Help! I made a sale on the auction side...
of one of my rifles and now the buyer says his FFL will not send a copy of his license to anyone other than another FFL holder.
Has anyone else had this problem? I did not factor the price of a transfer on my end into the auction. I read the sellers guide and I think I've done/or am doing everything that was required on my end.
Any advice?
Has anyone else had this problem? I did not factor the price of a transfer on my end into the auction. I read the sellers guide and I think I've done/or am doing everything that was required on my end.
Any advice?
0
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You are doing your part. Your buyer needs to find another FFL holder. Some FFL holders out there have some strange policies that they go by, but it is not the law. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by garanch
You are doing your part. Your buyer needs to find another FFL holder. Some FFL holders out there have some strange policies that they go by, but it is not the law.
+10 -
his problem
yours is to ship the item, thats it.0 -
you really don't need the buyers FFL all you need is the first 3 numbers and the last 5 numbers of the dealers FFL and then go to the ATF site
https://www.atfonline.gov/fflezcheck/
this is listed under FOR SELLERS then click on >
[Verify an FFL License]
type in those numbers and it will give you all the info you need,, i would think the buyer should be able to get those numbers for you0 -
You don't really need a copy of his license,(unless you are a licensee) just the license number so you can verify he is a licensee.
Don0 -
Do any of you know if the the EZ check will give me the address of the FFL I'm going to ship to? 0 -
Yes, it will. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by dongizmo
You don't really need a copy of his license,(unless you are a licensee) just the license number so you can verify he is a licensee.
Don
NO! - that is INCORRECT!!! After you enter the FFL number, the ATF website specifically states that you can NOT use the "EZ-check" system as a substitute for a signed copy of the dealer's FFL as required by law! The EZ check system is simply to verify that someone actually has a license but you can NOT use it in lieu of a signed, faxed or e-mailed copy of the actual license.
I've had the same problem with dealers here refusing to send a copy of their license to a private party and have lost several opportunites because of it.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Spider7115
quote:Originally posted by dongizmo
You don't really need a copy of his license,(unless you are a licensee) just the license number so you can verify he is a licensee.
Don
NO! - that is INCORRECT!!! After you enter the FFL number, the ATF website specifically states that you can NOT use the "EZ-check" system as a substitute for a signed copy of the dealer's FFL as required by law! The EZ check system is simply to verify that someone actually has a license but you can NOT use it in lieu of a signed, faxed or e-mailed copy of the actual license.
I've had the same problem with dealers here refusing to send a copy of their license to a private party and have lost several opportunites because of it.
If that's the case can an FFL send a copy with all but the first three and last five blacked out?
I'm still unclear as to why a FFL would object to sending a copy anyways since his is the only address using his number where a firearm can be sent.0 -
If your ad said 'buyer supplies FFL' or something like that, it's his problem. If it didn't it's yours.
Clouder..0 -
Tell him to find another dealer who will send a copy of his ffl to you or he will not get his money back. If he hasn't paid you then tell him to complete his end or you will file a non-paying bidder report so you can get your gun broker fees back. You have done you job, it is up to him to get everything you need to you. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by LaidbackDan
quote:Originally posted by Spider7115
quote:Originally posted by dongizmo
You don't really need a copy of his license,(unless you are a licensee) just the license number so you can verify he is a licensee.
Don
NO! - that is INCORRECT!!! After you enter the FFL number, the ATF website specifically states that you can NOT use the "EZ-check" system as a substitute for a signed copy of the dealer's FFL as required by law! The EZ check system is simply to verify that someone actually has a license but you can NOT use it in lieu of a signed, faxed or e-mailed copy of the actual license.
I've had the same problem with dealers here refusing to send a copy of their license to a private party and have lost several opportunites because of it.
If that's the case can an FFL send a copy with all but the first three and last five blacked out?
I'm still unclear as to why a FFL would object to sending a copy anyways since his is the only address using his number where a firearm can be sent.
No, because those are the numbers the shipping dealer needs to record in his book. Some dealers are afraid to send their FFL to a private buyer because the gun they receive may be stolen. They have no way to confirm that a copy of a driver's license actually belongs to the sender. I share your frustration - I lost a New-inbox .45LC US Firearms "Rodeo" revolver yesterday because the seller didn't have a local FFL dealer to ship the gun and the dealers in my area won't send their FFL to anyone but another FFL. It does suck.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Spider7115
quote:Originally posted by LaidbackDan
quote:Originally posted by Spider7115Originally posted by dongizmo
You don't really need a copy of his license,(unless you are a licensee) just the license number so you can verify he is a licensee.
Don
NO! - that is INCORRECT!!! After you enter the FFL number, the ATF website specifically states that you can NOT use the "EZ-check" system as a substitute for a signed copy of the dealer's FFL as required by law! The EZ check system is simply to verify that someone actually has a license but you can NOT use it in lieu of a signed, faxed or e-mailed copy of the actual license.
I've had the same problem with dealers here refusing to send a copy of their license to a private party and have lost several opportunites because of it.
If that's the case can an FFL send a copy with all but the first three and last five blacked out?
I'm still unclear as to why a FFL would object to sending a copy anyways since his is the only address using his number where a firearm can be sent.
No, because those are the numbers the shipping dealer needs to record in his book. Some dealers are afraid to send their FFL to a private buyer because the gun they receive may be stolen. They have no way to confirm that a copy of a driver's license actually belongs to the sender. I share your frustration - I lost a "new-in-box" .45LC US Firearms "Rodeo" revolver for $400 yesterday because the seller didn't have a local FFL dealer to ship the gun and the dealers in my area won't send their FFL to anyone but another FFL. It does suck.0 -
The ultimate Solution!!! 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gkq7HLBe1780 -
Find the nearest FFL near you and find his cost to send and use his license number. Buyer needs to pay that amount. Next time in you auctions state that your sale is from a private collector( not a shop)and if buyer needs an FFL on your end he must pay the $25 charge.( thats what my FFL charges) 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Spider7115
quote:Originally posted by dongizmo
You don't really need a copy of his license,(unless you are a licensee) just the license number so you can verify he is a licensee.
Don
NO! - that is INCORRECT!!! After you enter the FFL number, the ATF website specifically states that you can NOT use the "EZ-check" system as a substitute for a signed copy of the dealer's FFL as required by law! The EZ check system is simply to verify that someone actually has a license but you can NOT use it in lieu of a signed, faxed or e-mailed copy of the actual license.
I've had the same problem with dealers here refusing to send a copy of their license to a private party and have lost several opportunites because of it.
Heh heh heh
And how long have you had your ffl?
Why is is the guys who don't hold licenses know so much more than the ones that do?
A non licensee does not need a certified copy in his file of where he shipped a firearm to, a licensee (holder of a 01/02 ffl) does.
All a non licensee need to do is verify that he is shipping to a dealer.
BTW, I do send out licenses to non licensee's, even though I don't have to.
Don0 -
quote:Originally posted by dongizmo
quote:Originally posted by Spider7115
quote:Originally posted by dongizmo
You don't really need a copy of his license,(unless you are a licensee) just the license number so you can verify he is a licensee.
Don
NO! - that is INCORRECT!!! After you enter the FFL number, the ATF website specifically states that you can NOT use the "EZ-check" system as a substitute for a signed copy of the dealer's FFL as required by law! The EZ check system is simply to verify that someone actually has a license but you can NOT use it in lieu of a signed, faxed or e-mailed copy of the actual license.
I've had the same problem with dealers here refusing to send a copy of their license to a private party and have lost several opportunites because of it.
Heh heh heh
And how long have you had your ffl?
Why is is the guys who don't hold licenses know so much more than the ones that do?
A non licensee does not need a certified copy in his file of where he shipped a firearm to, a licensee (holder of a 01/02 ffl) does.
All a non licensee need to do is verify that he is shipping to a dealer.
BTW, I do send out licenses to non licensee's, even though I don't have to.
Don
"Heh heh heh?" What makes you think I don't have an FFL? Well, I do and have had one for years. Although it's a C&R, I'm subject to the same ATF rules that you are. In fact, I had an ATF agent at my home last week inspecting my bound book. The whole point of this thread, as I understand it, is that the buyer's dealer will not accept a firearm from a non-licensee. Therefore, the seller must use an FFL dealer, which means an"EZ Check" is NOT acceptable for a certified copy of the FFL.
Look it up. Heh heh heh.0 -
Federal Firearms License Search
The purpose of this program is to allow an FFL or other user to verify that a Federal Firearms License (FFL) is valid.
The user needs only enter the first 3 digits and the last 5 digits of the FFL being verified in the blocks provided and select the SUBMIT button. Selecting the RESET button will clear previously entered data.
FFL eZ Check does not validate Type 03 (Collectors of Curios and Relics) and Type 06 (Manufacturer of Ammunition) licenses. All attempts to check the validity of Type 03 and Type 06 licenses will result in an error message, even though the licenses may be valid. An FFL should not use this error message as reason to deny dealing with a Type 03 licensee.
Enter the FFL Number: - - - - -
FFL Number Example: 9 - 99 - XXX - XX - XX - 999990 -
quote:Originally posted by LaidbackDan
of one of my rifles and now the buyer says his FFL will not send a copy of his license to anyone other than another FFL holder.
Has anyone else had this problem? I did not factor the price of a transfer on my end into the auction. I read the sellers guide and I think I've done/or am doing everything that was required on my end.
Any advice?
Yep, I ran into that a couple of times myself. I try to avoid it because it simply raises the cost of trading, and the dealers know this. I bought a rifle from a fellow and come to find out that my FFL had the same rule. The seller checked with his FFL and got hit with a $50.00 cost on his end. When I found this out, I asked if we could swing the deal if I paid half of the FFL fee on his end ($25.00) and he was able to do that for me. I think if people check around that many will find that the FFL fees run from as low as zero dollars if you have a friend who is an FFL agent, or as low as ten to fifteen bucks from some FFL holders who don't run a store, to as high as $50.00. Whew!
Individual sellers have to be really sharp to compete with FFL dealers. Some tips would be to factor in as many costs as possible to the minimum amount you want for your firearm, state in your ad that you are not an FFL dealer and that you will ship directly to their FFL dealer. Also, at least consider using UPS and FedEx Ground Transportation, or maybe two day air. For packaging material, go to local gun shops and ask for any cardboard firearm shipping boxes that they have destined for the trash bin, and buy large bubble wrap to protect from damage. Be creative and you'll do just fine.
Good luck.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Spider7115
quote:Originally posted by dongizmo
quote:Originally posted by Spider7115
quote:Originally posted by dongizmo
You don't really need a copy of his license,(unless you are a licensee) just the license number so you can verify he is a licensee.
Don
NO! - that is INCORRECT!!! After you enter the FFL number, the ATF website specifically states that you can NOT use the "EZ-check" system as a substitute for a signed copy of the dealer's FFL as required by law! The EZ check system is simply to verify that someone actually has a license but you can NOT use it in lieu of a signed, faxed or e-mailed copy of the actual license.
I've had the same problem with dealers here refusing to send a copy of their license to a private party and have lost several opportunites because of it.
Heh heh heh
And how long have you had your ffl?
Why is is the guys who don't hold licenses know so much more than the ones that do?
A non licensee does not need a certified copy in his file of where he shipped a firearm to, a licensee (holder of a 01/02 ffl) does.
All a non licensee need to do is verify that he is shipping to a dealer.
BTW, I do send out licenses to non licensee's, even though I don't have to.
Don
"Heh heh heh?" What makes you think I don't have an FFL? Well, I do and have had one for years. Although it's a C&R, I'm subject to the same ATF rules that you are. In fact, I had an ATF agent at my home last week inspecting my bound book. The whole point of this thread, as I understand it, is that the buyer's dealer will not accept a firearm from a non-licensee. Therefore, the seller must use an FFL dealer, which means an"EZ Check" is NOT acceptable for a certified copy of the FFL.
Look it up. Heh heh heh.
A 03 is not a dealers license, it is a collecters license. quote:(G1) Is there a specific license which permits a collector to acquire firearms in interstate commerce? [Back]
Yes. A person may obtain a collector's license. However, this license applies only to transactions in curio or relic firearms.
[18 U.S.C. 923(b), 27 CFR 478.41(c), (d), 478.50(b) and 478.93]
(G2) Does a collector's license afford any privileges to the licensee with respect to acquiring or disposing of firearms other than curios or relics in interstate or foreign commerce? [Back]
No. A licensed collector has the same status under the GCA as a non-licensee except for transactions in curio or relic firearms.
[27 CFR 478.93]
(G3) Does a license as a collector of curio or relic firearms authorize the collector to engage in the business of dealing in curios or relics? [Back]
No. A dealer's license must be obtained to engage in the business of dealing in any firearms, including curios or relics.
[18 U.S.C. 922(a) and 923(a), 27 CFR 478.41]
http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#g1
it is a collecters license. look it up.
While your over there look at this:
quote:? 926 Rules and regulations.
(a) The Attorney General may prescribe
only such rules and regulations as are
necessary to carry out the provisions of
this chapter, including-
(1) regulations providing that a person
licensed under this chapter, when
dealing with another person so licensed,
shall provide such other licensed
person a certified copy of this
license;
http://www.atf.gov/pub/fire-explo_pub/2005/p53004/index.htm
The question is whether or not a non licensee needs a certified copy of the ffl he is shipping to, and there is no requirement for this, it is only required from licensee to licensee.0
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