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Russian 7.62x54

arkbacks
I keep seeing these Russian Mosin-Nagant M-44 rifles dirt cheap.
Are they cheap quality or just a gajillion of them around?
The ammo is inexpensive also and widely available. I don't know anyone who has one or experience with one.

Are these rifles any good for general plinking and occaisional target practice? or are they basically wall hangers?

Thanks
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Comments

8 comments

Date Votes
  • arkbacks
    I have scoped my Russian 7.62x54 rifle, my question is this Does it have the range and velocity to be used to hunt in the mountains of Colorado. I really don't have the money to get another rifle. Thanks
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  • llama
    The 7.62x54r has ballistics inbetween the 30-06 and 308 win.. Should do fine.
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  • tsr1965
    While it has the power, to get to the same ranges as a 308 Winchester, and 30-06(in all actuality, the 308 Winchester, and the 30-06 are ballistic twins, with most bullet weights), the question should be what is the effective range of the rifle/scope/ammo/shooter combination? What is the effective range you can consistantly keep your shots in a target the size of the vital zones of the animal's you are hunting?

    You should actually shoot the rifle, on paper, at the ranges you expect to shoot game at.

    Best

    EDIT 1

    Nice picture Beantown. Is that your Nagant? I have always wondered how one set up like a scout rifle would perform. Nice Trailside too...and of course the SBH.

    Best
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  • rufe-snow
    You can only work that out for your self. Take it out to 300 yds. If you can consistently keep 2 shots on a 10" paper plate, from a cold fouled rifle from that distance, your good to go. If you can't, it's probably you rather then the rifle.
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  • beantownshootah
    quote:Originally posted by arkbacks
    I have scoped my Russian 7.62x54 rifle, my question is this Does it have the range and velocity to be used to hunt in the mountains of Colorado. I really don't have the money to get another rifle. Thanks


    The 7.62x54R has been called "the Russian .30'06", because the ballistics are substantially similar to that old American standby.

    As mentioned, with standard military loads the 7.62x54R is right in between the .308 and .30-06, and my understanding is that it can actually do a little better than .30-06 if tweaked correctly with the right loads. But even if it can't, in terms of pure ballistics, the round is powerful enough to put down any game in North America, including goats, sheep, yetis, or whatever lives in the Colorado mountains.

    As food for though, the Russians and Finns use this round to hunt Polar bear, which at up to 1500 lbs are both dangerous and the biggest carnivore in the world. Not saying its the best choice for that, but as always, its a function mostly of the skill and experience of the hunter, not the round.

    If you want to use this for hunting, consider a few important caveats:

    First of all, typical military surplus 7.62x54R ball ammo really isn't suitable for hunting large game. Yes, if that's all you had, and it were a "survival" situation, then so be it, but good hunting type soft-point ammo is readily available (from Winchester, Norma, and maybe a few others), and that's really what you "should" be using. There is steel case Russian "bear" type hunting ammo available at very reasonable prices, though I can't speak to how accurate it is. The Norma ammo is supposedly excellent, but its going to be pricey.

    Next, speaking from experience, the 19th century design Mosin Nagant isn't exactly the most comfortable or ergonomic rifle, especially for bigger-than-average sized Americans. If you haven't swapped out the stock for a more modern one, you might consider a buttpad to extend the length of pull a bit, and maybe a cheekrest to raise your line of sight to scope height. Here's mine with aftermarket buttpad, SK "Scout" scope, 2x Leupold pistol scope, and cheap shellholder with foam underneath as a cheekrest:

    DSCN0626.jpg?t=1318132931


    Lastly, and most important, lots of the Moisin-nagant rifles have, to put it charitably, "poor" bores, from hard military use with corrosive ammo and subsequent neglect. Before you actually try and take one of these guns out in the field to shoot at live game, it behooves you to test it thoroughly for accuracy with your chosen ammo.

    While some of these guns actually can deliver excellent accuracy, especially with a little "tweaking" of the trigger and free-floating the barrel, that's highly gun dependent, and you have to make sure your particular gun can deliver the goods when it comes down to it.

    Using Rufe's standard of 12 inch groups at 300 yards, I can tell you that at least some of these guns can't do it. Again, its not just the shooter, its also a function of a long gritty trigger, bad bores and crown, and less than stellar ammunition.

    Edit, to answer question above:
    quote:Nice picture Beantown. Is that your Nagant? I have always wondered how one set up like a scout rifle would perform. Nice Trailside too...and of course the SBH.
    Its one of my Moisins, yeah. [;)]. Its actually a M44 with the bayonet removed. One of these days I'm going to actually hunt with it, but haven't gotten around to it yet.

    How does it perform? As you can imagine, it kicks like a mule, makes a pretty impressive muzzle flash, and the trigger is crap (maybe 9-10 lbs and creeeeeeepy!). Even though the barrel is virtually pristine, I can only get about 4-5 inch 100 yard groups with the cheap surplus ammo. I bet I could cut that instantly in half with a decent trigger job and good ammo, and probably even more if I were to free float the barrel. But as it is, its perfectly fine as a "blaster" on the range. It definitely turns heads, that's for sure!

    The scope mount is an S&K, and at $75 the MOUNT ALONE cost nearly as much as the entire rifle! But its the best one out there, and I didn't want problems. The cheap $20 aluminum mounts are pretty flimsy, and I don't trust them to hold a zero under the pounding of this gun.

    Note that I put a 2x scope on there, so there is barely any magnification at all. I just did this because I didn't really care for the iron sights. But for its intended purpose of a 150 yard or less gun that will thump the heck out of anything, its perfect.

    More pix: 7.62x54 Bulgarian milsurp round after passing though the equivalent of 4 Manhattan telephone books. Those steel core rounds technically aren't "armor piercing" but BOY do they penetrate!

    DSCN0650.jpg
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  • jonk
    It really all depends. 10" at 300 yards is a decent measurement; this translates to about 3.3MOA. Any Mosin with a decent bore firing decent ammo should manage this with no issue.

    How far are you planning on shooting?

    Power wise the cartridge is fine.

    Finally I'd suggest relieving all pressure on the barrel by lightly routing out the channel and free floating it or using only one pressure point near the front band/muzzle.

    How did you scope it? With a good drill and tap mount and quality scope? If so I'd say you're fine.
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  • machine gun moran
    I've found that Mosins can shoot well with the wood either tight (but uniform) all the way to the muzzle, or with the barrel floated except for a slight pressure point at the bottom of the front. Be careful about the handguard, that when clamped it applies pressure only to the fore stock, with no pressure on the barrel.

    The Russian commercial ammunition may be of 'iffy' quality. I had one Barnaul 204-grain softpoint load that had a separation of the center of the case web. This is the part that carries the anvil and the flash holes. It broke away and backed into the primer, and that circular section of the web, and the primer, fell out when I opened the bolt. The case had a hole of primer diameter straight through the rear.

    Infantry-grade 91/30's have good capability for accuracy, if the bedding and bores are decent. I have 3 pre-war rifles and one '43, which will all shoot inside 2 MOA with military ball. I've had two ex-snipers, which were still new, that did better. I initially fire Mosins at 25 yards to determine sight regulation, and with one, I thought I had missed the target completely. But all five shots were in one hole, in the little black diamond in the middle of the 2" target, and the diamond obscured their presence.
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  • demo-dan
    For what it's worth, a 303 british (.311), with a 215 grain bullet probably killed more african game than any other cartridge. I have one that is dynamite on wisconsin whitetais. I use it for a woods gun but you may have inspired me to scope it. The 7.62x54 is more efficient than the british and like some say runs side by side with the 30-06. There is a series on tv where a guy is using a 30-30 to go after everything on the continent and he is doing better than most guys can with their $$$$$ set ups. Good luck with your gun. Accuracy as well as knowing how your gun is shooting is the most important part of mountains and their up and downhill grades.
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