My odd view on shipping policies
I may be in the minority among the sellers here on my view of shipping...
Let me preface this by saying I got on my podium today when a pair of high end Colt collectors stopped in to ask if we would ship a box for them using our FFL(To save big bucks that is), sometimes we do this for people sometimes we won't depending on the circumstances of whether we want to be involved in it or not, sometimes there are is a big mess involved and we just don't want to be involved in something a person can legally do themselves. The only reason people ask an FFL to ship a gun for them is to save themselves money, end of story.
Anyway, these two gentleman had a giant Walmart box very poorly packaged with a Colt Grizzly and a Colt Kodiak in a presentation case along with the boxes, so a rather High dollar sale for the guy. Of course I'm assuming they tried pricing out a next day air of that size box and I'm sure it was crazy expensive so they came to us for help. Well, they offered to compensate us for our time in helping them so we agreed to send it off to the receiving FFL, I said sure, how much insurance do you want to put on it. They told me none, the guy didn't pay any extra for insurance
OK, I'll stop with todays story and get to the point.
When we sell an item, I believe it IS OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO GET THE ITEM TO THE CUSTOMER IN THE SAME CONDITION IT LEFT IN, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER WE COLLECTED EXTRA SHIPPING FEES TO COVER INSURANCE. When we sell an item online we list it with a flat fee that includes insurance, usually $35 but sometimes more if we anticipate a higher value. I would never sell two $4000 guns in a presentation case and not account for insurance in the shipping cost because we believe we have to get it there or else we owe a refund.
Likewise, when I buy and item on here I expect it to be delivered, PERIOD. If it gets lost or damaged along the way I expect a refund.
Can you imagine buying ANYTHING from somewhere like AMAZON, and the item doesn't make it, I bet they don't say "well, you didn't pay for insurance."
Since I sell alot more on here than I buy, I guess that would make me a seller on here and that would probably make my opinion unpopular among alot of sellers.
I look forward to hearing your comments, I know we have hashed shipping topics many times on here but I don't think this viewpoint has been brought up before.
What do you think, do you agree with me that the seller should be responsible for delivery regardless of if they choose to not put insurance on it?
Let me preface this by saying I got on my podium today when a pair of high end Colt collectors stopped in to ask if we would ship a box for them using our FFL(To save big bucks that is), sometimes we do this for people sometimes we won't depending on the circumstances of whether we want to be involved in it or not, sometimes there are is a big mess involved and we just don't want to be involved in something a person can legally do themselves. The only reason people ask an FFL to ship a gun for them is to save themselves money, end of story.
Anyway, these two gentleman had a giant Walmart box very poorly packaged with a Colt Grizzly and a Colt Kodiak in a presentation case along with the boxes, so a rather High dollar sale for the guy. Of course I'm assuming they tried pricing out a next day air of that size box and I'm sure it was crazy expensive so they came to us for help. Well, they offered to compensate us for our time in helping them so we agreed to send it off to the receiving FFL, I said sure, how much insurance do you want to put on it. They told me none, the guy didn't pay any extra for insurance
OK, I'll stop with todays story and get to the point.When we sell an item, I believe it IS OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO GET THE ITEM TO THE CUSTOMER IN THE SAME CONDITION IT LEFT IN, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER WE COLLECTED EXTRA SHIPPING FEES TO COVER INSURANCE. When we sell an item online we list it with a flat fee that includes insurance, usually $35 but sometimes more if we anticipate a higher value. I would never sell two $4000 guns in a presentation case and not account for insurance in the shipping cost because we believe we have to get it there or else we owe a refund.
Likewise, when I buy and item on here I expect it to be delivered, PERIOD. If it gets lost or damaged along the way I expect a refund.
Can you imagine buying ANYTHING from somewhere like AMAZON, and the item doesn't make it, I bet they don't say "well, you didn't pay for insurance."
Since I sell alot more on here than I buy, I guess that would make me a seller on here and that would probably make my opinion unpopular among alot of sellers.
I look forward to hearing your comments, I know we have hashed shipping topics many times on here but I don't think this viewpoint has been brought up before.
What do you think, do you agree with me that the seller should be responsible for delivery regardless of if they choose to not put insurance on it?
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shootuadeal wrote:What do you think, do you agree with me that the seller should be responsible for delivery regardless of if they choose to not put insurance on it?
Yes I do. In addition to that, I think the seller should insure it, and the buyer pay for it. The two items I have sold on GB were insured, and the buyer didn't have the option to cop out. In my auction I stated "Insured shipping will be $XX.xx to 48 states"0 -
It is nice, but I have bought from dealers who made insurance and extra cost add on to the stated shipping cost. Guys like these are low balling cheapskates. I would have declined to ship for them under those circumstances. 0 -
No way I'd ship without insurance. I've had stuff delivered to me that looked like it had been air dropped without a parachute. Even had a Winchester Super Grade arrive with the stock broken at the wrist. The shipper had packed it really well, but somewhere along the line some rough handling caused the damage. Insurance took care of it. 0 -
maybe just me but I thought the seller and shipper were responsible for th eitem shipped untill it get to th enew owner . I would guess a court would lean the same way ?
flip side if I had no choice and bought a high dollar item and had no other option to make sure it was covered if lost or damaged I would pay the insurance to avoid any problems and head aces0 -
and if the cheapo sellers did have a lost or damaged shipment with OUT insurance you can bet your AZZ they would be screaming blame on someone other than themselves 0 -
I have sold a lot on Ebbbby, a little here, and a little on that other gun auction site. {yes there is another place! :shock: }
Selling unreplaceable antiques on Ebbbbayy, I always listed I will insure and the buyer pays for the insurance. I insured for the assessed value if it was higher than the sale price, sometimes the buyers got a steal on items.
Had only one bad mishap, A 250 year old craved ivory lady's broach never made it to the buyer. Sale price was about $410. Insured for $500.
Had hassles with USPO about "over insuring for fraud reasons", they lost that argument.
My listings always said "shipping and handling"
Then USPO claimed I couldn't sell ivory, so they didn't need to pay. More BS. Had proof of it's age and provenance.
They paid up.
Then ,now get this..... the box shows up at the buyer's store after 6 months!!!0 -
I agree 100%. When I sell here, I offer professional packing, shipping, and insurance to anywhere in the continental US for a flat fee.
Want to come pick it up? sure. Follow all laws and no charge for shipping.
I sold a nice shotgun to a forum member and offered free shipping. I STILL insured it at my expense. It is my responsibility to deliver the product in the condition it was in when sold.
I've bought some fairly expensive items and offered additional money so it's packed correctly and safely and gets to me undamaged.
I'd rather spend the extra $10-$25.00 prior to shipping then try to deal with a claim for a damaged or destroyed item.
Seems simple enough any way!0 -
I get so tired of people sending messages telling me how much a flat rate box costs to ship. Its like they've decided they are experts in everything regarding shipping because they know what that one fee is.
We buy rolls of thick paper by the pallet load several times a year and I could buy a small car for what we have to pay for the long gun boxes we order once a year. I insure everything we ship for as much as we can for the listed shipping cost and we pack it well enough that they have to do something pretty significant to damage what we've packed.....like this one.....which was most likely dropped from a 3 story window onto concrete....https://www.gunbroker.com/item/811579636
I put a larger shipping fee on things that we think will need insurance, are heavy or will not fit in a flat rate box......people rarely want to pay that themselves if given the option.
Everyone thinks they are paying "more than what Amazon charges" for shipping....but they don't realize that Amazon has built in increases to cover everything. I checked on getting my makeup from Amazon the other day. Its $35 at the department store....Amazon has it for $42 with "free shipping". People are idiots who don't realize what is going on.0 -
LF .like this one.....which was most likely dropped from a 3 story window onto concrete....https://www.gunbroker.com/item/811579636
Did you get an insurance pay off for that?
That would take some severe trauma to do that.0 -
I don't know what the laws are these days, but it used to be that unless both parties agree otherwise, the seller was responsible for the product to acceptance of the shipment by the buyer. I know that if I pay for something, unless shipping insurance is mandatory, I will decline it and expect to receive the product in good shape. If not, then I reach out to the seller for refund/replacement. If the seller tries to give me the runaround, then I reach out to my credit card company and cancel the charges. Hence the reason I always use a credit card to purchase things.
Also, when insurance is obtained on a shipment, if anything goes wrong, the seller is reimbursed, not the buyer. So, if a seller wants the shipment insured, either make it mandatory and include it in the cost of shipping upfront, or be prepared to cover it out of your own pocket.0 -
Shipping is just complicated most times. If it's an expensive item like a firearm or something I think it's a no-brainer to insure it. Then, who is responsible for doing that? I would say the shipper is. It is when the item is less expensive that it is less clear.
Shipping First Class for example. That doesn't come with any insurance unless you pay for it. And then paying for insurance on an inexpensive item is just usually not worth it. I mail a lot of Raptor charging handles. Weight-wise they easily can ship First Class mail, so that is how I ship them. But that comes with no insurance, so if the Post Office loses that item you are out the entire cost of it. Barrels on the hand go over 1 lb and so have to go Priority Mail. That comes with $99 insurance so I am covered to that amount in case they lose it. Edit for examples.0 -
Sam06 wrote:LF.like this one.....which was most likely dropped from a 3 story window onto concrete....https://www.gunbroker.com/item/811579636
Did you get an insurance pay off for that?
That would take some severe trauma to do that.
Yes, they paid $800 for the damage done to the gun and FINALLY gave the gun back to me.....for a minute there we were arguing back and forth about "who keeps the gun" but they finally saw things correctly and sent it on back to me.0 -
A few years back i sold a pretty expensive shotgun on here. I priced shipping & Insuranance at $60. I was probably $150 into the packaging, shipping & insurance.
I didnt ask the seller for 10 cents more than they had already coughed up.0 -
One time I received a five figure valued revolver loose in a flat rate box.
Not even a piece of tissue in there with it.
I can't even remember if I was charged for insurance.
It survived, but come on.0 -
Locust Fork wrote:Sam06 wrote:LF.like this one.....which was most likely dropped from a 3 story window onto concrete....https://www.gunbroker.com/item/811579636
Did you get an insurance pay off for that?
That would take some severe trauma to do that.
Yes, they paid $800 for the damage done to the gun and FINALLY gave the gun back to me.....for a minute there we were arguing back and forth about "who keeps the gun" but they finally saw things correctly and sent it on back to me.
That's friggin awesome, good job. Bet you are breathing easier now.0 -
As a buyer, if I send you my money, I expect to receive what I paid you for.
Apparently, Gunbroker feels the same way. This is a C&P from the Buyer's section of the auction side:
The seller is responsible for making sure an item is delivered to a buyer. If the item is lost or damaged in shipping, the seller is responsible for refunding the buyer?s payment, whether or not the item was insured. We strongly recommend sellers insure all packages with the carrier.0 -
If you charge actual shipping costs and do a good job of packaging and securing and insuring the gun so it arrives on time and intact and free from defect or damage you will get called a their and accused of jacking up the shipping charges to pad your profit margin - people are thrifty and stingy and done comprehend how much shipping costs especially for a hand gun...
If you do the bare minimum to get it there and don't insure it or use hastily applied recycled packaging you will be called lazy and stupid and careless...
You can't win the argument so clearly state your policy in the auction and communicate with the buyer - be professional and to hell with the haters and the blindly stupid.
Mike0
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