? about Reminton primers
I bought some Remington # 1 1/2 small pistol primers this week and today I loaded 50 rounds of 40 S&W using those primers. After I finished, I was entering the data in my log book. In my search for the batch number of the primers, I found the following notice in very small type on the side of the box.
"Do not use 1 1/2 small pistol primers in high intensity cartridges such as the 357 magnum, 357 Sig, and the 40 S&W. Damage to your firearm and/or serious injury may result."
Does anyone know the reason for this warning? My theory is that the primers went into the cases very easily, and that they may back out of the case while in the magazine and the gun is being fired. Or is there another defect in the design that causes them to be unsafe in the above cartridges?
Thanks
"Do not use 1 1/2 small pistol primers in high intensity cartridges such as the 357 magnum, 357 Sig, and the 40 S&W. Damage to your firearm and/or serious injury may result."
Does anyone know the reason for this warning? My theory is that the primers went into the cases very easily, and that they may back out of the case while in the magazine and the gun is being fired. Or is there another defect in the design that causes them to be unsafe in the above cartridges?
Thanks
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I would think the primer cup is designed to be on the thin side and the pressure may be too great on the 357 mag/40s&w etc. . I for one would not shoot them unless they are on the LOW end of powder charge for that cartridge. Blown primers are not fun. 0 -
So I got a brick of these things to. So can you load these in a 357 using loads where a standard primer is called for? 38 loads all use the 11/2 primer and are standard loads. So why in a 357? I have never used Remington primers before so I am glad someone saw this. I know a lot of people use standard primers for all loads and never use mag primers. So what is the deal? I think they do want you using them in loads calling for mag primers. If this is the case than no problem using them up. Anybody else have some thoughts on this? 0 -
quote:Originally posted by perry shooter
I would think the primer cup is designed to be on the thin side and the pressure may be too great on the 357 mag/40s&w etc. . I for one would not shoot them unless they are on the LOW end of powder charge for that cartridge. Blown primers are not fun.
Unfortunately, I was loading them at the higher end of the spectrum. Do you know if the O.D. of the primer is a little smaller than say a Winchester. It seems the Winchester primers take more force to go into the primer pocket. I've noticed that the Federal primers are also very easy to seat.0 -
The primers should all be the same diameter . I don't know this for a FACT and only Remington could tell you BUT there are two things to consider. #1 is the Flash front generated by the primer . some powders need a stronger flash to set the powder off "BALL POWDER " used in many Magnum /HOT loads and #2 the thickness of the primer CUP a thin cup will require less of a hit by the Hammer Firing pin to activate the primer lighter hammer fall /lighter trigger pull as used in some PPC /MATCH pistols but this exposes the pistol to blown primers if the load is hot and the cup is thin . I suspect that why it feels that they are easier to seat is NOT because of size but rather the fact the metal is thinner and can be formed to go into the primer pocket with less force.The Magnum primers can be used any any pistol load if you reduce the powder charge slightly the only problem is you may have some misfires from light hammer hit NOT GOOD in a CC pistol but no danger to the pistol .On the other hand I would not fire HOT loads in a 40 with standard primers "KABOOM[:(!][V][:(][:0]." 0 -
Clearly, there have been problems serious enough for Remington to print that warning. They don't post such warnings on a whim. If you choose to ignore the warning and have an accident, you have no grounds for recourse.
You might want to practice dialing 911 with your tongue in case you suddenly find yourself without fingers.0 -
Yep, Warning Labels on Planes and reloading supplies are there for the same reason - Somebody Died/Injured. 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rocky Raab
Clearly, there have been problems serious enough for Remington to print that warning. They don't post such warnings on a whim. If you choose to ignore the warning and have an accident, you have no grounds for recourse.
You might want to practice dialing 911 with your tongue in case you suddenly find yourself without fingers.
Rocky, I have no intention of firing these rounds, I just wanted to know the reason for the warning. I'm new to reloading, but I'm not an idiot, and I don't appreciate your counterproductive condescending answer.0 -
I do apologize. I used the word "you" because when I use the more correct "one", some supercilious azzhats here say I'm being haughty (they'd say uppity because they don't know that haughty means - or supercilious).
Can't win. Use the right word and I get jumped on; use the wrong one on purpose and I inadvertently insult.
I hope I helped answer your (correct use) question. No condescension intended.0 -
quote:Originally posted by Rocky Raab
I do apologize. I used the word "you" because when I use the more correct "one", some supercilious azzhats here say I'm being haughty (they'd say uppity because they don't know that haughty means - or supercilious).
Can't win. Use the right word and I get jumped on; use the wrong one on purpose and I inadvertently insult.
I hope I helped answer your (correct use) question. No condescension intended.
Rocky I accept your apology. I think you missed the point of my post or I didn't make the point very clear, which I've been known to do on occasion. I was only curious as to why the warning was given on these calibers, and what was the problem Remington was trying to avoid.
Earlier today I pulled the bullets on 20 of the rounds, and I intend to pull the rest as soon as I get the time. I had them loaded with 180 gr bullets and 6.8 gr. of SR4759 powder, for an expected fps. speed in the 950-975 range which would have had a healthy recoil. So if my assumption is correct, it could have led to the primers backing out while still in the magazine. But that's just using the SWAG (scientific wild assed guess) factor and not based on any firm data.
I'm going to suit up in protective gear and try to de-cap one of the cases and see if I can salvage the primers. If primers weren't so hard to find, I would just throw them away.
Cheers,
Joe0 -
after pulling the bullet and dumping the powder wear safety glasses and you should be Ok in depriming . HOWEVER I have never tried to reload primers once they have been seated.. I would hold out because I think reloading primers will start to catch up with demand in a few months If it was not for the need of paying Has-Mat fees I would send you some magnum primers. I bought out a gun shop years ago and Have what will most likely be a lifetime supply. 0 -
The more I read these threads , the more I learn [8D]
I always wondered why some primers were harder then others to seat [B)]
Never considered that the thickness could have something to do with it .
I ALWAYS have a hard time seating CCI brand primers for some reason .
I seat them with the bench mounted RCBS priming tool , and I like to use either Remington brand or Winchester .
I never bought any 1 1/2 's and now I know not to .
One other thing , I have taken primers out of cases that were found to be split or for some other reason , not usable , and reused them with no problems , like perry shooter said though , just be careful depriming them , and its always a good idea to have those glasses on .0 -
quote:Originally posted by perry shooter
after pulling the bullet and dumping the powder wear safety glasses and you should be Ok in depriming . HOWEVER I have never tried to reload primers once they have been seated.. I would hold out because I think reloading primers will start to catch up with demand in a few months If it was not for the need of paying Has-Mat fees I would send you some magnum primers. I bought out a gun shop years ago and Have what will most likely be a lifetime supply.
I really appreciate the offer of the magnum primers, but I just bought 1000 Federal magnums 2 weeks ago. I've been using them in lower power loads for my 40 S&W rounds, so when I got the Remington small pistol primers last week, I thought I was ready to load some higher pressure loads again. Wrong, that didn't work out so well, I'm just glad that I only loaded 50 rounds before I found the warning. I've got 40 of the suspect rounds pulled so far, and my hand is still sore from trying to keep the cap on my kinetic puller tight. I'll get the rest pulled in the next few days as I get time. BTW, my idea of protective gear was a full face shield, leather gloves, and ear muffs. [:)][:)]0 -
I seriously doubt they'd have enough mass in themselves to back out due to recoil. The real hazard would be what is called "blanking." That happens when the highly stressed area of the primer right at the firing pin indent blows out under cartridge pressure. The tiny disc of primer cup often gets blown back through the firing pin hole and lodges there. The firing pin then can't protrude far enough to fire the next shot - and the gun is useless until disassembled and cleaned. The hot gasses coming back through the action toward the shooter aren't good news, either.
Thin primer cups (designed for guns with light mainspring force) have to be paired with low-pressure loads to prevent blanking. Remington and Federal small pistol primers are among those with thin or soft cups. They are best used in revolver target loads or low-pressure semi-auto rounds like the 380.0 -
Thanks Rocky, that's the caliber of info I was looking for. [:)] 0
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