Cowdoc, Tobefree ever seen this?
Can you imagine what this kid was thinking? "Dads going to kill me!"
Don't know any details, just another email, but thought the farm folks would enjoy.
I have some more, I'll see if I can find.
Don't know any details, just another email, but thought the farm folks would enjoy.
I have some more, I'll see if I can find.
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quote:Originally posted by Captplaid
quote:Originally posted by sarge_3ad
quote:Originally posted by cowdoc
beyond me how the air seeder is farther in the creek than the tractor
the tractor is a 9400 the cart is a 1900 or 1910 looks like a 350 bushell cart with a 46ft 1820 toolbar dont think its a 54 ft.
you red guys crack me up....[:D] how long has John deere been in business.....hmmmmmmmmm....[:D] lets try about 170 years and havent stayed in business that long with no signs of going under because they make junk......LOL
[:D][:D][:D][:D]
I bet you still call it IHCASE instead of it's true name CASEIH.
What's a Case? [:D]0 -
Deere may have changed the deer in the logo It's still John Deere and will be for long long time[;)]
hell i can't even remember how many name changes red equipment has had through out the years.....International harvester hasn't been around for quite some time now......no worries though i used to think red was king back when i was a kid.....honest truth is...was because i was envious of the guys who had Big Green....grandpa had green, i'd park that red stuff in a heart beat to run his green stuff whenever i had a chance.[:D][8D]
Sarge, if you like red thats fine by me i don't have a problem with it[:D] dad still has an 806....he did have a 400,1206 and a 12560 -
quote:Originally posted by cowdoc
Deere may have changed the deer in the logo It's still John Deere and will be for long long time[;)]
hell i can't even remember how many name changes red equipment has had through out the years.....International harvester hasn't been around for quite some time now......no worries though i used to think red was king back when i was a kid.....honest truth is...was because i was envious of the guys who had Big Green....grandpa had green, i'd park that red stuff in a heart beat to run his green stuff whenever i had a chance.[:D][8D]
Sarge, if you like red thats fine by me i don't have a problem with it[:D] dad still has an 806....he did have a 400,1206 and a 1256
I got to agree with you. That green stuff is some pretty nice equipment, and John Deere is one of the few companies that still has everything from harvesting equipment, down to yard equipment, to boots. I grew up around that red stuff. Dad always had International, and his landlord partner owned a IH dealership in Hudson, IL which is still in business today. My older brother turned wrenches for our local dealer here in Iowa for over 25 years. Now you know why I am partial to IH. And like John Deere, IH made alot of things over the years from trucks to deep freezer, and refrigerators, and a bunch of farm equipment in between. I think it may have been bad management is why they sold out all those times, but I know it was always a stuggle for them to compete with John Deere.0 -
i forgot to mention one of dads uncles was one of the top ten guys at IH years ago don't know alot more than that though....he passed away several years ago in AZ...... started out as a parts man at an IH dealer in SE S Dak and made it near to the top....didn't see him often enough to ever ask him about it.[:(] 0 -
The Deere with the most tires has the right of way, everybody knows that. [:D] 0 -
Sarge, you're only partially right about that competition concept with Deere and IH. I did a financial and management study on Deere for a Finance class back about 1970, and there were some real interesting concept shifts and financial changes between the two companies.
IH really took off in the semi-modern era due to a deliberate Depression era decision about new models and upgrades. They had been making the F12, F14, F20, and F30 models for some time and were dealing with a pretty static market due to both the Depression and outdated equipment. No hydraulics, crank start, cable brakes that locked up one side to assist turning if the steering wheel was cranked clear over, and no lights.
Money was tight and the company didn't want to risk going bankrupt trying to retool for a new product that likely would not sell well enough to pay the cost of the new production lines, so the company just sat tight on production models and spent what little extra money they had on R&D for a new product line. They spent far more than a normal number of years working on the new design since it wasn't going to go into production in the near future regardless, and that gave them the time they needed to get the design well developed and most of the bugs worked out.
When they introduced the "H" and "M" series, they were able to produce a unit that was far ahead of the competition in terms of style, convenience, and comfort and they grabbed the market. Deere had the old "two lunger" and just did a "fair" job of keeping up with the trend change.
IH tried to ride that horse for too long and only moderately upgraded the basics with the "Super" H and M, and not much more with the 350 etc. The 560 had "M" axles in it if my information is correct, until they finally installed stronger axels, and then made the same mistake with the 706, which came out with 560 axels. The number that broke was legion until a stronger shaft got put in that one also.
The 560 had a 263 Black Diamond truck engine in it that was too light for the continuous duty required in a 65 HP tractor, and the first of the 706 engines were a three piston ring unit I believe, and had to be replaced by a five ring piston to make it hold. It still sold though, due to some good styling changes and the carryover of the company reputation.
Deere was in trouble by the end of the 50's and the early 60's, but had observed and learned the lessons of IH during the Depression. They had a very limited customer base, but the one's they had were drop dead loyal, much like Crown Victoria drivers today. Deere made a conscious choice to let IH go with their new models like the 560 and spend the extra time on R&D to get the next generation of green tractors ready to go with the bugs shaken out to the greatest degree possible. It really was not too much of a gamble since the customer base they had would buy green regardless, and they weren't going to attract many new customers with the old "Johnny Popper".
They spent a couple of extra years working on the R&D and living with limited sales, but when they hit the market with the 3010 and 4010, they had a pair of winners that beat anything red on the market. IH eventually got the problems whipped on their products, but the damage was done and Deere has been in the drivers seat ever since.
The money Deere made from those lines financed the product development of the rest of their equipment to a greater degree than most other companies could afford, at least if they wanted to make a profit.
I still drive a couple of red tractors, but every bit of my planting and harvesting equipment is green.
The only reason that I don't own a green tractor is because they tend to have about a $10,000 premium built in to the price per unit, and I don't see that there is enough difference in the horsepower pulling the tools down the field to justify the cost. That's not true of the machines that handle the grain, and that will remain green until, and if, I see something that is genuinely better in red.
I'm not holding my breath.0 -
quote:Originally posted by cowdoc
Deere may have changed the deer in the logo It's still John Deere and will be for long long time[;)]
hell i can't even remember how many name changes red equipment has had through out the years.....International harvester hasn't been around for quite some time now......no worries though i used to think red was king back when i was a kid.....honest truth is...was because i was envious of the guys who had Big Green....grandpa had green, i'd park that red stuff in a heart beat to run his green stuff whenever i had a chance.[:D][8D]
Sarge, if you like red thats fine by me i don't have a problem with it[:D] dad still has an 806....he did have a 400,1206 and a 1256
What's an 806? Is that compareable to a 4010 NF Gas? Rode on a fender of an International once while bailing hay for some guy at from my cousin's church. Other than that, never been on an International. Heck, never started an M, or a 2 cylnder for that matter. It amazes me that Deere was able to use the same engineering styles for decades. For example, they used the taper lock engineering for the rear wheels to the axle from the last 2 cylders into the 50 Series of the 90's.
When you consider how tractor's evolved over the years, they still used the same basic logic in many areas. Heck, maybe the new stuff would be completely foriegn, but we rarely would say "What the heck were they thinking." ...except maybe the time the counter shaft(???) was replaced on the 6600 combine. It was rears ago, and that combine is long gone, but you had to cut a hole in the side of the cab to slide it out. The dang shaft was installed before the cab and they didn't think about having to replace it someday.
Thanks for the pic.0 -
806 IH is about a 90 hp tractor ie about like a 4020 JD... dads is a wide front with a 6 cyl diesel engine and no cab 0 -
Interesting information Drjj. You are very much correct about the 3010's and 4010's being better then their competition at the time. Heck those models are still working well today. Its interesting to note though, that even though JD was a head of IH with tractors. IH and then Case IH and now CNH has been ahead of JD in combines since the late 70's. JD on the other had has dominated the planting market, and untill the last 5-6 years no body had anything that was comparable. The competition between them has been fierce. 0 -
"IH and then Case IH and now CNH has been ahead of JD in combines since the late 70's."
not so sure i would agree with that Shoff.....i live in the middle of wheat country and 9 out of ten combines that go through this country on the wheat harvest run are green....not to many custom guys run red combines that run in these parts.....rotors may be better for easier threshing crop such as corn and beans but rotors can't keep up in wheat when conditions are less than ideal....even the the green rotors cant run as long in the evening when the straw gets tough compared to coventionals but are better than the red ones0 -
Rotors are tough on the straw also. Just chew it up, but few people in Illinois would give a care about straw quality.
I can imagine straw walkers and sieves do a better job on wheat.0 -
Cowdoc, that may be the case with wheat, we never run that much 2-400 acres a year just as a filler it helps with corn and beans. Never on cash cropped land though, cause it doesn't pay. You also probably get a lot of wind that puts the wheat on the ground, I know how fun that is. [xx(] I do know though that for a while, ethanol and tofu bean grain would not be taken from someone with a "green" combine. It was just to dirty to handle for them. There are still a lot of JD conventional combines running in Ohio, but not as many as there used to be. Last time I saw any of the "green" farms around my parents, they had all went to the rotor. I remember when we changed, we quit cleaning are grain. That was a huge time savings and money savings. I have also never ran a red combine, ours are yellow [:0] [:D]. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by cowdoc
quote:Originally posted by sarge_3ad
Here's another to add to your collection tobefree.
John Deere crushing a chevy[:D] don't get any better than that[8D]
It ain't crushing that Chevy! That Chevy is laying on it's side laughing at the feeble attempt to crush it![:D]0 -
Why do I bother.
I'm sure that Highball will come around and show us how much he knows and just how dumb the rest of us are relative to anything.
Right HB?
Educate me now.0 -
quote:Originally posted by dlrjj
Why do I bother.
I'm sure that Highball will come around and show us how much he knows and just how dumb the rest of us are relative to anything.
Right HB?
Educate me now.
did i step on your toes or something?0 -
Nope, not in the least.
I'm just a bit annoyed at the "saints" who wish to tell the rest of us how to think when we get done with the toilet paper in the morning.
You are not one of that type, so I'm sorry if I misled or offended you.0 -
quote:Originally posted by dlrjj
Nope, not in the least.
I'm just a bit annoyed at the "saints" who wish to tell the rest of us how to think when we get done with the toilet paper in the morning.
You are not one of that type, so I'm sorry if I misled or offended you.
I thought your information was really interesting and I have never really looked at it the way you did.0 -
dlrjj ????
shoff i have never heard of such a thing as somebody not buying grain corn or beans around here if harvested with a green combine...... and i have run a combine for for near 30 years....yes i started running then at an early age.
there was a couple years i hired custom outfit,they had two combines an 8820 and a 1680....i told they guy with the 1680 if he couldn't get the grain any cleaner ......wheat looked like it was all chaff in grain box of truck, to park it. when he got the sample cleaner the grain return was always plugged .....so i guess no red ones for me.......and as captplaid said the straw is all ground up......baling straw from behind a rotor is the poops to bale...can be done but you are about ready to kill something by the end of the day.....
I'm all green here and as dlrjj say the tractor carry about a 10,000 premium but you get it back in the end we have run some jd tractors to 20,000 hrs and have had to do very little repair work to them.....
Case IH guy in town here was always asking me why i wont buy red from him and finally told him that when they get the engineers to fully engineer their stuff all the way to the end instead of saying "F--k it thats close enough to work..maybe they'll have something[:D][:D] he just hung his head and walked away[:D]
Oh well, each to their own.0
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