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.38 S&W 200 GRAIN LEAD / ADAPTED FOR POLICE USE???

mrmike08075
i came across an odd box of revolver ammo in STORAGE CLOSET #3 (OLD, OBSOLETE, ODDBALL PISTOL AMMO) that i have not seen before. its WINCHESTER (red, white, and yellow tri-color box) .38 SMITH & WESSON SPECIALY ADAPTED FOR POLICE USE 200 GRAIN LEAD BULLET (ROUND NOSE) NICKEL PLATED SHELL K3867 T (lot#). the rounds are correct to the box, and sport the WRA 38 S&W headstamp.

i posted this box for sale here on GB and i have recieved 16 emails stating that there is no such load, and it must be .38 special and i have mis-identified it.

i am not familiar with this load, and i would hesitate to fire it through a IVER JOHNSON / H&R / US REVOLVER CO handgun even in EXCELLANT condition.

its one hell of a large bullet stuffed into that little case. must have a nice and sharp recoil and muzzle blast.

anyone familier with this load, and its "POLICE" history. anyone ever fired one??? best regards, mike.

What other dungeon is so dark as ones own heart, what jailer so inexorable as ones own mind.
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Comments

10 comments

Date Votes
  • 22WRF
    I would think the intended use would have been the early Smith 10's M&P
    that are 38 S&W


    I married a Moonshiners Daughter and I Love her Still
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  • Hangfire
    Mike- thats really a pretty common load. It was called the 38S&W Super Police. That was also the standard weight that the british military used in their 38S&W's[.380/200] The Britsh wanted a caliber close to the effectivness of the .455 only in a smaller round.Don't know if it actually matched it or not, but thats the story.

    Iagree about shooting them in an IJ. I'd stck to Smith or Colt!

    Love them Pre-64's!!!!-Bob
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  • mrmike08075
    i never made the mental connection to the .380-200 british load. i have seen that before, and we have some in stock. it makes more sense to be used in the above mentioned guns, but the thought of it fired through a "saturday night special" of dubious origin by a novice shooter who no`s not what he does worries me.

    its got to be the "top end" load for this chambering. best regards, mike.

    What other dungeon is so dark as ones own heart, what jailer so inexorable as ones own mind.
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  • RH2OMAN
    To me, it would be worth more having it as a collector's item or a conversation piece especially if the box is in good shape.

    I have never seen any in 25 years of gun shows.
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  • Hangfire
    quote:Originally posted by RH2OMAN
    To me, it would be worth more having it as a collector's item or a conversation piece especially if the box is in good shape.

    I have never seen any in 25 years of gun shows.




    We were just talking theoreticaly..Neither Mike nor I are about to shoot collectable ammo[8D]

    Love them Pre-64's!!!!-Bob
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  • Contender Man
    Please bear in mind that if this is 38-200 that it and 38 special do not interchange. The revolver has to be chambered for the round or things could get ugly real fast.

    Now if this is a standard diameter 38 round with a 200 grain bullet I've never seen 'em, but that's not to say that they weren't made, and the pressure/recoil must have been stiff. Not something that I would suggest be used in an older revolver, especially IJ's or H&R's, etc. ... even the older Smith's I'd have qualms about.


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    If you only have time to do two things so-so, or one thing well ... do the one thing!
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  • I.Shute
    That 200 grain load wasn't a particularly hot load.
    Muzzle velocity is only 630 fps and energy is 176 lbs/ft.
    It's a tad more than the 145 grain load, but only 26 lbs/ft.

    I came upon a small buck that I shot and had to use this round in an old S&W New Departure to help him die. We found all 5 slugs just under the skin in his neck.
    Penetrated only about 3/4 inch and never reached any bone.

    It was called the British Military round.
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  • mrmike08075
    "designed by smith and wesson for there hinged frame revolvers introduced about 1877, the .38 s&w is one of the most widley adopted american revolver cartridges; it has been used all over the world. england began using it as an official service cartridge prior to WWII and it is rather well-distributed through the british commonwealth....... WEBLEY & SCOTT MADE MANY OF THE BRITISH SERVICE ARMS. THE BRITISH CALLED IT THE .380/200......THE BRITISH FIGURED OUT THAT THE SHOCKING POWER OF THIS CARTRIDGE WITH A 200 GRAIN BULLET WAS ABOUT THE SAME AS THIER OLDER .455 MILITARY CARTRIDGE. IN ACTUAL COMBAT THIS PROVED CORRECT, THUS PERMITTED THE USE OF LIGHTER WEAPONS......"

    200 GR ROUND NOSE LEAD / FL POWDER / 630 MV / 176 MV / 50 YDS MRT=2.6"

    you have confused this cartridge / chambering with the .380 revolver or the .38 S&W SPECIAL wich will not interchange. the above round is the same... .380/200=.38 S&W.

    this is a collectible item. while i shoot every gun i own, even the oddball, obsolete ones on occasion, i would not expend these rounds. also, i am 100 % certain that the .38 S&W and the .380/200 BRITISH are the same round, and interchange. best regards, mike.



    What other dungeon is so dark as ones own heart, what jailer so inexorable as ones own mind.
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  • I.Shute
    mrmike-
    You and I are talking about the same cartridge.
    Collectible? Yea, I guess, but some of the odd-ball ammo sellers at shows still have some, have seen it for $25 - $30 a box. It's labled 38 Super Police.
    That's too high to buy and shoot when you can get the 38 S&W for $14 and I can't really see any difference in the two.
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  • oldammo
    Hi, Is this the same Ammo ? This is a GunBroker item on now.
    winchester .38 S&W nickel plate 200 gr lead old Item # 17112899



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