Shipping to and FFL in Colorado from Illinois
I have a question regarding the shipping of a rifle I sold to a buyer in Colorado. I have sold and shipped previous guns to Colorado, so I am not sure how or why I am getting this response.
I do not have an FFL and I sent the rifle to the FFL the buyer requested, just as I have in the past. The FFL emailed me and said I had forgotten to include some important paperwork. I asked him what he meant and he replied,
"I am required by the Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco Firearms and Explosives to keep a complete Acquisition and Disposition log of all firearms that pass through my business, which includes the business or individual where it came from. Upon enactment of the Brady laws, which require background checks for firearms transactions at retail locations, several trafficking laws were also added as provisions in an attempt to provide better tracing capabilities for the tracking of firearms. This requires firearms that are shipped across state borders to provide the appropriate transfer of ownership through a licensed dealer, which includes identifying information of the business or individual that originally possessed the weapon. For a business, this means a copy of their FFL, for an individual, this means either a copy of a drivers license or state id, or a copy of their passport.
You may reference 18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 for the proper legalese, or by calling the National Tracing Center of the BATFE at (800) 788-7133."
My question is I have never included a copy of my own driver's license when I shipped an auction item. This dealer says I should, but none of the other dealers I have shipped to have asked or requested this info. What do I need to legally do to be in compliance? Do I need to send my license when I ship an item or is this dealer being excessive?
Thanks for any help in clarifying.
Sent from my iPad
I do not have an FFL and I sent the rifle to the FFL the buyer requested, just as I have in the past. The FFL emailed me and said I had forgotten to include some important paperwork. I asked him what he meant and he replied,
"I am required by the Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco Firearms and Explosives to keep a complete Acquisition and Disposition log of all firearms that pass through my business, which includes the business or individual where it came from. Upon enactment of the Brady laws, which require background checks for firearms transactions at retail locations, several trafficking laws were also added as provisions in an attempt to provide better tracing capabilities for the tracking of firearms. This requires firearms that are shipped across state borders to provide the appropriate transfer of ownership through a licensed dealer, which includes identifying information of the business or individual that originally possessed the weapon. For a business, this means a copy of their FFL, for an individual, this means either a copy of a drivers license or state id, or a copy of their passport.
You may reference 18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 for the proper legalese, or by calling the National Tracing Center of the BATFE at (800) 788-7133."
My question is I have never included a copy of my own driver's license when I shipped an auction item. This dealer says I should, but none of the other dealers I have shipped to have asked or requested this info. What do I need to legally do to be in compliance? Do I need to send my license when I ship an item or is this dealer being excessive?
Thanks for any help in clarifying.
Sent from my iPad
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The receiving FFL is required to log the gun into his "bound book", showing who it came from. Standard practice is to pack a copy of your DL with the gun if it comes directly from you to the FFL. If you had it shipped BY a FFL to a FFL, he would log it in as coming from FFL so and so.
ATF does not say he must have a driver's license in their regs, but in their notes on practices, it does describe "ordinary business records", such as a driver's license.0 -
Look at it from the point of view of the receiving FFL. At some time in the future he will be grilled by a man in a black suit during a periodic FFL inspection of his records:
"Where did you get that rifle?"
"I got that from John Smith, in Illinois."
"Oh really? Why did you think that was his name and address? Did he offer any form of ID to back that up?" [xx(]
Might as well do the FFL a good deed, make his life a bit less stressful, and send him a copy of some form of recognized government ID. For most of us, that is a driver's license.[:)]0 -
Whats the big deal about providing the receiving FFL dealer a copy of your drivers license?? If you walked into a local gunshop or pawnshop to sell a gun, they are going to ask you for identification! 0 -
The only place where this dealer is misinformed is his allegation that he is required to get information on prior owners of guns shipped to him by another FFL. There is not now, nor has there ever been, such a requirement.
But, the guys are right: You should send him a copy of your DL.
And, like the rest of us non-FFL's who occasionally sell guns on GB, you should state in your auction listings: "Be sure that your FFL is willing to accept shipment from a non-licensee. I will include a photocopy of my drivers license with the gun."
Neal
EDIT: Many dealers will not accept a firearm shipped by a nonlicensee, even WITH ID.0 -
Thanks for the info. As I said, I don't have a problem sending the info but since no other dealer I have dealt with in the past had requested the info, I wanted some clarification. 0 -
If the Colorado FFL knew the Illinois gun laws, he could asked for the copy of the FOID card also,required by all Illinois gun owners to OWN the firearm and purchase ammo. 0 -
My local FFL always asks me to make sure he gets a copy of any non FFL shipping a gun to him. Has never been an issue. 0 -
I would send a copy of my Illinois FOID also. 0
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