Desperate Schmidt-Rubin K-31 Scope Mount Question
OK, I am still looking for the right and best answer. I recently purchased a Swiss 7.5mm Schmidt-Rubin K-31 and I wish to put a good longrange and accurate scope on it. However, because this is a military rifle and not designed to be scoped, I am having a lot of problems deciding what to do.
If I get one of the scout mounts, that mount in place of the rear sight, I must purchase a long eye relief pistol scope. These scope seem to be very, very expensive and in addition they are NOT designed for the long range that a rifle is capable of shooting.
I don't not care for "clamp on" anything so I want to avoid the clamp on mount which goes on the right side of the receiver. Plus it mounts to the right side of the bore and I have always wanted someting that mounts in-line with the bore.
If I buy the drill and tap left side mount, it appear I must change my scopes to a "Tikka Ring" mount. What the heck is that? I am used to plain old weaver mounts. It looks like a Tikka Ring mount would cost me an additional $50+ dollars. In addition, it would still mount the scope to the left of the bore and is that REALLY an accurate way to shot percision long range shooting? Plus the mount would cover up the serial number on the rifle (that maybe legal) but it looks like at least one of the receiver holes that would have to be drilled and tapped would DRILL RIGHT THROUGH ONE OF THE DIGITS OF THE SERIAL NUMBER! That CAN'T be legal.
I bought three of these K-31 rifles becuause I thought they would be cheap but accurate long range shooters. The 7.5mm seems to be an excellent round and there is excellent surplus ammo avilable for them. They have a chrome bore with a recessed crown, a detachable 6 round box mag, and a smooth trigger pull better than I have found on most retail, commerical rifles. Is there any hope for my project? Anybody?
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
If I get one of the scout mounts, that mount in place of the rear sight, I must purchase a long eye relief pistol scope. These scope seem to be very, very expensive and in addition they are NOT designed for the long range that a rifle is capable of shooting.
I don't not care for "clamp on" anything so I want to avoid the clamp on mount which goes on the right side of the receiver. Plus it mounts to the right side of the bore and I have always wanted someting that mounts in-line with the bore.
If I buy the drill and tap left side mount, it appear I must change my scopes to a "Tikka Ring" mount. What the heck is that? I am used to plain old weaver mounts. It looks like a Tikka Ring mount would cost me an additional $50+ dollars. In addition, it would still mount the scope to the left of the bore and is that REALLY an accurate way to shot percision long range shooting? Plus the mount would cover up the serial number on the rifle (that maybe legal) but it looks like at least one of the receiver holes that would have to be drilled and tapped would DRILL RIGHT THROUGH ONE OF THE DIGITS OF THE SERIAL NUMBER! That CAN'T be legal.
I bought three of these K-31 rifles becuause I thought they would be cheap but accurate long range shooters. The 7.5mm seems to be an excellent round and there is excellent surplus ammo avilable for them. They have a chrome bore with a recessed crown, a detachable 6 round box mag, and a smooth trigger pull better than I have found on most retail, commerical rifles. Is there any hope for my project? Anybody?
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"
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Hi, go to www.swissrifles.com, click on the forums (the last one on the menu), then click on "Group buys and hard order lists", then click on the 2nd listing. This looks to be a high quality scope mount for the K31, but quite expensive. It mounts the scope over the bore line though. Emery
"Well done is better than well said"
Ben Franklin0 -
tr fox,
"I bought three of these K-31 rifles becuause I thought they would be cheap but accurate long range shooters."
They are reasonably priced and they are a very accurate rifle. But as you point out, they were not made to be scoped. So, any of the solutions available are going to be 'make do' and potentially more expensive than 'scoping a modern rifle that is already set up.
You're in the process of finding out that cheap and high quality/accuracy don't go hand-in-hand. All of us have gone through this process at one time or another. Mauser conversions are the usual trap. Fortunately, for the consumer, the word has gotten out on that. Here are some points to consider:
- You have a choice of 3 styles in quality mounts; clamp-on (see below), side mount (see below and mazo kid's post), and rear sight replacement/pistol scope.
- None of the higher quality scopes are cheap because cheap just plain doesn't work for accuracy and longevity. Tasco and low level Chinese scopes fulfill one purpose, people buy them that want to spend $50.00/scope. You get what you pay for; a cheap, fairly worthless scope. But it was cheap, the operative word.
- High grade pistol scopes are a bargain compared to high quality target scopes from a top manufacturer. Take a look at the Burris 3-12x Target Pistol scope for about $320.00 with a target elevation turret and AO. These scopes are extremely accurate and will work for the long range accuracy that you are looking for. I use a Leupold 2.5-8x pistol scope in a scout scope configuration on an M-96 Swede and it is a dream to shoot at 100/200 yards.
- Take good look and ask questions about the 'clamp-on' style mount that I link to below. You might be surprised...
- I don't think that you need to consider the drill/tap through the side of the receiver and the serial number. The other options are better, anyway.
- You thought that you could get away with cheap and easy and now you've found that it just ain't so, but you have some choices:
1) Leave the K-31's alone and original but still enjoy them.
2) Bite the bullet and spend the money on a good mount and scope for some real enjoyment of the rifle's accuracy.
3) Sell the rifles since you can't get what you want, cheap.
I'm not trying to be mean, just realistic.
Best of luck!
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This is a photo of the EAW steel mount with EAW 1" rings. It runs about 299.00 Euros @ 1.22 conversion = $364.80 w/rings
This is a discussion with photos of a clamp-on style mount from another forum that specializes in Swiss rifles.
http://p083.ezboard.com/ftheswissriflesdotcommessageboardfrm8.showMessage?topicID=1495.topic0 -
MazoKid & Nononsense: I really and truly appreciate the detailed and helpful info. And Nononsense I am grateful that you didn't hesitate to lay it all out for easy understanding. I learned a tremendous amount for the two posts which I plan on printing and saving for future reference. Thanks again.
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"0 -
Mazokid; that was an GREAT tip you gave me about that new scope mount for the K-31. It truly appears to be mounted over the bore but I question if there truly is no ejection problem. Nononsense you might want to look at this as it appears to be an amazing scope mount for the K-31 and then give me your opinion.
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"0 -
as mentioned before, AD NAUSEUM...
GRAF AND SONS sells 3 different scope mounts for the K-31 SCHMIDT-RUBIN series of rifles. 2 of them are low rise, offset, weaver rail topped mounts patterened off the original swiss sniper K-31...
they also offer a set a match diopter rear, globe target front sights often seen at CAMP PERRY...
these are none drill and tap, non marring, non altering mounts and sights. they are made in europe by known major manufacturers...
while GRAF AND SON often are out of stock when you try to order, they eventualy get it in...
best regards, mike.
What other dungeon is so dark as ones own heart, what jailer so inexorable as ones own mind.
contact me at the shop at waltsgun@aol.com best regards, mike.0 -
tr fox,
"- You have a choice of 3 styles in quality mounts; clamp-on (see below), side mount (see below and mazo kid's post), and rear sight replacement/pistol scope."
I did look at it and mentioned that mazo kid had you covered with his post. I think that it is a real viable mount for your K-31, well made, nicely machined and a thoughtful design. If you have a question regarding brass ejection, give the guy a shout and see what he has to say. It's a nice group of people with a love of a particular rifle and I'm sure that they will bend over backwards to help anyone.
mrmike,
If you take a second and look at what has been posted already, you will realize that the mounts listed in Graf's are the same ones that we've been discussing. mazo kid and I were trying to tie in some conversation from the manufacturer of the bases through the links to the forum that hosted the photos and announcements regarding those mounts. I'm glad to see that there is another retail option, though. A quick read would have saved you the intestinal distress.
Best.0 -
quote:Originally posted by tr fox
If I get one of the scout mounts, that mount in place of the rear sight, I must purchase a long eye relief pistol scope. These scope seem to be very, very expensive and in addition they are NOT designed for the long range that a rifle is capable of shooting.
I don't not care for "clamp on" anything so I want to avoid the clamp on mount which goes on the right side of the receiver. Plus it mounts to the right side of the bore and I have always wanted someting that mounts in-line with the bore.
If I buy the drill and tap left side mount, it appear I must change my scopes to a "Tikka Ring" mount. What the heck is that? I am used to plain old weaver mounts. It looks like a Tikka Ring mount would cost me an additional $50+ dollars. In addition, it would still mount the scope to the left of the bore and is that REALLY an accurate way to shot percision long range shooting? Plus the mount would cover up the serial number on the rifle (that maybe legal) but it looks like at least one of the receiver holes that would have to be drilled and tapped would DRILL RIGHT THROUGH ONE OF THE DIGITS OF THE SERIAL NUMBER! That CAN'T be legal.
Uh, guys I truly appreciate your advice, but please don't get the idea that I don't pay attention to it. For examample MrMike hass given me two or three good answers in the past and I have not forgotten the answers. But if you read my orginal post here I am well aware of the three type of mounts available but I was stating my thoughts that I didn't feel any of the three were right for me and I listed the reason why for all three of the mounts. Now as it turns out the posting time was well spent by me because MasoKid was kind enough to direct me to the link, that appears to just have been posted a couple of days ago, about a totally brand new and previously not available scope mount that puts the scope where it should be in relation to the shooter (my opinion only) AND still puts the scope directly over the bore. However even at that carefully looking at the empty case ejection angle of the K-31 I (even though I am no expert) find it hard to believe that there really and truly is no interference with the
case hitting the scope. So I also posted that question.
Maybe this post wasn't needed but I didn't want you to think I was just ignoring your comments and continuing to post the same questions AD NAUSEUM. But even at that thanks for showing the patience to answer if you thought it was an AD NAUSEUM situation. I do appreciate your time, effort and great knowledge.
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"0 -
if i could find original SWISS ISSUE K-31 SCHMIDT-RUBIN low rise, offset sniper scope mounts (surplus) i would buy 2 or 3, and pass the info on to all here ASAP...
i have called, emailed, or snail-mailed, faxed, or shouted at over 50 suppliers / distributors in an unsucsessful attempt to locate this item. SARCO, SPRINGFIELD SPORTERS, NUMRICH, JACK FIRST, ETC...
i even sent a picture of me, my gun, and a letter asking / inquiring about obtaining one to the SWISS EMBASSY in DC...
honest to god, i have tried to find this item...
best regards, mike.
What other dungeon is so dark as ones own heart, what jailer so inexorable as ones own mind.
contact me at the shop at waltsgun@aol.com best regards, mike.0 -
That (apparently) brand new K-31 scope mount (apparently) designed and offered by a private individual from the link provided by Mazokid looks REALLY good. And I admit I am not an engineer or designer but I still have to question how a scope mounted directly over the bore cannot cause problems on case ejection.
As I observe the K-31 ejecting I notice the empty case goes almost straight up. Looking at the ejector on the receiver makes it look like the only direction for the case to go upon ejection is almost straight up. Looking at the ejection port makes it appear that anything directly over that port is going to be impacted by the ejected case.
Now I know the best way to answer my questions is to ask someone who has bought one or ask the seller of the mount. But I haven't logged onto that particular gun forum yet and I don't know when I will have the the time do so. So I am just throwing out the question here if anyone cares to answer.
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"0 -
I posted the question on www.swissrifles.com
I have an idea as to what takes place when the brass is ejected but let's wait to see if they can post an answer and maybe a photograph, which I asked for, if posssible.
I'll post the answer here if you all want or contact me and I'll send e-mails, whatever you prefer.
Best.0 -
Well, the bad news is that we missed an important differentiation between what we thought was a standard k-31 and what is really a zfk 31/55 which is made with an angled ejection port(duh). If only I had seen the page of photos before I got excited about this mount. But live and learn. I'm always happy to add more information to my archives and these folks have some good things to keep track of.
Forum responses:
http://p083.ezboard.com/ftheswissriflesdotcommessageboardfrm18.showMessage?topicID=37.topic
zfk 31/55 excellent photographs:
http://www.swissrifles.com/sr/sniper/
Best.0 -
nononsense: I want to give you a very, very big "thanks" for taking the time and providing that info and answer. I guess I was just too lazy to go through the procedure to join that K-31 forum and ask the question myself. But I feel vindicated by the answer because I KNEW that type of mount would not work with my standard ejection angle K-31. I just knew it without even seeing or knowing about that K-31 model with the angled ejection port. Although I admit that it was love at first sight when I saw that scope mount mounted directly over the bore that I badly wanted it to be able to work on my standard K-31. In fact I almost placed an order even though it would have cost me $200.00. Thanks for saving me from a dumb mistake.
Now, how much would it cost to alter my standard K-31 to make it eject at an angle?
Surely not that much?
Quote "Somehow government decided that the Constitutional Bill of Rights has become the Bill of "Suggested" Rights and are to be rationed to the citizens as the power elite sees fit"0
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