Carcano Question
hello, just picked up a carcano carbine with gardone v.t, 1929 on the left side of the barrel which starts off octagon. on top it reads beretta, and then serialed 4926 with pg in a circle on the right. has made in italy on left side of barrel behind front sight, but no import marks. ive never seen one with beretta stamped on it. was wondering if i might have one that is half way rare or is this just an average old carcano. thanks, redman
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Looking at buying a m38 carcano in the 8x57 chambering. Want to occassionally shoot it if possible but have seen some places that this is not safe to shoot in a carcano rifle. Have also heard that it is safe. Is this usualy a headspace deal or what? Looking from the extensive use of this rifle in 8mm mauser from ww2 by the Germans up through the 50's in other various militaries such as the Israelis I am inclined to think otherwise. However I would like the opinion of others on this as I am no where near an expert on Carcano rifles. And fi these are safe to shoot will the standard 6.5mm/7.35mm clips work in them and if not where can one find them. I was on numrich the other day and they didnt have any. 0 -
(2) Points!
(1), The Germans weren't dumb, they wouldn't have used the Model 1938-43 Short Rifle, ( 7.92mm x 57 ). Only their unfortunate Italian allies who stayed loyal to them after Italy changed sides in 1943 were armed with it.
(2), It wasn't loaded with a stripper clip, the individual cartridges were loaded into the magazine by hand. This was because of the rifles magazine being altered from the Mannlicher system by machineing and welding to accept the 7.92mm cartridge.
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So in otherwards you are saying that it isnt safe to shoot an 8mm converted carcano, or that is is not very pleasurable? I have heard stories of how bad teh muzzle flash and recoil was on these rifles, but no definate answer to the saftey of shooting an 8mm round in them. Would the bolts hold being lighter and with one less lug than a 98 mauser? 0 -
quote:Originally posted by Wehrmacht_45
So in otherwards you are saying that it isnt safe to shoot an 8mm converted carcano, or that is is not very pleasurable? I have heard stories of how bad teh muzzle flash and recoil was on these rifles, but no definate answer to the saftey of shooting an 8mm round in them. Would the bolts hold being lighter and with one less lug than a 98 mauser?
I have never shot a 7.92 x 57mm Carcano, and don't want to. My 2 cents is that it is a very interesting relic of a little known WW II era that should be hung on the wall as a collectors item, rather then a shooter.0 -
Well, to do the conversion, the barrel was re-rifled, the chamber re-cut, and the reciever slightly remilled, all of which means less meat in the metal area for a more powerful round. I have talked to some guys over at the Italian rifle forum on gunboards, and their 2 cents is that it is safe with US commercial (rather underpowered) loads, or light handloads, but they generally shy away from shooting full power surplus. I don't have one personally; I would trust it with light loads, from what I hear, if you handload. Regarding the magazine, there is some debate; a Carcano clip can be modified (bent out) to feed the larger head 8mm, but originals seem to be lacking, and it is suspsected they were either late war german conversions for single shot emergency use, or perhaps some were modified after the war by Yugoslavs, Israelies, or various arab nations, though I tend to side on the German idea.
I will say that Italian rifles are NOT junk, and are well made, if not so well finished. They are more than up to the tast of their original chamberings, and I would suspect could handle the pressure of the 8mm round if all that metal wasn't removed to do it.
"...hit your enemy in the belly, and kick him when he is down, and boil his prisoners in oil- if you take any- and torture his women and children. Then people will keep clear of you..." -Admiral of the Fleet Lord Fisher, speaking at the Hague Peace Conf0 -
I've got one of these, purchased from the late, and now apparently reconstituted, Springfield Sporters several years ago. It was in close to new condition when I got it, but the idea of shooting it seemed a bit like premature suicide. Nevertheless, being of inquisitive mind, I tied it down in a tire, loaded it, got 'way back, and pulled the trigger with a long string. The tire rocked and rolled, but the gun was fine. Same for the second test. Then I put on my thickest and best pair of safety glasses and fired two from the shoulder. Not only did it hold together, but it actually hit what I was shooting at 50 yds. away! I gave it my full refinish treatment, and will be shooting it occassionally in the future with 8x57mm rounds handloaded to .30-30 Win. levels. Afterall---why tempt fate; especially with those hot surplus Turk rounds!!?? Now there is one more interesting point. They used to advertise them as having been converted for use by the Italian troops fighting with Rommel in N. Africa. I thought it odd, as mine is plainly stamped 1944. The Afrika Korps was long gone from Africa, as were the Italians. It now develops that a bunch of them may have been converted from 7.35/6.5 mm to 8x57 mm by the Israelis during the first Arab-Israeli war when they were desperately short of rifles, and 8x57 was their standard rifle caliber. It makes sense, and many Carcanos were (and still are) floating around N.Africa courtesy of Il Duce. That fits in well with my 1944 date, as they also sent agents all over Europe scrounging rifles. Anyway, if you like it, go for it. You will have to modifiy a stripper clip or two to make the rifle a successful repeater, as the base of the 8mm is larger that the Italian rounds. The brass ones work best for the conversion if you can find them. They often appear on e-bay. Then, when you take it afield, you'll want to put a strip of duct tape across the hole on the bottom of the magazine housing to prevent losing the clip in the tall grass. 0 -
Thanks alot guys you are a big help. I am getting one in the high end of very good condition and will shoot it only with commercial loads as I do not yet possess a reloading system of my own. 0
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