question on synthetic oil
has anyone her used the stuff? can you switch from refined oil to synthetic? how good is it? thanks.
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Yea you can change over as long as you do a complete oil change.
If you are driving an older high mileage viechle I don't think I would though.0 -
I have used it and currently still do. Amsoil is hard to beat because of it's 25,000/one year reccomendations, but since I don't put a lot of miles on, I have switched to penzoil synthetic. Don't be afraid to try the switch over to synthetic oil on older(high mileage) cars either. Like GRD said, some don't like it, but as long as you check your oil everyday or often like you should anyways, you will be ok. As far as the positives that I have seen out of sythetic oil, I have had a slight increase in gas mileage with my two vehicles and they both have used less oil as well. Just my 2 cents.
Jon0 -
my oldest son is thinking of doing this. his car is a 99 neon and he drives up north to college. 120xxx on car and he is trying to make it last his final year. he says it might be better for cold starts. i dont know and am sceptical. im a little old school and dont want him ruining a motor. 0 -
I have used amsoil in both of my vehicles for 10 years and never change the oil before 20,000 miles and not 1 problem. The ford f250 diesel has 210,000 miles and jeep has 140,000. 0 -
The reason I warned about older high milage viechles is that there is not as tight of a seal at the rings and valves. The synthetic will find that and increased oil consumption may result.
Now a motor that has allways used it does not have this problem.0 -
Senthetic oil will take the heat much better than conventional oil. I use it in my lawn mowers as they are only air cooled. If you chane over don't be suprised if it uses a little oil at first. My car did but after the first quart it settled down and was like the conventioal oil. The biggest drawback is it is twice as expensive. 0 -
thanks guys im going to let him read these post and he can decide. he can help change a motor if need be too.[;)][:D][:D] 0 -
Know a guy that went to Castorol(sp?)Synthetic in a stock car engine. It dropped the coolant temperature 15 degrees. It had to significantly reduce friction to do that. I have never used it in a street engine though, so can't comment on all the claims. 0 -
Synthetic will let you know which gaskets are going bad in a hurry. I had to change my valve cover gaskets because a spark plug port was full of oil and it would leak out the top. Fixed that and now I find I have a slight leak somewhere else. Don't know where yet.
I use Mobil 1 synthetic. It's about 6 bucks a quart now. You can get a 5 quart jug of it at Walmart for a little cheaper. I use it in my mower and weed eater too.0 -
Only caution I can think of is if you have an older (mid 80s or earlier) car and the engine has never been rebuilt. The old seals/gaskets don't like synthetic at all... and you'll get all sorts of leaks
Of course, if you've got an old one like that (mine is a '65 porsche 356) then you should just use store brand dino oil - the worst today is a lot better than the top shelf of the '60s....0 -
quote:Originally posted by iwannausername
Only caution I can think of is if you have an older (mid 80s or earlier) car and the engine has never been rebuilt. The old seals/gaskets don't like synthetic at all... and you'll get all sorts of leaks
Of course, if you've got an old one like that (mine is a '65 porsche 356) then you should just use store brand dino oil - the worst today is a lot better than the top shelf of the '60s....
Its a 99 neon, 4cyl I think, 120 thousand miles.0 -
BEFORE you buy anything, READ this website THOROUGHLY. It will answer EVERY question you have and then some. [:)]
http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/ubbthreads.php0 -
quote:Originally posted by 300Win_Mag
BEFORE you buy anything, READ this website THOROUGHLY. It will answer EVERY question you have and then some. [:)]
http://theoildrop.server101.com/forums/ubbthreads.php
Whoa. THanks, Ill take this website to him, he can check it out on the laptop0 -
The type of oil you need should be determined by the type of driving you do. If you live in a rural area and take a nice 20 mile drive to work every morning at moderate speeds then very little demand is placed on your engine oil. If you struggle those same 20 miles in urban bumper to bumper/stop and go traffic or your car does nothing but short trips around town all day your oil is under much greater strain to perform. Petroleum is a useful lubricant but science can create lubricants which are much better, although these are always more expensive. If you operate your car or truck in low temperatures or in high heat under heavy loads (like pulling a trailer) your oil is going to be working very hard. Heat will start to break down mineral based motor oils at around 275F and if temperatures reach around 325F your oil has only hours to live. At around 400F mineral based motor oil is severely damaged and at 425F it will coke, cutting off lubrication to your engine and the end is near. Low temperatures are nearly as bad because condensation builds up in the oil and water inside your engine is never a good thing. 220F is an optimal temperature for mineral based oils since temperature is high enough to remove any condensation (water boils at 212F) but this also remains well within the operating heat range of the oil. Synthetics can handle high heat with very little trouble and running synthectic oil at over 300F is not an issue and while touching 400F for short periods will shorten a synthectic oil's life, it will not break down at that temperature.
Something that the oil companies don't want you to know is that oil itself does not wear out. In fact the hydrocarbon molecules in petroleum are tough little devils and that is why they have to be attacked so hard at the refinery in order to break them down (high heat and chemical cracking)! With a good quality oil filter and a good air filter there is very little dirt entering your engine oil so oil does not get "dirty" either. The change in color from gold (or green) to black is almost always a result of the chemical reactions that the detergent additives inside the oil under go. What does get used up in the oil is the additive package and if you buy plain jane motor oil you are getting just the minimum amounts of additives allowed in the API specs. Premium oils have more additives and can hold out longer before these additives are used up or deluted. If you could run your engine day and night at a comfortable room temperature of around 70F using a moderate throttle setting the engine's oil would last for thousands of hours of service before it would need to be changed. Of course no one has a car which lives in such a perfect world. Gas turbines, which operate in fixed locations, run at constant speeds for days on end and burn clean fules like propane or natural gas will likely never need oil changes at all until they reach their service interval and are taken out of service for inspection. I'd like to hear from our powerplant engineer codenamePual on that issue.
Long story short: 5,000 miles on synthectics is easy and 7500 miles quite possible. At 10K you need to examine what kinds of driving you have been doing to determine just how much longer the oil should remain in serivce. Under optimal conditions you could probably go 15K on full synthetics but I can't see risking the engine to save a few bucks by pushing the issue. I use Mobil-1 in all of my Mercedes and change the oil at 8000 intervals...BUT I always change the oil filter at 4000 miles (half way between actual oil changes) and then top up with more Mobil-1. You will never damage an engine by changing your oil too often and you won't hurt it by burning premium gasoline either, but most of the time you are just wasting your money by doing either and the oil comapanies just sit back watch their cash registers ring up more profit!
Another way to look at changing motor oil is by hours of service. The API mandates a test for motor oils which wish to be certified and if they pass the test they can be marketed in the United States and bear the API donut on the container. The test runs for 216 hours because this is considered the useful life on a mineral based motor oil. At an average spped of 45 mph 216 hours gets you about 10,000 miles, not bad at all. The probelm here is that very few of us drive at a constant speed of 45 mph for 200 straight hours! Most people in fact manage to cover perhaps 5,000 miles in 200 hours of passenger vehicle operation, or an average speed of 25 mph. If you are using mineral based motor oil and going longer than 200 hours between oil changes you may be pushing that oil to it's limit. There are a lot of differeing opinions on this but if you notice there are virtually no passenger vehicles sold with engine hour chronometers while nearly all large trucks and heavy equipment have these meters to track their service intervals. Automobile companies figure the average car buyer is a total idiot so it is much easier to just tell him to change his motor oil every 5,000 miles rather than have him accurately track the time the oil has been in service. This is the same reason they did away with all those useful gauges on the intrument panel- they just got you confused: " My God, my oil temperature is 225 degrees" (when in fact that is a near ideal operating temperature for motor oil). 300+ hours of serivce are not at all unusual for full synthectic oils but to keep to your car's warranty in effect you'll have to follow the manufacturers guidelines, even when using sythectic oil.0 -
Synthetic is the was to go. With the price of oil going from .89 cents a quart to $2.00 and synthetic coming down to about 3.50. Not much differance in price anymore. Synthetic is much better in cold weather as it maintains about the same viscosity cold, as when warmed up. Unlike normal oil that give you the cold start problems. Synthetic starts better in the cold and is better for the motor. Syntetic doesn't break down in the heat like normal oil. Making it better for your motor. It doesn't leave buildup or deposits in you motor. I think it's the way to go. I'm not sure of the years. However older cars don't work well with the sythetic. The old gasket material does not handle it. It's not the age of the gaskets it the material they are made of. I think anything from the 90's and up should be newer style gasket material to handle the sythetic. I've always used it in my 97 neon 189,000 still ticking without a problem 2004 Durango, to new but still 32,000 no problem. One note the Neons are know for head gasket problems. I never had one(thank you GOD). The sythetic oil? Who knows. 0 -
Thanks "Kristov" for that good info on synthetic oil.
I have always wondered if I should switch my Harley over to synthetic. Its air cooled and the temps in heavy traffic will shut down the engine if it gets too hot. Never had that happen but our club does parades and several other riders have had it happen.
Harley specifes their diesel grade HD oil and the dealer tells me that unless you are running in a hot climate like AZ or CA its not necessary. But I ran a rally up to Grand Couliee Dam and it was over 100 degrees the whole way. Two up riding adds weight and the engine is one hot motor. When you stop in traffic the heat coming up from the engine practically drives you off the bike.
What do you think about Amzoil for Harleys??0 -
Any large displacement motorcycle engine should be running synthectic oil and this specifically applies to air cooled engines because there is little to no reserve cooling built into the design. Older BMW and Guzzi twins had their cylinders out in the air flow and that helped them quite a bit but V-twins designs are not really ideal when it comes to keeping the engine cool. By design motorcycle engines have to be very compact for their displacement (they also have to have visual appeal since they are not under the hood) and since they put out much more power per cubic inch than automobile engines they build up heat very fast and tend to lose it at a much slower rate. Even liquid cooled motorcycle engines like those found on the current BMWs have extremely small radiators for their engine displacement and unless they are kept moving the engine coolant cannot cope with the heat build up, even with a electric fan for the radiator. The engine oil is going to have to pick up the slack here and mineral based oils are not up to the task. You will never harm an engine by running synthetic oil but you can shorten it's life by staying with mineral oil if conditions are harsh.
When it comes to chemistry I have been accused here on GB of talking out of my a$$ so you may want to take my decade of experience as an engineer in the petroleum industry with a grain of salt.0 -
[8D]-After my 1200 mile break-in on my 2006 Nissan XTERRA I changed to 5/30 Mobile 1/K&N gold oil filter--
--Recommendation is to change once a year or 7500 miles--
--I don't drive my X around town--
-[:D][:D]--JIMBO0 -
A second vote for Amsoil. It's the best on the market. Email me and I'll give you the name of a guy who will sell it at dealer cost. The real trick is to use their filters too. They are different than standard oil filters and will let you use the oil to it's full life of 20,000 to 25,000 miles.
It cost more, but runs 5 to 7 times longer between changes and saves in the end.
Amsoil has an engine flush if you've been using petroleum based oils for more than 40,000 miles. You should do the flush before the first change.0 -
I use Castrol Syntech(full synthetic) in all my rides. 10-40 in the 460 Ford and 5-40 in the rest.
Change oil and filter every 15000. Been doing that for many years, and have never had a problem with old or new vehicles, back to a VERY high mileage '65 Mustang that I bought used.
D.0 -
I don't know about other oil companies, but Valvoline makes a regular oil for higher mileage vehicles. They call it "Max Life". Supposed to have extra "additives" for a higher mileage engine. I bought my Cherokee used with about 25000 miles on it. Previous owner had always used plain old Valvoline. At 70,000 I switched to the Max Life with no problems at all. Pushing 100000 now and it still runs like a top and doesn't use a drop of oil.
Mobil One makes a synthetic for high mileage vehicles that have used conventional oil in the past. They do recommend a short change interval on the first use to get rid of the sludge it cleans out of the engine.
http://www.mobil1.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_High_Mileage_10W-40.aspx0 -
I use Mobil 1 in my Avalanche which I bought new in 2002. At 12000 miles I switched from regular to synthetic. Instead of changing every 3000 miles, I change when the built in computer tells me to. This is usually 4500 to 6500 miles. The extended performance Mobil 1 says you can go 15,000 miles between changes but I don't want to take a chance with my $31,600 vehicle, so I don't see any savings. My last oil change cost $46 and I could get a conventional oil change for less than half of that and do it every 3000 miles. I think my engine is well lubed but I never had a problem with my engines and conventional Valvoline or Castrol motor oil. 0 -
mrmoly.com Molybdenum. Oil additive. Actually tightens tolerances (main/rod bearings valve guides piston skirt and ring to cylinder tolerances cam follower/lobe tolerances). Directions for use and ordering info at the website. Recommended for use with refined oil. Your call. Rgds, Joe 0 -
My car, a Chrysler Crossfire, requires Mobil 1 (0W-40). Oil changes are prompted by the onboard computer and occur every 7500 or so miles depending upon my driving style and the conditions.
Pete0 -
I used synthetic in my powerstroke, until a ford mechanic told me its not the lubrication part wears out, but the anti foaming agents break down which is hard on powerstrokes, because of the high pressure oil fired injectors. He said you could tell, when your pulling hard with the truck then pull up at a light and starts idling rough it gets air in the oil 0 -
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I have 185,000 miles on my truck; the oil has been changed three times since new.
I won't change it again until the truck hits 200,000 miles or so.
Synthetic oils are far superior to conventional motor oils.
My motors can prove it.0 -
I use Mobil 1 in all five of my vehicles and never a problem. I pulled one engine apart and it was still like new. I've been sold on Mobil 1 for around 10 years now. I think its one of the best. Most of my vehicles have over 100,000 miles on them and about the only thing that ever leaked was a valve cover. 0 -
I use Castro Syntex in everything that's got a motor on it at my place with no problems ever. I suppose you could use vegetable oil if you changed it often enough. I never had any problems using regular oil back in the old days because I changed it often and kept the RPM's out of the red line.
Smitty0 -
quote:Originally posted by Sawz
I used synthetic in my powerstroke, until a ford mechanic told me its not the lubrication part wears out, but the anti foaming agents break down which is hard on powerstrokes, because of the high pressure oil fired injectors. He said you could tell, when your pulling hard with the truck then pull up at a light and starts idling rough it gets air in the oil
Time for a new mechanic.0
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