I made a stand today!
I went to a different grocery store today as I was in the area and their ads seem like they have pretty good deals.
Well I park the Bronco and start towards the door to go in and I notice a sign at about knee level that in 1 1/2 inch red letters states:
No Guns
No Weapons
No Loitering
All Violators will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law
I continued into the store and went to the customer service desk and asked for the manager.
I showed the manager my concealed carry permit and informed him that his sign out front was not a legal sign to prevent a person with a concealed carry permit from carrying in his store. And that further more that if they did not want me in their store when I was legally carrying a gun that I would take my money elsewhere and I was sure most permit carriers would do the same and turned to walk out.
He told me that I was fine to carry my gun in their store and that they did not know that their sign did not meet state laws.
I said that I would not shop there until their sign was taken down and left.
I think maybe these people may realize that they may lose business from this now.
Well I park the Bronco and start towards the door to go in and I notice a sign at about knee level that in 1 1/2 inch red letters states:
No Guns
No Weapons
No Loitering
All Violators will be prosecuted to the full extent of the law
I continued into the store and went to the customer service desk and asked for the manager.
I showed the manager my concealed carry permit and informed him that his sign out front was not a legal sign to prevent a person with a concealed carry permit from carrying in his store. And that further more that if they did not want me in their store when I was legally carrying a gun that I would take my money elsewhere and I was sure most permit carriers would do the same and turned to walk out.
He told me that I was fine to carry my gun in their store and that they did not know that their sign did not meet state laws.
I said that I would not shop there until their sign was taken down and left.
I think maybe these people may realize that they may lose business from this now.
0
-
Good for you, we all need to do the same. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Nighthawk
Good for you, we all need to do the same.
What he said.0 -
I wonder if that would work in Wisconsin?[xx(] You done good GRD.[;)]
Jon0 -
I understand your point GRD but what about court houses,government buildings ect?
Does this store owner actually have the right to say he doesn't want people carrying guns in his store.
GB has said several times that we do not have free speech here because it their forum, I stay away from this issue cause I'm not sure I agree just as you disagree the store doesn't have the right to violate your 2nd. So can GB violate our 1st rights and the store owner can't?
I'm not trying to stir the pot just trying to compare apples to apples.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Hunter Mag
I understand your point GRD but what about court houses,government buildings ect?
Does this store owner actually have the right to say he doesn't want people carrying guns in his store.
GB has said several times that we do not have free speech here because it their forum, I stay away from this issue cause I'm not sure I agree just as you disagree the store doesn't have the right to violate your 2nd. So can GB violate our 1st rights and the store owner can't?
I'm not trying to stir the pot just trying to compare apples to apples.
I will not deny that a store owner has the right to not allow guns on his property. After all it is private property and he can make those stipulations if he wishes. It would be the same thing if you did not want something on your private property.
But I also have the right to not shop there and give them my money.
But I personally feel that store owners would want those who are carrying legaly to shop with them. After all the criminals are not going to pay attention to there sign even if it was meeting state laws as far as posting guidelines. And it just might be a legal permit holder that will save some lives in that store if one of the criminal types did come in and start something.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Hunter Mag
I understand your point GRD but what about court houses,government buildings ect?
Does this store owner actually have the right to say he doesn't want people carrying guns in his store.
GB has said several times that we do not have free speech here because it their forum, I stay away from this issue cause I'm not sure I agree just as you disagree the store doesn't have the right to violate your 2nd. So can GB violate our 1st rights and the store owner can't?
I'm not trying to stir the pot just trying to compare apples to apples.
I think you have missed the point. Let's compare apples to apples. Just as GunBroker doesn't deny you any of your First Amendment rights (They just say they don't have to supply the platform for them), GRD just told the man if his gun has to stay out of the store, he and his money will stay out with it. The store owner has his rights, but I don't have to pay for them.0 -
I don't know what the laws are in SC, but I know that in Michigan, the sign has to meet the standards specified in the law, and that sign would not meet the Michigan standards.
If the store wants to refuse my money because I carry a gun, that's fine with me.
In many states, a carry permit trumps a "no guns" sign anyway, so one would be well within his or her 2nd amendment rights to carry.0 -
quote:Originally posted by git_r_done
quote:Originally posted by Hunter Mag
I understand your point GRD but what about court houses,government buildings ect?
Does this store owner actually have the right to say he doesn't want people carrying guns in his store.
GB has said several times that we do not have free speech here because it their forum, I stay away from this issue cause I'm not sure I agree just as you disagree the store doesn't have the right to violate your 2nd. So can GB violate our 1st rights and the store owner can't?
I'm not trying to stir the pot just trying to compare apples to apples.
I will not deny that a store owner has the right to not allow guns on his property. After all it is private property and he can make those stipulations if he wishes. It would be the same thing if you did not want something on your private property.
But I also have the right to not shop there and give them my money.
But I personally feel that store owners would want those who are carrying legaly to shop with them. After all the criminals are not going to pay attention to there sign even if it was meeting state laws as far as posting guidelines. And it just might be a legal permit holder that will save some lives in that store if one of the criminal types did come in and start something.
GRD I commend you for your stance, and understand your point as already mentioned.
Just in case that was over looked. Good job!!0 -
quote:Originally posted by cce1302
I don't know what the laws are in SC, but I know that in Michigan, the sign has to meet the standards specified in the law, and that sign would not meet the Michigan standards.
If the store wants to refuse my money because I carry a gun, that's fine with me.
In many states, a carry permit trumps a "no guns" sign anyway, so one would be well within his or her 2nd amendment rights to carry.
In SC the sign has to be of a certian size and at eye level and along with the words it has to have the gun with the circle slash.
If they ever did try to prosicute someone with the sign that this place has posted it would never hold up.0 -
I just carry concealed, I don't make a spectacle out of it, mind my own business, nobody knows. 2nd Amendment. Signs, Signs, everywhere signs. 0 -
I'm happy to live in a nearly free state. They require a permit to carry, but it is shall-issue, and no classes required. There are very few places one is prohibited from carrying: places posted, the post office, schools, casinos, and courthouses.
I have not yet seen any business posted no weapons.0 -
You should have informed the manager to notify the owner if you get hurt on his property by not being allowed to defend yourself the grocery store could be yours. I did just that to a bank in Columbia. Big sign with a Police officer on duty. I made a cash withdrawal. Teller said I should not carry cash. I ask the Deputy to escort me to the truck where my gun was. I informed them the bank was liable for me while inside or on the premise. Deputy is now gone and so is the sign. 0 -
Sounds to me like you screwed yourself. As the sign is now, you can carry and not worry about it. I guarantee you if you go back in a month a correct sign will be up. Corporate will get a call from the manager this afternoon and have it down there and hung correctly ASAP. Then, if something occurs and you are caught, UH OH! You are breaking the law.
But you know what? They call it "CONCEALED" carry for a reason. Unless there are metal detectors, no one ever need know. And you can't really blame the store owners. Their insurance companies, heck yeah! Liability being what it is today, it is the insurance companies making the rules.0 -
Contained in paragraph 13 of the Mississippi carry permit law:
"the carrying of a concealed pistol or revolver may be disallowed in anyplace in the discretion of the person or entity exercising control over the physical location of such place by the placing of a written notice clearly readable at a distance of not less than ten (10) feet that the "carrying of a pistol or revolver is prohibited."0 -
quote:Originally posted by Jon0322
I wonder if that would work in Wisconsin?[xx(] You done good GRD.[;)]
Jon
Concealed carry is illegal, but open carry is not. Any Wisconsin citizen can walk down any city street in any city in the state with a visible, loaded firearm as long as they're not threatening to use it against anyone or anything.0 -
I am a member of the Texas State Rifle Assn. and through them I have some "calling cards" that have a "no gun (circle around a pistol with a slash through it)" on one side. On the other side are the requirements for a Tx CHL. When I run across a situation like GRD I talk to the store staff , leave one of the cards and if they have any questions, I try to answer them. These cards are available through the TSRA website:www.tsra.org. There may be a requirement for membership to order from them, I don't know. If there is and anyone is intereste, I would be happy to order for you and mail them to you. The come in lots of 500, I think. I have gotten lots of comments about them. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by JamesRK
quote:Originally posted by Hunter Mag
I understand your point GRD but what about court houses,government buildings ect?
Does this store owner actually have the right to say he doesn't want people carrying guns in his store.
GB has said several times that we do not have free speech here because it their forum, I stay away from this issue cause I'm not sure I agree just as you disagree the store doesn't have the right to violate your 2nd. So can GB violate our 1st rights and the store owner can't?
I'm not trying to stir the pot just trying to compare apples to apples.
I think you have missed the point. Let's compare apples to apples. Just as GunBroker doesn't deny you any of your First Amendment rights (They just say they don't have to supply the platform for them), GRD just told the man if his gun has to stay out of the store, he and his money will stay out with it. The store owner has his rights, but I don't have to pay for them.
Tell us sometihng besides the obvious.0 -
seems to me if you go somewhere where you cant carry because the owner wont let you and some criminal comes in and shoots you then the owner of the property would be liable for your safety...that being the case, sue them and if you win, im sure they will change their possition.
even go as far as telling the manager that you have left your gun in your car and your safety is his responsability until you get back to your car!.
i agree with you grd...let them think they are liable and then look at their eyes...im sure they are panicking..0 -
i did the same thing. then I waled out. 0 -
oldnbald,
Here is our card for Colorado.
GRD, you did good. [;)]
0 -
[^] 0 -
From the Virginia State Police website:
Where Unlawful to Carry
?18.2-308 (J.3.): No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in ? 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit.
?18.2-308 (O.): Private property when prohibited by the owner of the property, or where posted as prohibited.
?18.2-283: To a place of worship while a meeting for religious purposes is being held at such place, without good and sufficient reason.
?18.2-283.1: Courthouse.
?18.2-308.1: School property. Exemptions to this statute include a person who has a valid concealed handgun permit and possesses a concealed handgun while in a motor vehicle in a parking lot, traffic circle, or other means of vehicular ingress or egress to the school.
?18.2-287.01: Carrying weapon in air carrier airport terminal.0 -
Here is South Carolina's sign requirements
SECTION 23-31-235. Sign requirements.
(A) Notwithstanding any other provision of this article, any requirement of or allowance for the posting of signs prohibiting the carrying of a concealable weapon upon any premises shall only be satisfied by a sign expressing the prohibition in both written language interdict and universal sign language.
(B) All signs must be posted at each entrance into a building where a concealable weapon permit holder is prohibited from carrying a concealable weapon and must be:
(1) clearly visible from outside the building;
(2) eight inches wide by twelve inches tall in size;
(3) contain the words "NO CONCEALABLE WEAPONS ALLOWED" in black one inch tall uppercase type at the bottom of the sign and centered between the lateral edges of the sign;
(4) contain a black silhouette of a handgun inside a circle seven inches in diameter with a diagonal line that runs from the lower left to the upper right at a forty five degree angle from the horizontal;
(5) a diameter of a circle; and
(6) placed not less than forty inches and not more than sixty inches from the bottom of the building's entrance door.
(C) If the premises where concealable weapons are prohibited does not have doors, then the signs contained in subsection (A) must be:
(1) thirty six inches wide by forty eight inches tall in size;
(2) contain the words "NO CONCEALABLE WEAPONS ALLOWED" in black three inch tall uppercase type at the bottom of the sign and centered between the lateral edges of the sign;
(3) contain a black silhouette of a handgun inside a circle thirty four inches in diameter with a diagonal line that is two inches wide and runs from the lower left to the upper right at a forty five degree angle from the horizontal and must be a diameter of a circle whose circumference is two inches wide;
(4) placed not less than forty inches and not more than ninety six inches above the ground;
(5) posted in sufficient quantities to be clearly visible from any point of entry onto the premises.0 -
quote:Originally posted by dano
Like it or not, in most states, concealed carry laws or not, a business owner can still decide whether or not, he wants guns on his customers.
True, but in South Carolina they must meet the sign requirements or there is nothing that they can do about you haveing your gun unless it is one of the listed off limits places such as government buildings, schools, bars, ect.0 -
Kevin:
Good on you!
What store so I can swing in and tell them the same thing.0 -
quote:Originally posted by A J Christ
Kevin:
Good on you!
What store so I can swing in and tell them the same thing.
Compare foods0 -
I suppose a business owner has the right to discriminate against CCWs if he wants to. But you did the right thing! These people need to understand that they are making their stores UNSAFE, and I do not want my family in there. We is advertising to all the law-breaking whackos out there that they will not be stopped in his store.
Good job!0 -
quote:"the carrying of a concealed pistol or revolver may be disallowed in anyplace in the discretion of the person or entity exercising control over the physical location of such place by the placing of a written notice clearly readable at a distance of not less than ten (10) feet that the "carrying of a pistol or revolver is prohibited."
Can't find Oregons but that is just about it word for word.
A Sportsmans Warehouse here has that sign out front. I stoped going there.0
Please sign in to leave a comment.
Comments
28 comments