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its the jury, stupid!

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17 comments

  • buffalobo
    This is not discussed or used often enough by the American citizen.
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  • pickenup
    Most people do not even know about this, much less how it works.
    If only.......

    Good post.
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  • therockguy
    so this is the truth? im so malinformed of a jurys right that I was unsure. help me spread this about so everyone will know of there rights to change laws and governement
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  • buffalobo
    This is a very important part of our "legal system" that has been trashed over the last 150 yrs. Another part of history left out or mutilated in our schools. This link will get a good start but the history is also important, as it shows the arrogance of those who control the legal system and use it against the citizenry. Will post other links soon as I can(on out of town work assignment).

    http://www.fija.org/
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  • buffalobo
    "If a juror accepts as the law that which the judge states, then that juror has accepted the exercise of absolute authority of a government employee and has surrendered a power and right that once was the citizen's safegaurd of liberty."(1788)(2 Elliots Debates, 94, Bancroft, History of the Constitution, 267)


    This link connects to a short history of jury nullification, it is very interesting and educational. Should be used as another tool to defend freedom, and is as important(IMO) as the second amendment as it can be used to defend/protect those who are unfairly charged with violating some of the more ridiculous gun laws used against citizens.

    http://www.isil.org/resources/lit/history-jury-null.html
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  • ForceRecon
    I love jury nullification. It horrifies judges, scares the daylights out of prosecutors, and delights a wrongly accused man of 'trumped up' charges or pretended offenses made up by an over-zealous state.

    Here's my take: If it's about guns or taxes, the dude walks, period. I don't give a damn if he was caught red handed with a machine gun, he walks. Moreover, if they select me, I will be the jury foreman and it will be OUR court of law, not theirs. [:D] This is my country, not the politician's, or the bureaucrat's.
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  • therockguy
    have there been any cases were this was succesfully used? please show sources if u can
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  • buffalobo
    quote:Originally posted by therockguy
    have there been any cases were this was succesfully used? please show sources if u can


    There are many in our history, but few recently. Am on assignment out of town but when I return if someone else has not allready posted info I will start posting web sites to check out and specific cases. I have posted links above that can keep a person busy for a while.
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  • tallcharlie
    I sat on a grand jury that was informed by the permanent foreman that as a part of our duties after we heard the requests for indictment we would inspect and investigate the jail.

    However, there had been some controversy about a couple of recent decisions by the District Attorney not to seek indictments on two possible murders.

    In the first, a man struck his wife after a public argument; she fell to the ground and died within two days. The DA decided that it was an accident and declined to prosecute. The man's father was a close friend of the DA.

    In the second, a local man was found dead by his wife. He had a .357 revolver in his hand and a gunshot wound to the head. The DA decided it was suicide and declined to prosecute. The wife was a close friend of a state trooper, and later took up with him. The trooper was a close friend of the DA.

    So I suggested that, rather than tour the jail, the grand jury should review these two case files. The foreman immediately dismissed the grand jury for the day (week), and when it was called back into session, I was not informed or called. It seems I was longer a member.

    I've walked carefully since then.
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  • ForceRecon
    quote:Originally posted by therockguy
    have there been any cases were this was succesfully used? please show sources if u can

    Try OJ Simpson. Guilty as sin, but his 'peers' let him off. You might think that crappy, but it happened nonetheless.

    Now he's cooling his jets in the Nevada State Prison system. I love Nevada juries. They take care of business when the California ones won't.

    Everybody knows that jackass did the murders, but it took some Nevadans to right the ship. OOOrah.[:D]
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  • ForceRecon
    quote:Originally posted by tallcharlie
    I sat on a grand jury that was informed by the permanent foreman that as a part of our duties after we heard the requests for indictment we would inspect and investigate the jail.

    However, there had been some controversy about a couple of recent decisions by the District Attorney not to seek indictments on two possible murders.

    In the first, a man struck his wife after a public argument; she fell to the ground and died within two days. The DA decided that it was an accident and declined to prosecute. The man's father was a close friend of the DA.

    In the second, a local man was found dead by his wife. He had a .357 revolver in his hand and a gunshot wound to the head. The DA decided it was suicide and declined to prosecute. The wife was a close friend of a state trooper, and later took up with him. The trooper was a close friend of the DA.

    So I suggested that, rather than tour the jail, the grand jury should review these two case files. The foreman immediately dismissed the grand jury for the day (week), and when it was called back into session, I was not informed or called. It seems I was longer a member.

    I've walked carefully since then.


    You might want to complain to the AG of your state. That sounds woefully like a situation that needs investigation.
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  • Permanently deleted user
    quote:Originally posted by ForceRecon

    You might want to complain to the AG of your state. That sounds woefully like a situation that needs investigation.


    Crooked politicians are crooked politicians. I would think TC would file a formal complaint IF he thought it would do any good, and not cause him to visit the grey bar motel.

    One man against a boat load of crooks is suicide. An army of ticked off citizens is the only recourse to make these crooks see the short end of a long rope.....
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  • buffalobo
    Odinson, jury nullification is a very important part of our history as it is a way for the citizenry to protect each other from unjust laws, judges and prosecutors. Follow the links above and do some research, it is important to educate the public on this before it disappears in our soceity.
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  • therockguy
    quote:
    Try OJ Simpson. Guilty as sin, but his 'peers' let him off. You might think that crappy, but it happened nonetheless.

    Now he's cooling his jets in the Nevada State Prison system. I love Nevada juries. They take care of business when the California ones won't.

    Everybody knows that jackass did the murders, but it took some Nevadans to right the ship. OOOrah.

    that was not jury nullification, they did not determine that murder is not a punishable act, just that they couldnt beyond a shadow of a doubt convict him of an obvious murder.
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  • Easton Archer 66
    Therockman presented a good case on jury nulification but failed to mention the fact that most judges will fine an atty for even mentioning JN during jury picking or during the trial itself. If a juror is suspected of having knowledge of JN they will be disqualified from the jury pool immediately; for the judge's refuse to relenquish their authority over the jury in the presentation of instructions prior to the jury's receiving the case. This has happened all over the country for years as judges assume more and more power than they are actually allowed.
    The intent is great, but with the judges refusal to have it presented
    during jury proceedings, it has no effect. WE THE PEOPLE have several different BOXES from which to choose, the first is the ballot box, then comes the soap box, the jury box where it vcan be shuck into the jury, and finally the ammo box as a last resort against tyranny by govt officials.[:o)]
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  • Dwight Callaway
    I am the author of the original post entitled "The Jury, Stupid!" or alternately "It's the jury, stupid"
    And subtitled most recently "A message from Thomas Jefferson"

    Thanks to the rock guy for posting it here.

    My name is Dwight M. Callaway of Boise ID and I invite anyone sincerely interested in doing something positive with jury revolution to contact me.

    I also want to urge all of you to become experts on jury nullification and the power of the true citizen-controlled grand jury. Learn how to wage and win a jury revolution.

    Consider becoming jury educators by telling others about jury nullification - in as many ways as you can think to do that.

    You will enjoy reading "the history of jury nullification" on the Internet and the bodies of quotes on the subject available. Links provided below.

    One thing that can be done is to help get this essay (and another I will post shortly - which is written specifically for gun owners) posted onto every gun rights website on the Internet? You can do a lot to help to make this happen.

    Below are some links to information which will really empower people as jurors, "jury revolutionaries",as gun owners, as citizens and patriots.

    IF ANY OF THESE LINKS ARE BUSTED, GOOGLE THE PHRASE and you will find it. Alternately, email me and ask for "JRP-LINKS" document.

    The Jury Revolution: Why Jury Nullifications Will Transform America
    http://www.citizensforaconstitutionalrepublic.com/callaway_The_Jury_Revolution.html
    http://www.geocities.com/jury_revolution/

    THE HISTORY OF JURY NULLIFICATION
    http://www.isil.org/resources/lit/history-jury-null.html

    More jury nullification quotes are available at:

    http://www.freedomlaw.com/JRYQuot.html

    http://www.levellers.org/jrp/orig/jrp.jurquotes.htm

    And you may email me and request even more quotations.


    GUN - RIGHTS AND JURY NULLIFICATION

    "FIJA and The Second Amendment" by Don Doig, co-founder of FIJA
    http://www.fija.org/fijactivists.htm . Then click on the "American Juror -- Summer 2003 (in PDF)"
    FIJActivist Summer 2003 in PDF.



    "Jury Nullification and The 2nd Amendment" (pdf version) by Guy Smith
    (html version) ( http://www.gunfacts.info )


    GRAND JURY INFORMATION

    http://www.fija.org/fijactivists.htm Click on "American Juror -- Fall 2004 (in PDF)"

    The Grand Jury Prize winning essay by George J. Edwards, Jr. ;Philadelphia Bar (1906)
    http://www.constitution.org/gje/gj_00.htm

    What Is A "Runaway" Grand Jury?
    http://campus.udayton.edu/~grandjur/faq/faq8.htm

    Opening The Grand Jury by Jon Roland
    http://www.constitution.org/jury/gj/02713_gj.htm


    Thirty Days On The Grand Jury by Edward J. Epstein
    http://www.edwardjayepstein.com/archived/grandjury.htm

    HOW GRAND JURIES "RUBBER STAMP" POLICE STATE INJUSTICES By Charles L. Lindner; Past president of the L.A. County Criminal Bar Assn
    http://www.worldfreeinternet.net/news/nws40.htm
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  • buffalobo
    Hey folks this power of the jury is the most powerfull legal tool we have to fight the incrementalism of an abusive legal system. Everyone needs to discuss w/ and educate as many people as possible. The masses have been told for so long that judges are all powerfull in the courtroom that it will take much effort and dedication to get this going the other way. Participation is the key, don't try to aviod jury duty. Play by the rules but get on those juries, make sure other jurors/ potential jurors understand that jury nullification does in fact exist and it is their duty to use it when necessary.
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