to replace noncore workers with new hires, but he said the details still were being worked out. A person briefed on the contract said earlier this week that GM plans to offer early retirement and buyout packages of $35,000. The person requested anonymity because the buyout plans haven't been made public.
Under the tentative contract, 3,000 temporary workers also will get permanent jobs at the full-time wage rate, according to the union's summary. GM also would in-source 3,000 jobs now contracted to parts suppliers, the union said.
If the company's UAW members ratify the deal, its provisions likely will save the company about $3 billion per year, which it can pump into the development of new products, according to several industry analysts.
GM shares rose 24 cents, or less than 1 percent, to close at $36.70 Friday on the New York Stock Exchange.
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Considering that most of the new hires will need to be trained on such "high tech" skills as tying their shoes, pulling up their pants, walking and chewing gum at the same time, flushing a toilet, etc, it's still twice as much as their worth.
But, considering that the UAW feel that pushing a broom is a skilled trade, and mandates a higher pay level, what would you expect them to say?0 -
The UAW is hell bent on destroying the US auto industry. Why don't they go after toyota of honda?? They are biting the hand that feeds them, and will sooner or later put themselves out of work.[:(!][:(!][:(!][:(!] 
0 -
Those bastidges! HOW DARE THEY want more money when the company is making tons of money, and the CEO is making millions a year!
GO BACK TO WORK FOR $5 per DAY, you slackers!
You people just amaze me, you really do!
Merc0 -
I was told on this forum by a labor relations "expert" that it was near slavery to pay an American worker $15 per hour and that guys like me (who have no employees making under $15 per hour) are the reason unions are still needed! This is a good deal for GM and a better deal than the UAW should have gotten under the circumstances. Shifting the retireee burden over to the UAW is the best possible move GM could have made because even the tens of billions spent up front is a bargan when compared to shouldering the long term costs of retiree programs. As far as new hires making less money: They know the pay scale up front so if they don't like the money they can pass up on taking the job. 0 -
I was watching the news this morning, said GM, paid their workers 74 bucks an hour including their hourly and benefits, where as Toyota and honda only paid their workers 40 bucks hourly and benefits. GM health insurance also covers laser eye surgery where as honda and toyota dont. GM also needs to cut their worker bank, they pay a huge amount of money for these guys to sit around and do crossword puzzles. I guess GM needs to cut back on the benefits, not the hourly pay, get rid of the laser eye surgery for retiree's and get rid of the worker pool all together. Now i no all that sucks but it needs to be done. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Old Fool
The UAW is hell bent on destroying the US auto industry. Why don't they go after toyota of honda?? They are biting the hand that feeds them, and will sooner or later put themselves out of work.[:(!][:(!][:(!][:(!]
They don't go after Toyota or Honda because the workforce of both those companies is mostly non-union.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Mercury
Those bastidges! HOW DARE THEY want more money when the company is making tons of money, and the CEO is making millions a year!
ummm....you might want to look at GM's results for the last few years. they are certainly not making tons of money.0 -
quote:Originally posted by MosinNagantDisciple
They don't go after Toyota or Honda because the workforce of both those companies is mostly non-union.
Mostly? Neither of the workforces are unions, honda is 100% non union everyone gets what they are worth and benefits are really good.0 -
quote:Originally posted by shoff14
quote:Originally posted by MosinNagantDisciple
They don't go after Toyota or Honda because the workforce of both those companies is mostly non-union.
Mostly? Neither of the workforces are unions, honda is 100% non union everyone gets what they are worth and benefits are really good.
The companies give them good pay and benefits to keep the unions out. Those people can thank unions for what they get.0 -
Barkingdog,
Ford and GM have dumped hundreds of millions into developing a auto market in China. It may look like they've been going in the red for a few years but I believe they plan on making a killing when 1.5 Billion Chinese are driving something they can profit from.
Problem is.....it's a communist country. Will their investments work?0 -
What will probably happen is that they will shift most if not all manufacturing to China once these plants are operating. And close the U.S. plants and lay off the UAW workers.
Now the "job security" aspect of the strike begins to make more sense.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Mercury
Those bastidges! HOW DARE THEY want more money when the company is making tons of money, and the CEO is making millions a year!
GO BACK TO WORK FOR $5 per DAY, you slackers!
You people just amaze me, you really do!
Merc
+1
What would cause some to begrudge a halfway decent wage and benefits to folks they don't even know? I defy anyone to try to make a life for themselves, let alone a family, on $15 an hour. I know it can't be done around here. $28 an hour doesn't provide much more than the basics for a family these days. That's $1100 a week with take home around $700-$800. Try to buy a decent home, raise and put a kid or two through school, food, transportation, insurance, clothes, etc., etc. Maybe it can be done on a minimal level, but you certainly wouldn't be indulging in any excesses. In case any of the young ones here think the "American Dream", which was made possible for countless millions by organized labor, isn't getting tougher to achieve, I'm old enough to have lived when a mans single income was sufficient to raise his family without the wife working. She could stay home and be "Mom". Don't see much of that any more among the common folk.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Mercury
Those bastidges! HOW DARE THEY want more money when the company is making tons of money, and the CEO is making millions a year!
GO BACK TO WORK FOR $5 per DAY, you slackers!
You people just amaze me, you really do!
Merc
Yep.
It also amazes me to see some here to say we need to belong to the NRA or some other group(OH MY GOSH A UNION!!)to protect our gun rights, but if you belong to a labor union(we don't need those anymore)there's something wrong.
When I can make more money at a non-union job, I'll take it, but that don't seem to be happening.
We don't need unions anymore......what a hoot.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Dak To 68
What would cause some to begrudge a halfway decent wage and benefits to folks they don't even know? I defy anyone to try to make a life for themselves, let alone a family, on $15 an hour. I know it can't be done around here. $28 an hour doesn't provide much more than the basics for a family these days. That's $1100 a week with take home around $700-$800. Try to buy a decent home, raise and put a kid or two through school, food, transportation, insurance, clothes, etc., etc. Maybe it can be done on a minimal level, but you certainly wouldn't be indulging in any excesses. In case any of the young ones here think the "American Dream", which was made possible for countless millions by organized labor, isn't getting tougher to achieve, I'm old enough to have lived when a mans single income was sufficient to raise his family without the wife working. She could stay home and be "Mom". Don't see much of that any more among the common folk.
To bad your not smart enough to realize that it is the high union wages that is causing the high cost of living your complaining about. Cause and effect. I've watched prices jump after every new UAW contract was signed since before you were born.
If they actually paid a UAW man what he was worth, than there would be no complaint. But to pay a high school drop out double what a skilled tradesman on the outside makes, just to install lug nuts is beyond stupid.
IIRC your a auto mechanic? You spend your time repairing the line rats mistakes, and are held responsible for your own errors, Right? You have to purchase your own tools in order to work, right? The UAW line monkeys aren't held responsible for anything beyond punching in at the start of their shift, and heaven forbid that they purchase there own tools. As a mechanic you should make at least double the hourly wage that a line rat makes, do you? Ever see a "good union man" seek out a union shop for their car repairs, haircuts, plumbing needs, etc? They won't do it simply because in their own words "those guys charge to much".0 -
Aww, poor babies only make fifteen dollars an hour? Someone ring a bell when I'm supposed to care. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Mercury
Those bastidges! HOW DARE THEY want more money when the company is making tons of money, and the CEO is making millions a year!
GO BACK TO WORK FOR $5 per DAY, you slackers!
You people just amaze me, you really do!
Merc
If you haven't noticed, US auto manufacturers are deep in debt and are losing money, not making it.0 -
Let's see. GM are building new factories in.
Russia
Romania
Indonesia
China
China's no big surprise, but Toyota building a new factory there, is.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Tailgunner1954
Considering that most of the new hires will need to be trained on such "high tech" skills as tying their shoes, pulling up their pants, walking and chewing gum at the same time, flushing a toilet, etc, it's still twice as much as their worth.
But, considering that the UAW feel that pushing a broom is a skilled trade, and mandates a higher pay level, what would you expect them to say?
Tailgunner, your first name wouldn't happen to be Joe would it?
You have obviously never worked on an automobile line. I did for two years in the L.A. area Chrysler plant. Most new hires don't last three days. The pay (three dollars an hour) & benefits were good but you earned them. When I talked to the Ford & G.M. employees I learned that we had it much easier than they did.0 -
If the high cost of union labor is to blame for the high prices that the auto companies have to charge, then why are the new dodge pickups (manufactured in mexico) still as expensive as the ones that used to be built in the US?
Just asking is all.
I used to think it might be corporate greed, but after reading this thread I now know that the automakers are at the mercy of the evil unions.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Tailgunner1954
Considering that most of the new hires will need to be trained on such "high tech" skills as tying their shoes, pulling up their pants, walking and chewing gum at the same time, flushing a toilet, etc, it's still twice as much as their worth.
But, considering that the UAW feel that pushing a broom is a skilled trade, and mandates a higher pay level, what would you expect them to say?
+10 -
It always amazes me when some union person blames corporate greed for lower union wages. The union has nothing invested in the making of the product. They did not build the building, do the research,
set the production standards, make the necessary investment to run the company or anything else. They supply the man power and collect dues and whine about what they get.0 -
i worked for a vending machine company as a kid (17-20) we had general motors, ford, and chrysler here in the saint louis area, and let me tell you all of them where the laziest groups of people i ever seen, spoiled rotten Babbie's, it was nothing to see them out side getting high, and drinking on breaks {before drug testing}, every monday at chrysler was temp day, they would have to hire over 100 temps every monday due to employees calling of work, their rate of pay is very very good, and even when they get temporary lay offs they get 90% sub pay for doing nothing
in the past few years they have had several stings, new hires where actually cops who infiltrated the work force as employees, the last one netted 35 drug dealers who already where making 65,000 a year legal0 -
ihave raised 2 kids and 2 adults on 20,000 a year,,certainly not in the city and i do not drive a new suv...don't have a camp....i have however ,owned6 different pieces of land and have had 3 different homes.......its all perspective,its all priorities..... 0
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