45/70 Springfield Trapdoor 1878 Model
Just purchased an antique 1878 Trapdoor Springfield Rifle in great mechanical shape - stock has a lot of dings and scratches but all in all - I would say its in NRA Good to Very Good Shape.
Questions:
Was the 1878 Model the last Trapdoor Rifle produced by Springfield?
Is there smokeless powder ammo on the market that's made for a Trapdoor this old? Like I said, mechanically its in great condition.
I don't want to reload black powder cartridges for it - if at all possible.If Smokeless powder can be used - do you have any reloading recommendations as far as the type of powder to use and what powder load you would start at - I'm not interested in seeing how much powder the rifle can take - I just want a safe and comfortable load.
I'm told to use only 405gr lead bullets - no 350gr(approx.?) jacketed. Is this true?
Any idea where I can pick up a sling for this rifle?
I have a new 1895 Marlin Guide Lever Action in the same caliber but have a heck of a time seating bullets into the brass case without bending and ruining the cases - I use a Lee Hand Press & Lee Dies. Any recommendations how to eliminate the brass damage - I've just about given up trying to reload this round.
Any help on my reloading problem or background info on the Trapdoor would be appreciated.
Thanks
John
Vietnam - All Gave Some -Some Gave All
Si vis pacem, para bellum
If you wish peace, prepare for war!
Questions:
Was the 1878 Model the last Trapdoor Rifle produced by Springfield?
Is there smokeless powder ammo on the market that's made for a Trapdoor this old? Like I said, mechanically its in great condition.
I don't want to reload black powder cartridges for it - if at all possible.If Smokeless powder can be used - do you have any reloading recommendations as far as the type of powder to use and what powder load you would start at - I'm not interested in seeing how much powder the rifle can take - I just want a safe and comfortable load.
I'm told to use only 405gr lead bullets - no 350gr(approx.?) jacketed. Is this true?
Any idea where I can pick up a sling for this rifle?
I have a new 1895 Marlin Guide Lever Action in the same caliber but have a heck of a time seating bullets into the brass case without bending and ruining the cases - I use a Lee Hand Press & Lee Dies. Any recommendations how to eliminate the brass damage - I've just about given up trying to reload this round.
Any help on my reloading problem or background info on the Trapdoor would be appreciated.
Thanks
John
Vietnam - All Gave Some -Some Gave All
Si vis pacem, para bellum
If you wish peace, prepare for war!
0
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Releoding for the Trapdoor presents several problems.
1. Weak action The Speer Manual Recommends keepimg the CUP below 21,000
2. Large case. Smokeless Powders will require some sort of filler to make up for the case that was meant for 70 gr of BP
quote:Any recommendations how to eliminate the brass damage
Open the case mouth more, better grade of brass.
Someone should be along with more info for you
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John,
No, the model 1878 was not the last Springfield Trapdoor made. I know there was a model 1887.
Yes, be sure to buy 45/70 Government in 405 gr ammo for it. It's about 14.00 to 20.00 bucks a box.
I currently own two of them are they are a hoot to shoot. I never know if I hit anything when I take them to the range, because they shoot alot further than I can see. [:D][:D][:D]
njretcop@copmail.com
Charlie0 -
1888 was the last.
I think the trapdoor was in service longer than any other service rifle
1865 to 1888
http://come.to/trapdoor0 -
1889-approx 41,500 rifles & carbines
1890-approx 32,000 rifles (includes 1 .30)
1891-approx 31,000 rifles
1892-over 24,000 rifles (includes 13 .30)
1893-almost 10,000 rifles (includes 1 .30)
List from Dixie Gun Works catalogue0 -
MOST COMMERCIAL AMMO LOADED TODAY IS OK FOR THE SPRINGFIELD (REM./WIN/ FED. 405 GN) BUT THE JACKETED BULLETS WILL WEAR THE BARREL FASTER THAT LEAD BULLETS. THE BARREL STEELS USED BACK THEN WERE NOT AS WEAR RESISTANT AS TO DAYS STEELS. AS TO YOUR RELOADING ?; YOU PROBABLY EITHER AREN'T EXPANDING OR BELLING THE CASES ENOUGHT BE FORE SEATING THE BULLETS OR YOUR TRYING TO CRIMP TO MUCH. 0 -
You need to bell the brass a surpeising amount on this round, and then form and crimp it back up at the seating stage. I also reload for collectable (Trapdoors, Sharps) and modern 45-70 (Marlin GG, Siamese Mauser) and each presents it's own little idiosyncracies. I generally use either a 405 or a 455 gr. gascheck lead bullet in my olderguns and follow standard load values for the Trapdoor Springfield. 20 some odd grains of IMR 4198 and a light cotton ball seem to make a good load (although it looks as though it may be snowing when you touch it off!)but check your loading manuals before getting adventurous.
With the guide gun, I use either 350 grain jacketed rounds or 455 gr gas checked lead and with the 455's, I use 37 or so grains of 4198 and a COL of "2.55 to "2.57...this is very important as the lifter will jam anything longer!
"When I cease learning...I'm dead"(Me)
"When I was 14 I used to marvel at how ignorant my old man was...by the time I was 21 I was truelly amazed at how much the old bugger had learned in the intervening 7 years!" Samuel Clemens
"History is written by winners"(Patton)
"You get a lot farther with a kind word and a gun than you do with a kind word alone!"(Al Capone)
"There is nothing lower than the human race...except the French" (Samuel Clemens)0 -
Thanks guys for all the feedback - I appreciate it!
John
Vietnam - All Gave Some -Some Gave All
Si vis pacem, para bellum
If you wish peace, prepare for war!0
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