Need some help on Winchester 12 ga.
What can youu tell me about em,I picked up a pait bith auto loading,ist.pat dates on each Aug.27,1901 last June 4,1912.Barrel and reciever have stamps,what appears to be P over W in a circle.Model 11 S.L. on one Model 1911 S.L. on the other,Ser.A over 76394,smaller 78 after,other one no.A over 36430 one is full ,other is modified.It there any value in these?One is real rough Other is very nice.Any help appreciated.
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LONGHUNTER: Sounds as if you have a 1911 Winchester Autoloader. They kinda looked like the 1907 rifle. Should be a TakeDown shotgun. Winchester never made a Semi-Auto Shotgun, that would bring good money. (Unless it was Gold Plated or Highly Engraved)The 50 and 59 are about the Only 2 I can recall. In good condition it may bring $200, to someone wanting to fill their collection. [;)]
Ronnie G. Perkins0 -
Those are model 1911's, made from 1911 to 1928. They were not a popular gun, the recoil on them was horrible. Winchester developed them to sell an autoloader that didn't step on any of Browning's patents. Various minor changes were made to them thru the years, I recall they were trying to make them so they didn't crack the stocks from the recoil. Your 36340 looks like a 1913 gun, the 76394 is a 1919 gun. I have no idea what they're worth without seeing them, they don't command high prices. 0 -
Longhunter;
What you have are two 1911 S.L. shotguns.
Built from 1911 to 1928. They quickly acquired the nickname "WIDOW MAKER",earned by the accidents associated with them. If improperly handled they CAN and WILL discharge on closing. They should be handled very carefully if loaded. The button in the reciever MUST be pressed from right to left,BEFORE the barrel this pushed fully backward. the barrel is then released, while keeping the muzzle pointed in a safe direction. The bolt is locked open in this position, the button is then pressed left to right to release it and load the first round into the chamber. I advise not loading or firing them before being carefully inspected by a gun smith. These shotgun are VERY tempermental, and subject to many failures, hence, the nickname. This was the primary reason for thier short production life and quick dis-continuence. BE EXTREMELY CAREFUL WITH THESE PARTICULAR AUTO LOADERS!!!! They are interesting conversation pieces, but, not much else. I have a few in excellent shape hanging on the wall, worth maybe $200 to a collector to fill in the product line. Most collectors don't bother with them.
Kill all the lawyers and the world will be much better for it.0 -
Thanks ,They did seem scarey ,and I noticed right off that is that button wasn't latched you had a real problem.Guess I should hang it up with a "widows Axe/"Oh well anyhow it was an intriging firearm,had never seen one quite like it,the way it worked and all.I know a fellow trapper up here that still carries one on his trapline,well I know him not direct but thru another friend.My thanks to all for thr help..... 0 -
Wasn't there an "only winchesters guy on here? 0 -
Right here longhunter. I would have posted something, but all the others beat me to it! LOL Plus Md 11s, I have no personal experiece with, now a 97,12,21,24,37,42,50, or 59 I do. found it best to keep ones mouth shut if you don't know! Regards Dave 0 -
LOL,Thanks! I been talkin some,gonna do up the best one for now and take it shootin some.Don't worry folks the gunsmith will check it first..Now what do I dare shoot in this thing?and Dave....I will be lookin at some a them other models along the way so will let ya know when I get there.....Course theres a remington and a stevens I got my eye on also.... 0 -
In the era these were made , should you not be aware of " short chambers"? Meaning 2 1/2 inch chambers in 12 guage before , like 1926 or so? I've got some early 20 guage and 16 gauge guns with short chambers, and I'm not sure the chamber dims. for 12 may not have been the same.
Bill Jordan0 -
In the era these were made , should you not be aware of " short chambers"? Meaning 2 1/2 inch chambers in 12 guage before , like 1926 or so? I've got some early 20 guage and 16 gauge guns with short chambers, and I'm not sure the chamber dims. for 12 may not have been the same.
Bill Jordan0 -
Wow...really?Never ran into that before and have some real early 12 ga.here.....lot earlier than either of these.? 0 -
longhunter, Mr. Jordan has a valid point. However, Winchester was chambering their 12 ga shotguns in 2 3/4 by the time the Md 11 came out and 3 years later when the Md 12, 12 ga came out. The very first 97s had damascus or twist barrels they where 2 1/2 in and the first steel barrels I think were 2 1/2. By 1927 even their 16 and 20 ga guns finally had 2 3/4 in chambers. So your Md 11s are 2 and 3/4 inch chambers.
If you have earlier shotguns, than your Md 11s it is best to measure the chamber before putting in a 2 3/4 in shell. 410s weren't 3 in until the early 30s. Winchester was the first one to come up with the 3 in 410.
If there is no chamber marking on the gun have it checked to be safe.
Regards Dave0
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