Long Range Shots
If you are going to shoot game at greater than 400 yards it takes more than a MOA rifle.
I'll agree with you JustC. You seem to have a vast amount of experience with your rig and obviously enjoy the sport enough to have your loads worked out for range, weather, & wind. Probably tape that data to your buttstock or tote a data book before heading afield.
I would not hesitate to bet on you to connect with a 500 yard shot based on your responses on this board.
For those writing in to ask what is the best long range rifle, I want to emphasize to them that the gear does not make you a 500 yard shooter. You must practice, practice, practice. The practice is not to develop the ability to group at MOA under ideal conditions (early AM, cool, calm, days)it is to experience varying wind, lighting, and shot angles. To develop the ability to 'dope' your wind under field conditions.
Two pieces of equipment I surely desire is a good 'wind gage/weather station' and a Lieca range finder.
"They're in front of us, they're behind us, they're to our left and to our right...they can't get away now."
Chesty Puller, Chosin Reservoir, Korea
SEMPER FI
I'll agree with you JustC. You seem to have a vast amount of experience with your rig and obviously enjoy the sport enough to have your loads worked out for range, weather, & wind. Probably tape that data to your buttstock or tote a data book before heading afield.
I would not hesitate to bet on you to connect with a 500 yard shot based on your responses on this board.
For those writing in to ask what is the best long range rifle, I want to emphasize to them that the gear does not make you a 500 yard shooter. You must practice, practice, practice. The practice is not to develop the ability to group at MOA under ideal conditions (early AM, cool, calm, days)it is to experience varying wind, lighting, and shot angles. To develop the ability to 'dope' your wind under field conditions.
Two pieces of equipment I surely desire is a good 'wind gage/weather station' and a Lieca range finder.
"They're in front of us, they're behind us, they're to our left and to our right...they can't get away now."
Chesty Puller, Chosin Reservoir, Korea
SEMPER FI
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easygo6,..some folks just want the glory,..these types don't practice[V]. For me,..every bench session is a match. I am trying to "milk" every bit out of the rig,..and thereby I establish it's performance limitations. I Love to practice because,..well I LOVE to shoot. I have lost interest in 100-200yd sessions other than for medial load workup and chronograph data. Wind makes for experience in drift and those cool calm mornings and evenings makes for more scientific data gathering as wind dispersion is limited and the groups can be more accurately given a MOA figure and drop figure.
The wind meter is pretty cheap in Sinclair catalog and palm pilots are getting cheaper by the month. The software can be loaded right into the pilot and voila!!! you have an exact data set anytime anywhere. I don't have the wind guage yet,..but the palm pilot is soon to be purchased. What I have done until now is to run the drop charts at an average temp for different seasons,..and also then run those charts with different wind speeds. That gets you pretty close without all the fancy equipment,..you only have to be "close" when you guess the wind and use the appropriate chart.
I always try to specify that I shoot FROM A BENCH, with a mechanical rest and rear bags, and use rifles that are far better then I am. That is the responsibility I always speak of,..if someone wishes to be proficient they must invest lots of TIME,..not just money.
I think all in all we are on the same page. I never try to discourage someone wanting to get into LR hunting,..but I also try to be very clear that they have that responsibility. You always OWE the game that respect[8] If someone thinks they can just shoot off a bipod with some match ammo and consistently strike targets wayyy out there,..they better do some more research,..you and I both know there is far more to it than that.[;)]
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
Yes, we are on the same page.
Its too easy to omit an important statement in a subject as complex as LR rifle. Or a reader can assume that a single post is a complete answer to every aspect of LR shooting.
I have not doped wind in over eight years[V]. I may try to get my rig set again and post some results to you. I respect your ability and believe you will be able to help me get doped again.
I assumed you had an Anenometer(sp, wind gauge). I've considered the Kestrel but worried about it's durability and accuracy. Most shooters do not recognize the need for different charts between seasons (temp/humidity).
I've been on the sniper country web site but found it difficult to navigate to the bulletin boards/Q & A section. I may try to make an event in PA, KY, TN or VA early next year. I live in Cincinnati, OH so I'll not be traveling beyond these states for a match.
Good discusing this with you, finding someone with a common interest may push me back to the fields. [8D]
"They're in front of us, they're behind us, they're to our left and to our right...they can't get away now."
Chesty Puller, Chosin Reservoir, Korea
SEMPER FI0 -
quote:I've considered the Kestrel but worried about it's durability and accuracy.
The Kestrel 4000 is one of the best on the market.
NRA Life Endowment Member0 -
easygo6,..Ohio has a 1000yd IBS match several times a year[8D] I'll see if I can find the location when I find one of the precision shooting mags around here somewhere. NC, VA, and also DE have IBS matches as well. The best part is that if you pay your $40 annual membership to the IBS,..you get Precision Shooting magazine for free[:D] If you have time,..I try to shoot the Bridgeville DE 600yd match every time they hold it. There are relatively few shooters and and it is very informal. Great place to test loads and have fun. Quanitico was being re-burmed so most matches were cancelled this year. I just can't find much time to go to NC or OH[V] I admit I don't shoot anywhere near as much as I would like. I try for 1-2 times per week,..but sometimes kids and family make that hard. My plan is to be moving onto some land within the next few years so I can load and shoot outside the door (save all the drive and set-up time).
FrancF,..you using the palm pilot and wind meter?
I have found the Hodgden extreme powders to be less temp sensitive,..but all in all,.I find most of the double base extruded powders to be fairly forgiving in different temps.
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
quote:Originally posted by FrancF
quote:I've considered the Kestrel but worried about it's durability and accuracy.
The Kestrel 4000 is one of the best on the market.
If not the best !
NRA Life Endowment Member
"When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are safe
~ Jesus Christ [Luke 11:21.6]
Mauser Central
MidwayUSA, if your not signed up for the Eblast alerts you are missing some great deals !0 -
Not to hijack your thread, I just find it's difficult to get into position quickly for that cross-canyon Wapiti shot while unfolding the bench, and setting up those sandbags[;)].
Not to mention catching my breath!
"Qui non est hodie cras minus aptus erit" --OVID0 -
I'd LOVE to get back to Quantico for a match. It would be nice if the Ohio matches are not at Camp Perry,...I expect Perry is reserved for matches other than IBS.
Cute Gunnut.
I am not vouching for JustC but he does refer to a lot of 'beanfield' type shooting of deer using damage/predation permits.
I too, would set up in a comfortable platform above the crop I am shooting over.
"They're in front of us, they're behind us, they're to our left and to our right...they can't get away now."
Chesty Puller, Chosin Reservoir, Korea
SEMPER FI0 -
easygo6,..the IBS nationals were held at Thunder Valley Rifle Club in Plainfield OH this year.
gunnut505,..if you had set the bench up at the truck,..you wouldn't have been walking in the first place. That is the whole idea behind LR hunting. We don't WALK anywhere,..the bullet gets there so much faster than we can, it's just not worth it. If I were out west,..I'd set up on a ridge line,..but here in the flatland,..all I need is a clear view of the field. Oh,..and my bench is 2 3/4" plywood laminate with steel frame and 3" threaded pipe for legs[:0] ya aint carrying that anywhere[;)] You just pull it out of the truck,..flip it over, and set up the equipment. Heavy benches are stable benches[8] we have built shooting benches and fiberglassed them at several other farms,..these just get left there 365days a year.
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
justc-
i'll get the ridgeline(out here they come standard at 11,000ft.) and bring lunch- you carry the bench...0 -
TLR,..if you can even suggest you are proficient at 3667yds,..well I'll yield to you and all your partners (especially since that is farther than the 3125yd confirmed longest kill on the books). BUT,..one must also find the game and set up correctly. If you set up on a ridge and watch game at 3667 yds I would love to have a view through your spotting equipment. Now if you mean 11,000ft above sea level,..well that kind of negates the long range hunting situation. Once you pack in to the high country,..your on your own. I would consider 500-600yds a long shot up there,..and one that practiced riflemen should be the only ones that try. This is supposing you are using bipods and your pack or jacket as a rear bag. You make a 3000yd shot,..and I will personally carry the shooting bench to the top.
High country and LR hunting are different sports. We set up,..and shoot from there,..we don't hike anywhere. Now,...you show me a flat spot where we can drive to at say 9000ft,...and I'll take the game at 11,000ft,..and YOU pack it out.
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
justc: thats me- i use the local observatory's telescope. whats the hold over on that again, like 75 ft.?, my abacus doesn't go that high....seriously tho- i meant 11k "above sea level". i wish i knew of level spots on public land that had some elk. i wish i knew of some roads that had elk nearby. i'm sure they exist somewhere- if i find some, you buy lunch...
(edit) i personally don't think much of my shooting. i'd be shy to shoot at much over 400, if that...if you ever get out to the whittington center in nm for a match, let me know...0 -
TLR,..you get me out there to even LOOK for elk and I will buy you more than lunch[:p][:D][8D]
If you feel comfortable at 400yds,..then with a rest and a match barrel and good glass,..you would be suprised what you can do[8] Good balistics tables go a longgggg ways[8] Most folks turn down a 400yd shot,..but if you can handle it,..then I'd say you aren't far from handling a 600yd shot. It's all elevation clicks and wind clicks after that. Laser rangefinders and free balistics software have put it in your hands. Shoot some paper and see what you can do!! I was so intimidated the first time I stepped up to the 1000yd line,..but after my 2nd sighter went right above the x-ring,..I realized it's all in the dope chart!!!
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
Hey Rat, you shoot NRAWC much? I was going up this holiday weekend to watch, but there's too much snow 'twixt here 'n' Rat town!
Guess
I'll have to haunt the Shooting Range Park!
"Qui non est hodie cras minus aptus erit" --OVID0
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