lower grain .40 cal ammo "harder" on pistol ?
I have shot .40 cal. ammo of many main brands in my semi-autos and every round in every box of 180 grained works without a single hiccup. But 165 grain ammo is more reasonable now and I've bought a few.
But I've noticed a few boxes of 165 grain have given some of my pistols (Like my Sig P239, Baby Desert Eagle, Taurus and XP subcompacts,etc) problems with about 1 in every 15 rounds fired.
Is it "common" to have stovepipes, FTE, jams, etc. with the lower weight bullet and the faster/hotter powder burn of the 165s as compared to the 180s? Is it smaller framed pistols that don't like the 165s, or what?
Were the four boxes of 165 WWBs that I bought just a bad bunch, or are they typically Harder on operating functions, proper cycling and performing smoothly in .40s cal. pistols in general?
But I've noticed a few boxes of 165 grain have given some of my pistols (Like my Sig P239, Baby Desert Eagle, Taurus and XP subcompacts,etc) problems with about 1 in every 15 rounds fired.
Is it "common" to have stovepipes, FTE, jams, etc. with the lower weight bullet and the faster/hotter powder burn of the 165s as compared to the 180s? Is it smaller framed pistols that don't like the 165s, or what?
Were the four boxes of 165 WWBs that I bought just a bad bunch, or are they typically Harder on operating functions, proper cycling and performing smoothly in .40s cal. pistols in general?
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try a slightly lighter recoil spring, that should fix the problem for you. 0 -
Two questions please:
How do I know what is "lighter" than my stock springs?
Would my pistols still operate as well with 180s after the lighter spring change?
(it seems like I've seen more posts for heavier spring changes, than lighter here??)0 -
Heavy spering for heavy load, light spring for light load. Do a bit of reading on the subject:
http://www.gunsprings.com/SemiAuto/1ndex_menu2NOF.html
It'll also show you what the stock wieght is for each of your guns.0 -
Thanks,
So, I guess the article is saying lighter springs would not work as well with heavier 180 grained bullets if I changed them, huh?
When the article refers to how "individual shooting styles" could affect the issue, could you briefly explain what they mean, please?
That intrigued me.0 -
quote:Originally posted by first_timer
Thanks,
When the article refers to how "individual shooting styles" could affect the issue, could you briefly explain what they mean, please?
That intrigued me.
you may shoot target loads {lighter} as a habit, while another may only shoot self defense loads
if the ejected case is closer than 1 foot when it is ejected before it falls, spring is to heavy for that load, if the case is over 3 feet, the spring is to light0 -
"indidual styles" may refer to the grip you use when firing- that is, do you straight arm the piece with locked elbows, or are you flexing with the recoil? Remember these ARE recoil operated weapons- a severe "limp wrist" stance, and you now have a single shot. 0 -
quote:So, I guess the article is saying lighter springs would not work as well with heavier 180 grained bullets if I changed them, huh?
Going one step lower would not hurt anything when shooting 180's, just put the heavy spring in before shooting any +P.
quote:When the article refers to how "individual shooting styles" could affect the issue, could you briefly explain what they mean, please?
By "individual shooting styles" they are tlking about the way a person shoots his gun. Lets compair a bullseye shooter to a IDPA shooter. In bullseye you are shooting single handed and alowing the gun to free recoil, while in IDPA you are shooting very quickly with both hands controling the recoil to prepair for the next shot. They might both be shooting the same gun but there are different needs placed on each gun, that would be considered a "individual shooting style".0 -
I always shoot with my elbows locked, whether single or double handed.
I find that I personally am more accurate single handed most of the time. And the range I practise at has a "one second rule" between shots, so I haven't had the fun of rapid competitive shooting.
(I've got to visit some other ranges more, that will let me point and shoot...at least double tap)
thank you guys0 -
try a weaver or modified weaver stance instead of isosceles. 0 -
regardless it's all going to come down to the load
i.d.p.a. cover a very wide area of shooting styles, it's not all run, and gun0 -
1911a1fan,
You'll be glad to know that I've "branched out of my .40 cal. mode" a little.
I'm in line for one of the 1st GP6's that STI is putting out soon. A 9mm....Ha!
FINALLY going to get my K100 !!0 -
If anyone offers a diagnosis after only reading that four completely different types of pistols suffer "stovepipes, FTE, jams, etc." they're actually just throwing out a guess. I'll agree that with these malfunctions appearing after increasing bullet weight the recoil spring weight is suspect, but there may very well be other factors.
These pistols you're talking about run the gamut from small framed lightweights to large heavyweights and this can be an important factor to consider when diagnosing malfunctions. Are you experiencing certain types of malfunctions with certain pistols?
When you say FTE, is the brass left in the chamber or ending up blocking the ejection port? Is the slide moving far enough to the rear to begin picking up the next cartridge from the magazine?
Can you define exactly what condition you're experiencing when you say "jams"?0 -
There is a larger powder load in the lighter bullets, so you have to hold the gun with a stronger wrist grip. Changing springs won't help if the problem is limp wristing the gun, and I'll bet it is. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by first_timer
I have shot .40 cal. ammo of many main brands in my semi-autos and every round in every box of 180 grained works without a single hiccup. But 165 grain ammo is more reasonable now and I've bought a few.
But I've noticed a few boxes of 165 grain have given some of my pistols (Like my Sig P239, Baby Desert Eagle, Taurus and XP subcompacts,etc) problems with about 1 in every 15 rounds fired.
Is it "common" to have stovepipes, FTE, jams, etc. with the lower weight bullet and the faster/hotter powder burn of the 165s as compared to the 180s? Is it smaller framed pistols that don't like the 165s, or what?
Were the four boxes of 165 WWBs that I bought just a bad bunch, or are they typically Harder on operating functions, proper cycling and performing smoothly in .40s cal. pistols in general?
Absolutly it is common..I bought not too long ago a walther p22 and shot the good stuff thru it...200 rounds and no jams...took it out a week later and shot the cheap low stuff and it jammed every other round...Did the same in my 40 cal desert eagle as well...0 -
Txs,
The stovepipes were with the Baby Eagle(then stopped when I went back to 180s from the "offending" 165 grain.
The rest of the jams and FTEs were with the others and the empty cartridge was stuck in the ramp not letting the new round load which were jammed up agains them. And a couple times were stuck completely in the chamber, not ejecting at all...had to pry them out carefully by their rims.
Weird.0 -
I think you're worrying about it too much. You have several different guns that don't like the same brand/grain of ammo. I'd say it was the ammo. I'd save the money and not mess with spring changes.
I may be talking completely out my arse but here's my take on things. The guns you mentioned are either compact or subcompact guns. The manufacturers must manufacture them from durability. Follow my line of thinking here [:D] If I'm a gun manufacturer building a compact piece that will probably be used for carry and I want it to be as durable as the standard-size guns which contain more matter for absorbing recoil energy then I'm probably going to put a heavier spring in it. Mismatch the ammo and the spring (heavy ammo with light spring) and you're messing with the way the gun was engineered. It's not a race gun. It's not a competition gun. It was made for ease of carry. The shorter barrels will deliver less velocity and gun manufacturers know that. Heavier bullets will compensate for penetration lost by velocity that was sacrificed for the sake of a shorter barrel. The heavier bullet makes sense for the shorter-barrelled gun since penetration is more dependent on bullet weight than velocity when all other factors are equal.
Keep shooting the heavy bullets. Keep the springs the way they are. Try some different brands of bullets if it's still sticking in your craw. I know the little things sometimes bug the p*ss out of me too.[:D]0 -
Not worrying about it, just interested in why.
Too bad the damned 180s are so much more cost...Ha!
And I just though the Baby Eagle would be more accomidating on what it ate. It just surprised me that's all.
No problem with 180 grains with all of them...I'll just stick with 180s.
thanks
(some of them are still "low mileage" and not truly broken in also...like the Eagle, maybe 200 rounds...the rest more thru them but only maybe 350 or less)0
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