Ciener .22 conversions?
I wanted to share my experience with Ciener .22 conversions. I'm sure that if you read any gun magazines, you've seen their ads. They manufacture .22 LR conversion kits for several popular firearms. I have been considering one of these kits for years, however the cost always held me back. Finally, I decided to bite the bullet and order one. Now they aren't cheap, some of them cost as much as many .22LR semi auto pistols. The one I ordered, including an extra mag, totaled 319.00.
Just so you know, Ciener accepts orders only by mail. There are no internet orders. They might accept phone orders, but there's no point since they only accept payment by check or money order, no credit cards.
I filled out my order and made out my check for 319.00 and mailed it in. In my haste, I forgot to include the 10.00 shipping charge. I promptly received a bill from them for the 10.00. plus an additional 5.00 for sending me a bill, or "sent invoice copy," as they called it.
Now I certainly have no problem sending the $10.00 that I owe them, but I have a huge problem sending an additional 5.00 for sending an invoice. I have never heard of a company that charges customers for sending them an invoice. I decided to just cancel the order on principle, that is until I discovered that they have a 25% cancellation fee. So I get screwed either way.. Either I send them an additional $5.00 above and beyond the amount advertised and agreed to, or I cancel the order and forfeit $80.00. I carefully examined the order form and their poor-excuse-of-a-web site, there is no mention of a 5.00 invoice charge nor is there a "terms and conditions" page.
I am the kind of guy that appreciates what is right and what is fair. I do business with companies that treat me right and want my business. I like to use the saying, "I put up with a lot of BS making my money; I don't have to tolerate any when I'm spending it."
Where does this company get off on a scheme like this? I would expect something like this from someone like the IRS, but not a company that is in the business of direct mail order sales. It is not about $5.00, it is about principles. I have to wonder that if they're willing to PO new customers, what will the service after-the-sale be like? Probably Non-existent.
What do you guys think?
Just so you know, Ciener accepts orders only by mail. There are no internet orders. They might accept phone orders, but there's no point since they only accept payment by check or money order, no credit cards.
I filled out my order and made out my check for 319.00 and mailed it in. In my haste, I forgot to include the 10.00 shipping charge. I promptly received a bill from them for the 10.00. plus an additional 5.00 for sending me a bill, or "sent invoice copy," as they called it.
Now I certainly have no problem sending the $10.00 that I owe them, but I have a huge problem sending an additional 5.00 for sending an invoice. I have never heard of a company that charges customers for sending them an invoice. I decided to just cancel the order on principle, that is until I discovered that they have a 25% cancellation fee. So I get screwed either way.. Either I send them an additional $5.00 above and beyond the amount advertised and agreed to, or I cancel the order and forfeit $80.00. I carefully examined the order form and their poor-excuse-of-a-web site, there is no mention of a 5.00 invoice charge nor is there a "terms and conditions" page.
I am the kind of guy that appreciates what is right and what is fair. I do business with companies that treat me right and want my business. I like to use the saying, "I put up with a lot of BS making my money; I don't have to tolerate any when I'm spending it."
Where does this company get off on a scheme like this? I would expect something like this from someone like the IRS, but not a company that is in the business of direct mail order sales. It is not about $5.00, it is about principles. I have to wonder that if they're willing to PO new customers, what will the service after-the-sale be like? Probably Non-existent.
What do you guys think?
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my favorite is the convience fee of 1.00 i get from my auto insurance company for auto withdraw of my bank account so i dont write checks or worry about it 0 -
Sounds like some real fudds to do business with. Seems like they're way behind the times by operating in this way--that is, no web or phone orders and tacky covert practices like the invoice charge. I wonder how they can afford the ads in all the magazines.
Based on your experience, they won't be getting any of my money. Plus their prices seem outrageous anyway. [V]0 -
Sounds like a one man operation. Any diversion from machining, packaging and mailing his stuff comes out of his profit. 0 -
They suck, and are supppppppppppppper sloooooooooooooooooow. If you see your stuff within two months, count yourself lucky.
Merc0 -
That outfit is notorious for slow deliveries and terrible customer service. I had not heard about the charge for billing.
I guess you either pay it or tell them to go suck eggs.
The product (at least my AR15 unit) seems to work fine. But service is awful.0 -
I guess I should have posted a question about them before I ordered.
Problem is... I don't think anyone else makes a conversion for hi-power. Kimber and a co. called Marvel make 1911s.
btw- Kimber has GREAT service. They replaced a broken rear sight on my 1911 free of charge... and I bought the gun used. Shipped 'em the slide and had it back within 10 days.0 -
He's a one-man show, and he doesn't give a damn if you like his way or not.
Do it his way or leave him the hell alone.
Wish I could be more like that!0 -
Well maybe it would be cool to be like that but he would probably do more business if he would stick to manufacturing and let someone else deal with the public.
I sent them a letter (along with the $15) complaining about the extra $5, I hope he doesn't screw up my parts on purpose.[B)]0 -
The solution here is to order through Brownells. Their great customer service more than makes up for JAC's terrible customer service.
Love my AR conversion, only gripe is the sight adjustments require when switching over. JAC clains they shoot to the same POI, thats pure oatmeal.0 -
I actually looked at doing just that, because of the credit card thing- but Brownells catalogs only the 1911 model. Now I'm wondering why they stock these when they could carry Kimber or Marvel. 0 -
I have a AR15 Ciener conversion with the 30 round magazine. It functions flawlessly and it a blast to shoot.
Don't have any experience with the customer service.0 -
When mine arrives, which according to the gang it may be awhile, I'll be sure to post a report. 0 -
Product is great. The guy is a jerk. 0
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