Where does the universe end?
Or,are we just the beginning?
No,really.
No,really.
0
-
quote:Originally posted by mango tango
A billion million light years away!
i just returned from there, and trust me on this, it is a little bit further, down the road you will see a sign that reads: End of Universe, trillions of trillions of centillions and then some [:D][:o)]0 -
quote:Originally posted by KSUmarksman
tried reading some books on the subject...got a headache
watched "the Universe" on the History Channel...still got a headache
where's Maj. Samantha Carter when you need her [:D]
She's got a headache...0 -
first, consider what things were like shortly after the big bang. without addressing the absolute beginning or how matter/energy/(whatever form it was) acted differently under the initial conditions, simply consider the state of things "shortly after" the big bang. that's what's needed to explain what the boundaries of the universe were then, and you will see that a similar explanation describes what and where the end of the universe is now.
so: shortly after the big bang, radiation (light) from the "explosion" was propagating outward. beyond that radiation, nothing existed. no space, no time. no existence beyond that radiation. that was the boundary of the universe then.
it still is.
as far as that radiation has traveled, that is where the boundary of the universe is. it defines the boundary. beyond that, there still is no space, no time, nothing.
since the boundary of the universe is still expanding with that radiation, at the speed of light, it would be impossible for anything to catch up and reach the edge of the universe. or even "see" it.
since current estimates of the age of the universe are at about 14 billion years, the size of the universe would be about 14 billion light years going one way and another 14 billion light years going the other way, or 28 billion light years total diameter. it should be shaped like a perfect sphere.
an interesting question would be that since existence ends at how far light has traveled, does that prove that faster-than-light travel could never be attained? because that would imply that you could overtake the light at the edge of the universe and go beyond that into nonexistence, which should be impossible.
btw, 1911a1fan, you were talking about where the milky way galaxy ends and the andromeda galaxy begins. the question was where the universe ends.0 -
Probably, if the answer to that question was laid out on a table in front of us, in the simplest terms possible, even our smartest scientists could not understand the answer. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by bobski
in Gods lap.[;)]
btw...."call it God,"
God = it?
remind me not to stand next to you on judgement day.[:0]
It is only convention and linguistic etymology that has given us the name "God". Call the creator God, Yaweh, Gott, der Herr, or chicken soup- it is the concept that defines him, not the name. I also think that 'him' is probably not correct, in that I doubt god has a sex.0 -
of course. that's because man created god, not the other way around. 0 -
Everybody bow down, the great Buschmaster has spoken. 0 -
Where did the material for the big bang come from? If there is an end to space whats there, a brick wall? whats on the other side of the brick wall? If God created every thing what created God. 0 -
truth and knowledge is great. I'm just a pair of lips. 0 -
God is the only being whose reason for existence lies within Himself. God is eternal. There was never a time when God did not exist, nor will there ever be a time when God does not exist. Our finite minds cannot fathom this. Believing comes by faith. No scientist on the earth can shake my faith. Call me stupid, ignorant, narrow-minded, or whatever, I could care less. God's opinion is what matters. 0 -
you're creating your own fantasy. 0 -
About god, First of all, she is black.
quote:It isn't a bubble per se but is inflating and if you reached the 'edge' you would eventually just curve around to where you started. Such would be true no matter the scope of the universe, whether expanding or contracting.
But what is really cool is that because space is curved, you would come back along exactly the same line you left upon without ever turning around. You just go straight for a really long time (even longer than Nunn has been on the board) and then arrive where you started.0 -
The universe ends at the limits of our senses, perception and imagination. It will continue to grow with us as we expand our knowledge or contract with us as we close our minds.
Or maybe it just goes on forever, who knows?0 -
Simple. It's a marketing ploy. They'll announce the product later.
Clouder..0 -
0 -
If the universe is expanding what is it expanding into? Is there something beyond the universe? What if there are other universes & they should collide like galaxies do?
I have to admit I never concieved of an expanding universe but I did wonder how it could go on forever. There had to be an end but then what was beyond the end. That thought first occured to me when I was very young, probably by the third grade or so, maybe sixty years ago.
That's when I first began to question how God could have been forever
as well. The two seemed tied together.0 -
More importantly...how would knowing the answer benefit me!!!
Frankly, at this moment in time I could give a rat's ass!!!0 -
I don't know where the Universe ends. But when we find it, I can think of a couple gun grabbers that deserve a first class ticket there. [;)] 0 -
Accordin to MIB, on the other side of a locker door. 0 -
According to Timothy Leary, somewhere in your mind. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by buschmaster
first, consider what things were like shortly after the big bang. without addressing the absolute beginning or how matter/energy/(whatever form it was) acted differently under the initial conditions, simply consider the state of things "shortly after" the big bang. that's what's needed to explain what the boundaries of the universe were then, and you will see that a similar explanation describes what and where the end of the universe is now.
so: shortly after the big bang, radiation (light) from the "explosion" was propagating outward. beyond that radiation, nothing existed. no space, no time. no existence beyond that radiation. that was the boundary of the universe then.
it still is.
as far as that radiation has traveled, that is where the boundary of the universe is. it defines the boundary. beyond that, there still is no space, no time, nothing.
since the boundary of the universe is still expanding with that radiation, at the speed of light, it would be impossible for anything to catch up and reach the edge of the universe. or even "see" it.
since current estimates of the age of the universe are at about 14 billion years, the size of the universe would be about 14 billion light years going one way and another 14 billion light years going the other way, or 28 billion light years total diameter. it should be shaped like a perfect sphere.
an interesting question would be that since existence ends at how far light has traveled, does that prove that faster-than-light travel could never be attained? because that would imply that you could overtake the light at the edge of the universe and go beyond that into nonexistence, which should be impossible.
btw, 1911a1fan, you were talking about where the milky way galaxy ends and the andromeda galaxy begins. the question was where the universe ends.
good job buschmaster, really good job of explanation you recieved through a book, you know this to be true from seeing it, or reading it? for what you have described is the very essence of god. the beginning and the end. alpha and omega.[;)][:D]0 -
quote:Originally posted by buschmaster
first, consider what things were like shortly after the big bang. without addressing the absolute beginning or how matter/energy/(whatever form it was) acted differently under the initial conditions, simply consider the state of things "shortly after" the big bang. that's what's needed to explain what the boundaries of the universe were then, and you will see that a similar explanation describes what and where the end of the universe is now.
so: shortly after the big bang, radiation (light) from the "explosion" was propagating outward. beyond that radiation, nothing existed. no space, no time. no existence beyond that radiation. that was the boundary of the universe then.
it still is.
as far as that radiation has traveled, that is where the boundary of the universe is. it defines the boundary. beyond that, there still is no space, no time, nothing.
since the boundary of the universe is still expanding with that radiation, at the speed of light, it would be impossible for anything to catch up and reach the edge of the universe. or even "see" it.
since current estimates of the age of the universe are at about 14 billion years, the size of the universe would be about 14 billion light years going one way and another 14 billion light years going the other way, or 28 billion light years total diameter. it should be shaped like a perfect sphere.
an interesting question would be that since existence ends at how far light has traveled, does that prove that faster-than-light travel could never be attained? because that would imply that you could overtake the light at the edge of the universe and go beyond that into nonexistence, which should be impossible.
btw, 1911a1fan, you were talking about where the milky way galaxy ends and the andromeda galaxy begins. the question was where the universe ends.
If all the matter (or even most of it) in the universe started out from a single point during dthe "big bang", then what you would have had would have been the mother of all black holes. Normally even light cannot escape from a black hole. So if there was indeed such an escape of the matter from which came the universe, that escape would have had been done at speeds higher than the speed of light.
Otherwise, there could be no escape.0 -
I'm a believer in the ever expanding universe, but after much reading, I'm still not sure why.
You can think it around in circles over beers all night long.
Imagine the noise it must make.0 -
quote:Where does the universe end?
At the end of my wife's nose...0 -
One of the guys who knows everything about everything on the Science Channel said there are billions of universes, all occupying more or less the same space. He said at least one of them is exactly like this universe except you aren't in it. He also said they are constantly colliding and causing another big bang which is probably the same big bang which started this universe. I think he was on dope. [:D] 0 -
And it's really tough to prove anybody is wrong 0 -
quote:Originally posted by tomahawk
good job buschmaster, really good job of explanation you recieved through a book, you know this to be true from seeing it, or reading it? for what you have described is the very essence of god. the beginning and the end. alpha and omega.[;)][:D]
that explanation was my own. it may already be an existing theory deduced by someone else, but I wouldn't know, I came to those conclusions myself and haven't bothered checking to see if it has been thought of already. and I have more theories. http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=231477
I have the capability to form such theories from the scientific skills I have and the knowledge gathered from the work of other scientists. so what I had to work with was not simply "what I read in a book";
a), the material from the books I studied has been worked on, rehashed, argued over, examined, validated, and so far concurred with by professionals who rely on those facts as a basis of their further work;
b), I understand what I have read and the knowledge and facts can be used for other scientific work as well. it's not an opinion, it's not word-of-mouth, it's a skill. it's "working knowledge". it's science.
contrast that to what you have read in the bible. that is not "working knowledge", it's completely heresy, and you simply read it and accept it. so you could say, what comes from the bible, "you just read it in a book".
to say my description "is the very essence of god" is ridiculous, like saying you type letters on your keyboard and they appear on the computer screen is the essence of god. it has nothing whatsoever to do with god. furthermore, us scientists deduce where the universe came from, and you god worshippers continually say "oh! see! thaaat's what we meant when we say god created everything" otherwise you would still be saying the sun revolves around the earth, the earth is flat, the earth was created in 6 days, yada yada yada. you wouldn't even know of the existence of dinosaurs let alone the rest of the solar system, let alone other galaxies. you keep changing the story to accomodate ours. who is right? it should be obvious.
quote:Originally posted by trfox
If all the matter (or even most of it) in the universe started out from a single point during dthe "big bang", then what you would have had would have been the mother of all black holes. Normally even light cannot escape from a black hole. So if there was indeed such an escape of the matter from which came the universe, that escape would have had been done at speeds higher than the speed of light.
that's a very good point. according to my Cosmic Zits theory (see link above) it may never have escaped. the universe may still be inside the boundaries of a black hole, it's just that it may physically be as large as it is, form our viewpoint, due to relativistic effects. if true, then viewed form the outside of the black hole that defines our existence (impossible for us) we're just another black hole.
those are my theories. they may not be true, or they may be proven decades from now, either way they're still a far better educated guess than mere speculation from what was read in an unproven book.0 -
At the edge of a field in south east Arkansas. Really. I think I was as far as I could have gotten from anywhere. 0 -
It depends on what you consider the universe. If you mean all the matter and radiation resultant from the Big Bang that created the material bubble that includes the planet we live on, then its physical limit ends not more that a few billion light years from your nose. If you think the Universe should contain everything then we will need a new name for what our big bang created. If you can consider a creation that includes multiple co-existing Big Bang results then lets call that the Omniverse. In that Omniverse we have our 14 Billion year old Universe and some older Universes that we can now see and call Quazars. Light from our Big Bang may not have gotten to them yet so they may not know our Universe exists yet unless they can detect our gravity the effects of which travel faster than the speed of light. Now that we understand that our universe ends a few billion light years away and that there is an Omniverse that is made up of a number of Universes we have to consider that there might be some sort of Megaverse that is made up of a number of Omniverses or maybe not maybe the Omniverse goes on forever.
Tim0 -
Haven't you heard? To infinity and beyond! Just ask a kid they can tell you. 0
Please sign in to leave a comment.
Comments
74 comments