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I feel dumb. Electrical.

RUGERGUNZ
I have a background in electrical power, but it is more geared toward large motors, plc, ttl etc. I really only studied house wiring and NEC for a short period.

That said, when I bought my house 3 years ago I spent tons of money on extra outlets. Added almost one to every wall in the house, figured you can never have too many. But I missed adding one in the entry/mudroom. I wanted an outlet for a boot dryer out there, otherwise I carry the boots into the kitchen to dry them.

So I go and get an old work box, 12/2, GFCI outlet and then start looking for a 20 amp breaker.

I hadn't looked over my panel more than seeing if there were open slots.

Basically every manufacturer has a different style of breaker, they aren't really interchangeable. Some brands do interchange but since I couldn't ever remember the brand I couldn't get a breaker. This made me feel like a retard in the store.

So now I have a nice installed GFCI outlet with wire run and just waiting on getting a new breaker. I ended up looking at a breaker and typing in the numbers and ordering 2 new breakers online that match exactly.
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Comments

27 comments

Date Votes
  • Colt Super
    I have lost all of my respect for you.

    What do you need to break ??

    Doug
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  • allen griggs
    Your confession is accepted.
    Say 5 Hail Marys, go forth my son and sin no more.
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  • 1911a1-fan
    try finding a replacement cover, when i bought our current home i found that the previous owner had put a very nice cover over the breaker box when they had the basement refinished, but the rocket scientist who installed it removed the metal cover with the factory door on it, and threw it away, without it the house could not possible pass inspection, i was willing to buy the entire box just to get the door, but the manufacturer went out of business 10 years ago, after 2 weeks of searching i found one that would fit the dimension of the box but had to cut it to match the breakers
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  • matwor
    I have to ask, why did you install a 12.00 receptacle when you coulda installed a .50 one?
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  • tazzer
    quote:Originally posted by Doug Wilson
    I have lost all of my respect for you.

    Doug


    I never had any for him [}:)][}:)][:D][:D][:D]
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  • RUGERGUNZ
    quote:Originally posted by matwor
    I have to ask, why did you install a 12.00 receptacle when you coulda installed a .50 one?


    Mainly for excessive safety. The outlet is for a boot dryer. I have had lots of boot dryers short out in extremely wet boots. I will be leaving wet boots on the dryer and leaving the house. Figured $12 is cheaper than a house. Kinda overkill, I know.
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  • matwor
    Gotcha, BTW, what brand of panel do you have?
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  • RUGERGUNZ
    quote:Originally posted by matwor

    Gotcha, BTW, what brand of panel do you have?


    I have a Cutler-Hammer panel. I have ordered 2 BD20/20 breakers. I plan to use on 20amp circuit for this outlet, which will leave me 3 empty 20A circuits for future upgrades.
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  • bpost
    quote:Originally posted by matwor
    I have to ask, why did you install a 12.00 receptacle when you coulda installed a .50 one?


    GFCI's are always a good idea when water is invloved or nearby.
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  • whiteclouder
    I think I'd have found a nearby box, ceiling or wall, and tapped into an existing circuit. 20Amps for one 110V plug? Now that's OVERKILL.

    Clouder..
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  • RUGERGUNZ
    quote:Originally posted by whiteclouder
    I think I'd have found a nearby box, ceiling or wall, and tapped into an existing circuit. 20Amps for one 110V plug? Now that's OVERKILL.

    Clouder..


    There are none close by that I could have tied into without going across beams. I could have tied into the circuit at the breaker but don't really know how many outlets each circuit supplies. The outlet I added is directly below the panel, needed about 4 ft of cable, so it was easier adding a new circuit.
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  • allen griggs
    The 20 amp dedicated breaker for the boot dryer is a good idea. Those electric heaters can draw a lot of juice.
    How many amps does the boot dryer draw?
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  • daveald
    20amp breaker on an electrical dryer isn't overkill this thing will prob. draw 10-15 amps on a continual basis while in use and up to 5 times that on start up. sounds completely reasonable to me.
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  • 1911a1-fan
    quote:Originally posted by RUGERGUNZ
    quote:Originally posted by matwor
    I have to ask, why did you install a 12.00 receptacle when you coulda installed a .50 one?


    Mainly for excessive safety. The outlet is for a boot dryer. I have had lots of boot dryers short out in extremely wet boots. I will be leaving wet boots on the dryer and leaving the house. Figured $12 is cheaper than a house. Kinda overkill, I know.


    +1 gfi's are the way to go, if i had the cash i would replace every outlet, and breaker with them, i have them in the kitchen, bathroom, and all the outlets outside
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  • Flyin_Paulie
    I may be wrong, but thought a GFI outlet has it's own breaker. Cant you just wire it into an existing circuit and the GFI outlet will trip if excessive amperage is encountered?[?][:p]
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  • Captplaid
    quote:Originally posted by RUGERGUNZ
    quote:Originally posted by matwor

    Gotcha, BTW, what brand of panel do you have?


    I have a Cutler-Hammer panel. I have ordered 2 BD20/20 breakers. I plan to use on 20amp circuit for this outlet, which will leave me 3 empty 20A circuits for future upgrades.


    [xx(] I didn,t think of requesting a brand when we built our house. Electrician used a Cutler-Hammer panel. Had to do a little looking to find more breakers.
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  • matwor
    A coupla facts about GFCI's, Ground Fault Circuit Interupter.

    1) You cannot put a GFCI outlet downstream of a GFCI breaker, or another GFCI outlet.

    The circuit you plan on protecting by GFCI can be done by either the breaker or the receptacle. The receptacle is the cheaper way. And remember you can put additional plugs downstream of the GFCI receptacle itself should you choose to do so. These will also be protected.

    2) A GFCI does not trip when it encounters excessive amperage. They constantly monitor the difference between the current entering the circuit on the "hot" wire, and the current leaving the circuit on the neutral wire. They can recognize a difference as little as .005 amps and can shut the circuit down in as little as .025 seconds. Due to this low tolerance they are very touchy, and in my opinion should only be placed in areas required by code.

    1911a1fan, all the places you mentioned having them, are required by code.

    One tip, for those of you that have a freezer/fridge in their garage or basement. Make sure that it is not plugged into a GFCI circuit. First, it doesn't have to be, by code, and second of all one nuisance trip of the GFCI while you are gone for the weekend and your deer/elk/moose/bass/crappie meat or, deer-head-waiting-to-get-mounted is ruined.
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  • Rosie
    YOU feel dumb. I'll trade you my sore finger for your dumb feeling.
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  • whiteclouder
    quote:Originally posted by RUGERGUNZ
    quote:Originally posted by whiteclouder
    I think I'd have found a nearby box, ceiling or wall, and tapped into an existing circuit. 20Amps for one 110V plug? Now that's OVERKILL.

    Clouder..


    There are none close by that I could have tied into without going across beams. I could have tied into the circuit at the breaker but don't really know how many outlets each circuit supplies. The outlet I added is directly below the panel, needed about 4 ft of cable, so it was easier adding a new circuit.


    Gotcha. Sounds like you have breaker slots to spare anyhow so take the eay way.

    Clouder..
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  • 11b6r
    Paulie- as the man said- a GFCI is NOT an overcurrent protection device (circuit breaker) in a nutshell, it measures current going out on the hot, and current returning on the neutral. As long as they are the same, fine. But if you were to drop your hair dryer or drill into the sink full of water, current leaks, two wires are not same, GFCI trips. Breakers protect property, GFCIs protect people- and now there is the arc detection breaker.....
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  • allen griggs
    "I may be wrong, but thought a GFI outlet has it's own breaker. Cant you just wire it into an existing circuit and the GFI outlet will trip if excessive amperage is encountered"

    Yes.
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  • 1911a1-fan
    quote:Originally posted by allen griggs
    "I may be wrong, but thought a GFI outlet has it's own breaker. Cant you just wire it into an existing circuit and the GFI outlet will trip if excessive amperage is encountered"

    Yes.


    yes, but you can also replace them in you breaker box, and the entire line will be protected, this is helpful if you did not build the house, or just to not know where the first outlet on a line is located


    thanks matwar yes i knew that
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  • WinM70
    Lowe's carry's Cutler-Hammer curcuit breakers, boxes, and supplies.
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  • Alpine
    You can put GFIs or non GFIs downstream of an GFI outlet. Most GFIs have a a terminal for making all downstream outlets GFI protected.

    In a house, the rule of thumb is 10 to 12 outlets per breaker. The exception to this is where (as in a dishwasher or microwave) a higher ampere appliance is going to be installed.
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  • allen griggs
    I worked for a company in Atlanta that did remodeling etc.
    We were working on a $400,000 house in Alpharetta.
    Our two guys were using the pressure washer on the exterior siding.
    The lady said that she couldn't use her hair dryer.
    Well, her bathroom was on the second floor and we were working outside, on the first floor.
    So I got my circuit tester and started doing some Sherlock Holmes stuff.
    In an hour, I had discovered that she had 8 receptacles that by code must be governed by a GFI.
    I found that they had run all of them from a single GFI, which was in the upstairs bathroom. This was a 15 amp GFI and they used 14 gauge wire.
    From that GFI in the second floor bathroom, they had run Romex all over that house to run that one circuit, and to avoid buying a second GFI for ten bucks. That circuit covered a second outlet in that bathroom, and two outlets in the downstairs bathroom, and one outlet in the carport, and one outlet in the basement, and one outlet at the back porch, right above the ground, and the eighth outlet was near the front door. This outlet was in a brick wall right near where our guys were using the pressure washer.
    This outlet was not well sealed against the weather, and water got in there and shorted out the circuit.
    The lady told me that, sometimes when it rained hard, she couldn't use her hair dryer.
    I just removed that wet receptacle, taped up the ends of the wires and kept them well apart, and put a cover plate on it. This way, if water got in it still couldn't short out the circuit.
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  • GUNFUNCO
    OVERKILL!

    Me, I would have bought an extension cord.[:D]
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  • matwor
    quote:Originally posted by Alpine
    You canCANNOT put GFIs or non GFIs downstream of an GFI outlet, one or the other will trip. MostALL GFIs have a a terminal for making all downstream outlets GFI protected.



    Strikes and red verbage added by myself.
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