rising price of ammo
The prices of all ammunition and it's components have gone through the roof lately and we're told it's due to the rising cost of raw metals.
If this is the case, why haven't .22 LR prices risen an equivalent amount? All other calibers have just about doubled in price, but from what I'm seeing in my area their cost really hasn't gone up at all.
If this is the case, why haven't .22 LR prices risen an equivalent amount? All other calibers have just about doubled in price, but from what I'm seeing in my area their cost really hasn't gone up at all.
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The WTO found that China was breaking trade rules by taxing
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decision was still confidential.0 -
We think ammo is expensive now! Wait until November.[B)] 0 -
overall price of lead dropped in the last two months of '07 too 1.25lb
but retail ammo prices went up jan 1st '08 and will continue to go up just as gasoline has. Bottom line though is if lead doesn't go back down they can't do anything but raise prices. BUT when (because it will) lead does fall the basturds have us by the balls. They will have a product that they can easily, & cheaply supply and have nursed us into paying premium dollar for it.
you can also thank our Chinese pals for the lead shortage as well0 -
Get ready to be photographed and finger printed for your new PAL license to purchase firearms and ammunition. 0 -
Increasing ammo cost is three things simultaneously:
Ammo is HEAVY, and much of the cost is transportation.
With oil/fuel price so high, that increases ammo costs.
Next issue, is that we have a war on, and lots of ammo manufacturing ability, as well as resources (eg brass) are going to fuel it, somewhat driving prices up in the rest of the market.
Lastly, price of copper/brass is also going up.
Why haven't .22s been affected? They have been too. Not so much, maybe, because being the most popular round, the market for them is a lot more competitive.
By the way, people talk about which firearms to invest in. . .
I think the better investment is in *AMMO*. Its less regulated, and has been (in general) appreciating more than guns anyway.0 -
quote:Originally posted by beantownshootah
Increasing ammo cost is three things simultaneously...These are the elements I've been hearing, too, but these don't add up.
Even prices on imported ammo has doubled, so it isn't the war monopolizing our resources that's driving these prices up.
If it were higher fuel costs that means shipping prices for all items would've also doubled during this same period. That hasn't happened.
Even low copper content foreign made ammo has doubled, so it isn't the rising cost of this metal.
As an example of .22 LR prices, Sportsman's Guide currently lists Eley Sport for $1,69. No price increase at all there.
Looks to me like the gouging has begun.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Txs
quote:Originally posted by beantownshootah
Increasing ammo cost is three things simultaneously...These are the elements I've been hearing, too, but these don't add up.
Even prices on imported ammo has doubled, so it isn't the war monopolizing our resources that's driving these prices up.
If it were higher fuel costs that means shipping prices for all items would've also doubled during this same period. That hasn't happened.
Even low copper content foreign made ammo has doubled, so it isn't the rising cost of this metal.
As an example of .22 LR prices, Sportsman's Guide currently lists Eley Sport for $1,69. No price increase at all there.
Looks to me like the gouging has begun.
Open your eyes! Look beyond your state, your country. The US dollar is in the toilet. Why would a foreign seller accept the same dollar today as they did a year ago when it has lost a loat of value quickly, very recently? Combine that with the cost of the raw materials and then think about your gouging statement.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Txs
quote:Originally posted by beantownshootah
Increasing ammo cost is three things simultaneously...These are the elements I've been hearing, too, but these don't add up.
Even prices on imported ammo has doubled, so it isn't the war monopolizing our resources that's driving these prices up.
If it were higher fuel costs that means shipping prices for all items would've also doubled during this same period. That hasn't happened.
Even low copper content foreign made ammo has doubled, so it isn't the rising cost of this metal.
As an example of .22 LR prices, Sportsman's Guide currently lists Eley Sport for $1,69. No price increase at all there.
Looks to me like the gouging has begun.
First of all, I disagree with your premise. I haven't seen any ammo prices double, though in general, I have seen an increase of maybe 15% each of the last two years for domestic new ammo. That's still WAY more of an increase than general inflation.
Its probable that some of the SURPLUS ammo has doubled in price, but that's only because we've gone from a situation of incredible over-supply (where ammo was unusually cheap for a while, particularly that steel cased commie AK ammo) to a shortage.
As far as I can tell, that goes for .22s as well. The Federal target ammo I used to pay $18 a brick for three years ago is now over $23, and that's an increase of nearly 30%. As mentioned above, the Wally bulk pack used to be $9 just two years ago, and now its over $12.
Sportsman's guide may be selling out inventory they acquired three or four years ago, for all you know. (Or they may be advertising a product they don't actually have in stock!).
In terms of the increases, its not one thing, its a combination of all three. The US military using tons of brass *does* affect the amount of brass on the market, for example.
Transportation costs hit ammo several times, since the raw materials have to be transported to make the stuff, then the ammo gets moved to distributors, then retailers. Ammo is particularly sensitive to transportation costs because it is so heavy. Other goods aren't so much.
And of course the weak dollar means ALL imports become proportionately more expensive.
Lastly, you can't "gouge" in a free market. If outfit "X" tries to charge you too much, outfit "Y" will charge you less and get all the business. That goes for the various ammo manufacturers, and between them. Even if every domestic manufacturer illegally conspired together to fix prices, they'd still be subject to foreign competition.0 -
quote:Originally posted by beantownshootah
quote:Originally posted by Txs
quote:Originally posted by beantownshootah
Increasing ammo cost is three things simultaneously...These are the elements I've been hearing, too, but these don't add up.
Even prices on imported ammo has doubled, so it isn't the war monopolizing our resources that's driving these prices up.
If it were higher fuel costs that means shipping prices for all items would've also doubled during this same period. That hasn't happened.
Even low copper content foreign made ammo has doubled, so it isn't the rising cost of this metal.
As an example of .22 LR prices, Sportsman's Guide currently lists Eley Sport for $1,69. No price increase at all there.
Looks to me like the gouging has begun.
First of all, I disagree with your premise. I haven't seen any ammo prices double, though in general, I have seen an increase of maybe 15% each of the last two years for domestic new ammo. That's still WAY more of an increase than general inflation.
Its probable that some of the SURPLUS ammo has doubled in price, but that's only because we've gone from a situation of incredible over-supply (where ammo was unusually cheap for a while, particularly that steel cased commie AK ammo) to a shortage.
As far as I can tell, that goes for .22s as well. The Federal target ammo I used to pay $18 a brick for three years ago is now over $23, and that's an increase of nearly 30%. As mentioned above, the Wally bulk pack used to be $9 just two years ago, and now its over $12.
Sportsman's guide may be selling out inventory they acquired three or four years ago, for all you know. (Or they may be advertising a product they don't actually have in stock!).
In terms of the increases, its not one thing, its a combination of all three. The US military using tons of brass *does* affect the amount of brass on the market, for example.
Transportation costs hit ammo several times, since the raw materials have to be transported to make the stuff, then the ammo gets moved to distributors, then retailers. Ammo is particularly sensitive to transportation costs because it is so heavy. Other goods aren't so much.
And of course the weak dollar means ALL imports become proportionately more expensive.
Lastly, you can't "gouge" in a free market. If outfit "X" tries to charge you too much, outfit "Y" will charge you less and get all the business. That goes for the various ammo manufacturers, and between them. Even if every domestic manufacturer illegally conspired together to fix prices, they'd still be subject to foreign competition.
Well said!0 -
I was in wal mart today and wiinchester 9mm 100rd packs went from
15.77 to 18:57 today [V][V][B)]0 -
guns dont have a service/shelf life. ammo does. ammo is not a good investment. its nice to have squirreled away if youre actively involved with shooting every day of the week, but not to invest in. people wont pay to have it shipped and the interstate regulation costs kill profits.
it would be like storing 5000 gallons of gas away to use 10 years from now.
vicg1, your theory looks good and sounds good, but has one flaw. if x charges more, when y tries to get your business, all the suppliers and feds who regulate raise the price on y. y can only offer it for a short while. then x wins out, but then gets charged more. its a roller coaster effect that allows the costs to rise unchecked, regulated by the govt and market. i belive its called facisim.0 -
Myself, I believe the increase in ammo costs are not due to the increase in raw materials but rather the first of many attempts to disarm the citizens. Second ammo is a better investment than gold with the constant increases in cost as well as the means to defend your family in uncertain times it would be very hard to find a better investment. As far as the statement ammo is not a good investment because of the short shelf life that is also incorrect since ammo in sealed tins and good air tight ammo cans will last a lifetime for many. I have fire surplus ammo dated in the mid 1940's with more power than most commercial ammo and mis-fires being a rare occurance. I would encourage anyone who can afford to buy ammo, high cap mags, and semi auto handguns and rifles to get all you can before its to late. 0 -
Exactly 1776!! Make it too expensive to shoot and they wount have to take your guns. They're squeezing us from both ends. Regulation and cost.
Jan 1st of every year has always been a good excuse to raise prices. Weather goods actually cost more doesn't matter.
Here in Illinois several years ago the state tried to make FOID card application fees $500. The NRA stepped in and stopped it.0 -
Box of 100 target 12 GA shotgun shells Wal-Mart UP 51% since Fall. 0 -
http://ammunitionaccountability.org/Legislation.htm
This wont help the Price either.0 -
I told a guy I know at a gunshop that the reason for high ammo prices is to limit crime. Soon, if you don't have the hundred dollars for a box of ammo, you won't be able to go out and hold up a liquor store. 0 -
How about the rising costs of firearms during hunting season..Have you noticed this?..GANDER MOUNTAIN COMES TO MIND..pffft..They are offically fired in my book 0 -
quote:Originally posted by e3mrk
http://ammunitionaccountability.org/Legislation.htm
This wont help the Price either.
The Illinois nazis want coded ammo by 1-1-2010 and if one still poseses uncoded ammo by 1-1-2011 one must dispose of said ammo by law.[:(!]0 -
1776....your using the french logic, build a pill box, crawl in it, and fight. have you ever tried to carry just ONE ammo can of 45acp anywhere for any length of time? for shtf sceneros, if you cant defend it, youll lose your investment. you must be mobile.
and what happens when the prices go down? youre gonna feel kinda stupid with a basement of ammo you spent your lifes savings on, and cant sell it because the price dropped.0 -
quote:Originally posted by haroldchrismeyer
I told a guy I know at a gunshop that the reason for high ammo prices is to limit crime. Soon, if you don't have the hundred dollars for a box of ammo, you won't be able to go out and hold up a liquor store.
No, it just forces the robbers to work harder to cover their fixed costs... just like any business [:D]0 -
quote:Originally posted by haroldchrismeyer
I told a guy I know at a gunshop that the reason for high ammo prices is to limit crime. Soon, if you don't have the hundred dollars for a box of ammo, you won't be able to go out and hold up a liquor store.
Why would they pay for it to begin with. Just steal it like everything else.
It will only affect those who are Honest to begin with.0 -
quote:Originally posted by 1776-1976
ammo is a better investment than gold with the constant increases in cost as well as the means to defend your family in uncertain times
It's not about defending your family...
It's about fighting Tyranny.0 -
The shelf life of ammo is probably more than the average shooter will ever need. Even if it is stashed for many years. Any ammo I buy today is likely gonna be OK for the rest of MY life. Tracking supplies and keeping it rotated will also extend the practical life of a shooters supply.
The thing is that unfortunately at some point ammo will most likely be heavily regulated, which will probably the primary driver for cost.. Hopefully we handloaders will be able to get around it to some extent but don't count on it.
There will always be fear mongers. When the rid themselves of one fear the will latch on to the next one. Guns are the current target. We live in a world that won't be happy until there is 0 risk in life.Since that is not possible they will NEVER be happy, but they will keep trying, destroying EVERYONES rights as they go.0 -
Just like anything I love and use if the price goes down (good luck) and it becomes cheaper and more available I will gladly loose my ass on the previous investment and buy some more "ammo in the basement".........My m11 NFA is a $200 gun with a $2700 price tag and a $200 tax, If you legalize manufacture of new ones I will loose my ass on that one and buy three select fire AKs Happily!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 22LR in Idaho went from 9.99 a brick to 16.99 a brick over the last couple years............... 0 -
Gander Mountain ? LOL .. There isnt anything cheap in there except for the help .. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Txs
The prices of all ammunition and it's components have gone through the roof lately and we're told it's due to the rising cost of raw metals.
If this is the case, why haven't .22 LR prices risen an equivalent amount? All other calibers have just about doubled in price, but from what I'm seeing in my area their cost really hasn't gone up at all.
22 ammo is going up...on the wholesale side at least. You are probably seeing some lower prices from large stocks bought at lower prices.0 -
quote:Originally posted by tazzer
I was in wal mart today and wiinchester 9mm 100rd packs went from 15.77 to 18:57 today [V][V][B)]
Less than a year ago these 100 packs were $9.88 so that is about double in a year. Plus, Wally is still selling existing old inventory and when they start selling from new supplies their prices will be much higher.
Look at Midway and compare say CCI Brass in 45 at $23.49 a box!!!!!
As for ammo being a poor investment and having a short shelf life. No offense but that is admitting ignorance and you will be happy to know that is not true.
Even old 1937-38 ammo I have will still fire but it sometimes is delayed (I call it click boom) so I unload it and use the powder and bullet in a boxer case.
If you think 60-70 years life is short, I stand corrected but at 59 the ammo I bought in 2007 will be shooting to spec for many decades after I am dead and buried.
The right to buy it as we can today may not be.
Wulfmann0 -
yeah, I'd agree with the shelf life not being a problem.
from what y'all have said so far, here's a list of the factors that affect the price of ammo.
-price of gas/shipping
-price of metal
-overall surplus or shortage of ammo
-stores selling off previously bought stocks
what will go down? none of those factors. gas won't get cheaper, metal won't get cheaper, existing supplies of ammo won't get replenished anytime soon, and shortly, major sellers won't have the stocks they used to. with all those factors combined, it's got to be certain that ammo will not get cheaper. so it can only get more expensive.
aside from the cost of having a bunch of lead shipped to your house, it has to be a good investment. I don't see how you can lose unless you "have to" sell it before prices go up enough to cover the shipping you paid.
...on the other hand, prices doubling in 1 year was about the best investment around, name a 100% return rate on something else...0 -
In response to bobski I dont see my opinion as being paranoid but instead a realistic threat to our freedom from our "so-called" leaders. America as our founders intended it is being threatened from many directions wether it be a total sell out from our leaders with the north american union, mexico, radical islam, or the elimination of our GOD given rights from a group of politicians who believe the Constitution and Bill of Rights can be interpeted as a few see fit even though they were never granted the power to do so. And for those who think weapons/ammo are not a good investment remember what happened to the the prices when the last ban took effect and then imagine how much higher the prices will rise with another ban. 0
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