Ammo Recommendation
I have been told to stay away from Russian and Eastern European 5.56mm ammo because of caustic primers and bad powder by several people. I have some Brown Bear brand and have not shot it because of my concerns. Is there any brand of 5.56mm ammo from that part of the world that is reliable and won't ruin weapons?
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all ammo - even perfect match grade stuff from Lake City - will eventually trash a weapon if you shoot enough of it.
There was a test published recently, and hardware problems cropped up around the 6000 round mark for steel cased 5.56, and 10k rounds for brass cased american ammo.
Only real issue will be the laquered cases - shoot a lot, and stop, and a hot case in your chamber could melt the laquer a little and when it cools it will be stuck like glue.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/brass-vs-steel-cased-ammo/
HTH0 -
quote:Originally posted by llama
all ammo - even perfect match grade stuff from Lake City - will eventually trash a weapon if you shoot enough of it.
There was a test published recently, and hardware problems cropped up around the 6000 round mark for steel cased 5.56, and 10k rounds for brass cased american ammo.
Only real issue will be the laquered cases - shoot a lot, and stop, and a hot case in your chamber could melt the laquer a little and when it cools it will be stuck like glue.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/brass-vs-steel-cased-ammo/
HTH0 -
Thanks for the reply. Was not aware of the stark difference in steel and brass. Steel did not seem to be a good idea for casing so I just don't use them. With frequent cleaning can I use the Russian ammo without it eating a hole in my chamber--assuming its not lacquered?
Originally posted by llama
all ammo - even perfect match grade stuff from Lake City - will eventually trash a weapon if you shoot enough of it.
There was a test published recently, and hardware problems cropped up around the 6000 round mark for steel cased 5.56, and 10k rounds for brass cased american ammo.
Only real issue will be the laquered cases - shoot a lot, and stop, and a hot case in your chamber could melt the laquer a little and when it cools it will be stuck like glue.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/brass-vs-steel-cased-ammo/
HTH
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I shoot the hell out of that stuff in my ARs and M16s
Tula is the only brand I have had trouble with- some is underpowered
I save enough to buy more barrels every year
But I still prefer my reloads0 -
You'll be fine shooting the brown bear stuff for plinking about. I would not use it for hunting, nor for defense (unless it was all I had.) this is merely my personal preference, I have other loads that I use for these tasks. 0 -
"can I use the Russian ammo without it eating a hole in my chamber'
Steel case ammo will not "Eat a hole in my chamber". As stated, the lacquer coated cases may stick if left chambered in a very hot barrel. The primers of current commercial production are not corrosive(none are "caustic" that I know of) but the European ammo I've used does leave quite a bit more powder residue in the bore than does domestic ammo. Many millions of rounds of steel cased ammo have been produced by European countries since it's cheaper and/or easier to produce than using brass. Their goal is quantity and lower cost over quality.0 -
One more time: the lacquer coating does not melt in the chamber.
Because of the difference between the elastic coefficient of the mild steel in the Russian case and the brass of a typical US case, there is more powder fouling the the chamber from the steel cased ammo. If you shoot steel cased ammo then shoot brased cased ammo, there is a possibility the brass casing will stick due to the powder fouling. Keep your chamber clean, and you'll be fine.
The lacquer coating is to protect the steel from oxidation. It does not melt.0 -
Most important thing is that this was a well done study done with more than sufficient ammunition so we can make some accurate assumptions about the ammo's performance. I really hate the articles that draw strong conclusions on five or six five round strings. 0 -
Responding to a number of misconceptions from above:
-The "Wolf" and other current-manufacture Russian steel case ammo DOES NOT use corrosive primers.
-The steel used in these steel case ammo is MILD (ie SOFT) steel. By itself is does NOT increase chamber wear over brass case ammo. Any slight increase in chamber wear is likely to due to with poorer chamber sealing (see below). But even running ONLY steel case ammo, guns will still run for tens of thousands of rounds, if otherwise maintained properly.
-I've fired thousands of rounds of this stuff and never had an issue with bad powder. No, its not "match quality" by any stretch, but at least some of the 7.62x39 is manufactured in Russia to military spec, and its perfectly fine ammo for plinking or practice. I wouldn't use it for "serious" work in an AR-15 if I had brass ammo handy instead, BUT in today's environment, you use whatever you can get. For a Russian/Commie bloc gun DESIGNED to run steel case ammo (eg AK pattern guns, SKS carbines, Mosin Nagants)that's *ALL* I run through these.
-Steel case ammo is hardly new, its been used for over 100 years. The US military issued steel case ammo during WWII in response to copper/brass shortages during wartime.
As mentioned, the big issue with the steel case ammo is NOT lacquer/polymer cases. Its that steel doesn't expand as much as brass on firing, creating a poorer case/chamber seal where hot gas and powder can lead around the cartridge neck increasing chamber fouling. After firing, steel cases then don't contract as much as brass, increasing resistant during extraction. Bottom line, steel case ammo tends to run "stickier" than brass.
Its for these reasons that The Russian calibers DESIGNED to use steel case ammo tend to have cone shaped cases (eg 7.62x54R Mosin Nagant, 7.62x39 Kalashnikov, etc) to facilitate extraction.
The ammo can cause extraction issues in certain guns NOT designed to run it (including AR-15 platform guns). The worst problems seem to happen not when running steel case ammo, but in running regular brass ammo AFTER steel case without a good scrubbing first.0 -
Like most everyone else said Steel cased stuff is totally fine to shoot, I've shot 5,000+ of it out of my AR I've NEVER had a FTF or a jam. Honestly most of the rumors you hear about it melting in the chamber, or breaking/ruining your gun are complete and utter BS. There are several great videos out there of people testing Brown Bear/Wolf next to the good stuff and it shows that they're damn near just as accurate. It's always seemed stupid and wasteful to me to spend $400 on the good stuff just for plinking when BB/Wolf etc cost half as much and shoot just as well. 0
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