Norinco 320 Uzi Pre or Post Ban ?
Hi, I have someone inquiring on an Uzi Norico stock for a Model B that I have for sale. I don't know anything about Uzi's. Can someone help me answer his questions ?
I have a Norinco 320 Uzi. It has a worn wooden stock on it. How can I tell if it is a preban, or postban? Can I put a folding stock on it?
I have a Norinco 320 Uzi. It has a worn wooden stock on it. How can I tell if it is a preban, or postban? Can I put a folding stock on it?
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I'm not any expert on this subject--but if I remember correctly the Norinco UZIs were imported well after 1994 (and I think importation was stopped for some reason).
If this is the Norinco UZI I'm thinking of, it has that wood stock that "loops" down to the bottom of the pistol grip/magazine well. I think it has to stay in that configuration to be legal--and any folding stock would be a defininte "no-no."
Hopefully someone else can give you a more definite answer.0 -
ALLNorinco Model 320 "UZI's" imported into the United States came in with their version of the fixed wooden thumbhole stock. Mostly looks more like a "handhole" stock, but that was what they called it. This "FACTORY" configuration is the only way it was approved for import. This is the only way it is "legal" now! It must have and retain its original wood stock, or a like replacement! No Folding stocks allowed on these guns! These guns were imported by IMI at the beginning to replace the then "outlawed" importation of the folding stock Model B IMI UZI. This gun is considered to be "POST" Ban.
Having said this, it is also worth mentioning here, Norinco had one gun in UZI configuration, which came into this country legally in 1988 - 1989, which had a metal folding stock. However, these are very limited in number, quite uncommonly found, and sometimes outright "Forgeries!" This gun is called a "Norinco Officer's Nine." It is identical to the Model 320 Norinco, but it is factory marked "Officer's Nine" in the same place the Model 320 is marked as a 320. This makes it easy because if both markings are on the gun, it is a forgery. If you have a Norinco UZI with a metal folding stock and it doesn't say "Model 320" on it but says "Officers Nine," it is probably an original and quite scarce. But if you have a Norinco UZI with a metal folding stock on it and it is marked "Model 320" you have an ILLEGAL gun. I hope I haven't confused anyone here.
Another note, the quality of the Norinco Model 320 leaves a lot to be desired when compared to an IMI UZI. That's the reason they generally sell for about one third the price of an IMI gun. For collector reasons, the Officer Nine being scarce as it is will bring very close to an IMI Model B price if in pristine condition. However, except for the fact it has a metal folding stock, its quality is no better than the Model 320, (Same Receiver, etc.), are poorly made and finished quite poorly. Hope this helps.
Fish Shudder at the sound of my Name!0 -
Although advertised and scheduled to come into the country in 1988-89, to the best of my knowledge, the "Officer's 9" never made it. Action Arms protested its import and prevented it from ever coming into the country. They claimed patent infringement. However it was them that initiated contact with the Chinese in 1993. They dictated the changes necessary to make it importable, by the current guidelines at that time: no bayonet lug, welded barrel nut, and the ever popular thumbhole stock. They could be imported with those changes since they had not actually been imported prior to the March 1989 ban. After the changes were made and the deal struck, importation began in approx. March of 1994 and was then halted on May 28th 1994, when the Chinese import ban took affect. Later in that year there were thousands upon thousands of Chinese guns released from customs that had been held from a major shipment that arrived on or about the May date. It was those guns; SKS's, MAK's, and UZI Sporter 320's, that were available on the market for the next several years until the supply ran out.
So no, a Norinco UZI can't have a folding stock, that folds. With enough US parts added, it can legally have a pistol grip and standard stock (or FIXED folder style stock) however. As previously mentioned, there are a lot of people out there who have tried to make their Norinco UZI appear like it was a pre-ban. The easy way to tell is to look for the bayonet lug, it is very hard to fake. The folding stock is easy to find and add, but the bayonet lug is tougher. Also look for the small weld spots on the barrel nut. Of course that can be changed out somewhat easily too.0 -
lrarmsx:
Thanks for "filling" in where I left off.....appreciate the additional information for myself! Regarding the "Officers Nine" which has been discussed here, I have been offered 2 or 3 guns reputed to be one of these. None were! On inspection, it was evident each of them had a folding stock added. You could see this by differences in the stock's finish compared to the rest of the gun. All were marked as Model 320, and of course as you have stated, no bayo lug, etc.
In 1995 only, Norinco UZI's marked "Model B" were sold also. These came with the hand hole type "thumbhole" stock and with a single 10 round magazine to comply with the 1994 ban. No Bayo Lug, welded barrel nut.....Post Ban configuration.
The twenty third edition of The Book of Gun Values, (Blue Book), by S.P. Fjestad, claims the "Officers Nine" to be a "Limited 1988-1989" model. Claims Manufacturer's Suggested Retail to have been $450. It also gives values based on condition. Just for information purposes. I wonder if these were "prototype guns" and not a regular release of production models......might be very scarce.
Fish Shudder at the sound of my Name!0 -
I can well remember the big ads that Action Arms took out in Shotgun News screeming that they were going to file a law suit against any dealer who even stocked, much less sold, an Officers Nine. There was a very high profile shooting here in California a few years back where a white supremisist nut terrorized a Jewish pre-school and then shot and killed a Philipino mail carrier durng his escape. The lunitics last name was Bufford. The weapon was at first identified as a Uzi and was banned from retail sale here in California since 1989. Later the ATF and DOJ determined it was one of a handfull of these Officer Nine Carbines imported and was legal for sale in California at the time (since it was not marked "Uzi"). This was just one more reason that the assault weapons ban here was expanded to cover weapons by feature rather than just type or model designation. The anti's got ahold of this "loop hole gun" (there were quite a few others as well that were used in crimes here) and ran with it all the way to the State House.
Mark T. Christian0 -
How interesting, Mark! Wouldn't you just know it! Some Nut Case would use a "collectible" to do his dirty work! Of course, the lesson there was that it really didn't matter. I mean it didn't matter what the gun was. Had he not had that Officers Nine, he would have had some other 9mm, or a sword, a 2x4, length of pipe, etc. It was that Bufford that killed.....not the gun! He would have found a way to do what he intended to do! I wish people could see these shootings for what they really are/were! An Idiot at work! Seems I remember a Nut running over 4 or 5 students with a car and killing them......the "noise" about that diminished and went away in a hurry......damned car anyway.......but he had insurance.......not a gun.......yada, yada, yada.....Holy Freakin' Tomatoes!
Fish Shudder at the sound of my Name!0 -
Quite correct Paul. The car incident took place in Costa Mesa, about 20 minutes to the north of me. A deranged man plowed his car into the playground of a day care center during lunch time when the kids were out certain to be playing. He killed five and nobody said one word other than it was a tragic and they hoped he was punished. The nut with the Officers Nine was used a prime example of how the (then current) AW ban in California was worthless and needed some "real teeth" to prevent this sort of thing.
An interesting fact was that as soon as the first AW ban as passed here back in 1989 the anti's were amazed that it was still possible to purchase a semi auto firearm. Instead of the banned AR-15, everyone bought Bushmasters or Olympic Arms. Instead of the HK-91, they all bought Springfield SAR-8's, No AK-47's? Buy a MAK-90 and so on. It was only a matter of time before this would catch up with us and it took a few high profile shootings with these "loop hole guns/ ban beaters" to give the anti's the ammunition they needed to pass a really tough gun ban- which they did.
Mark T. Christian0 -
Yes, and unfortunately, the NUTS still kill, using whatever means to accomplish their ends. Plainly, it is apparent it doesn't matter what the weapon.......! When are they going to address the real cause? Motive is all that matters.....tools come next, be it a vehicle, gun, knife, club, axe, etc......! What a state of affairs! WoW!!!
Fish Shudder at the sound of my Name!0
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