5.56 vs .223 accuracy?
Here in a previous post I made, someone responded to an ar15 question I had and said that if you wanted an ar15 to be a tackdriver to get it chambered in .223 not 5.56. I understand how the throat is larger in the 5.56 chamber thus making .223 bullets shot in it less accurate, but if you shoot 5.56 cal bullets in the 5.56 chamber is it still less accurate than a .223 in a .223?
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So many variables here. Weight of bullet, overall length, chamber sizing, leade, turns ratio ... all are factors and without mucho data to work with ... all that results are words on a screen.
Reply or repost with the specifics of what you have and what your results are with ammo fired todate, and the particulars of that ammo. Then maybe one of us can give you some answers that fit your situation.
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i may be wrong but i thought that 5.56 x 45 mm and .223 cal were the names for the same cartridge , one is in millimeters and the other is in inches but the same bullet accuracy comes into play with the different bullet weights 0 -
5.56 is in millimeters.
.223 is in inches.
Same cartridge.
"If they won't give us good terms, come back and we'll fight it out."
-- Gen. James Longstreet0 -
They are not the same.
http://www.winchester.com/lawenforcement/news/newsview.aspx?storyid=11
Law Enforcement News and Press Releases Details
News and Press Releases
.223 Rem VS 5.56mm
Paul Nowak
5/4/2001
.223 Rem VS 5.56mm
There are a lot of questions about these two cartridges. Many people think they are identical - merely different designations for commercial and military. The truth is that, although somewhat similar, they are not the same and you should know the differences before buying either cartridge.
The cartridge casings for both calibers have basically the same length and exterior dimensions.
The 5.56 round, loaded to Military Specification, typically has higher velocity and chamber pressure than the .223 Rem.
The 5.56 cartridge case may have thicker walls, and a thicker head, for extra strength. This better contains the higher chamber pressure. However, a thicker case reduces powder capacity, which is of concern to the reloader.
The 5.56mm and .223 Rem chambers are nearly identical. The difference is in the "Leade". Leade is defined as the portion of the barrel directly in front of the chamber where the rifling has been conically removed to allow room for the seated bullet. It is also more commonly known as the throat. Leade in a .223 Rem chamber is usually .085". In a 5.56mm chamber the leade is typically .162", or almost twice as much as in the 223 Rem chamber.
You can fire .223 Rem cartridges in 5.56mm chambers with this longer leade, but you will generally have a slight loss in accuracy and velocity over firing the .223 round in the chamber with the shorter leade it was designed for.
Problems may occur when firing the higher-pressure 5.56mm cartridge in a .223 chamber with its much shorter leade. It is generally known that shortening the leade can dramatically increase chamber pressure. In some cases, this higher pressure could result in primer pocket gas leaks, blown cartridge case heads and gun functioning issues.
The 5.56mm military cartridge fired in a .223 Rem chamber is considered by SAAMI (Small Arm and Ammunition Manufacturers Institute) to be an unsafe ammunition combination.
Before buying either of these two types of ammunition, always check your gun to find what caliber it is chambered for, then buy the appropriate ammunition. Most 5.56mm rounds made have full metal jacket bullets. Performance bullets - soft points, hollow points, Ballistic Silvertips, etc. - are loaded in .223 Rem cartridges. Firing a .223 Rem cartridge in a 5.56mm-chambered gun is safe and merely gives you slightly reduced velocity and accuracy. However we do not recommend, nor does SAAMI recommend, firing a 5.56mm cartridge in a gun chambered for the .223 Rem as the shorter leade can cause pressure-related problems.
Winchester Law Enforcement Ammunition East Alton Illinois
Guncontrol-The ability to hit what your aiming at.0 -
Man that is some eye-opening info. For years the "company" mail driver has walked past my desk and we often speak a few minutes about guns. I got to admit that even though he is a nice guy, I didn't think he scored very high on the intelligence scale. But for years because of different discussions we have had he has always mentioned that .223 and 5.56x45 ammo are not the same. I just laughed to myself and thought he couldn't tell the difference from inches measurments from the metric system. Boy, was I wrong and I told him I owed him an apology for think that all these years. Ya learn something new every day if you pay attention.
Quote "When guns were invented everything changed. For the first time in the history of the world a frail woman had a chance to sucessfully defend herself and home. My dream is that one of the anti-gun nuts will need a gun for defense and be unable to have one because of their own actions."0 -
reb8600 is right.Every thing he stated is a legitimate concern and has happened to me and other friends when I was younger.--It just depends on the firearm you are shooting and the ammo you bought.Military ammo or NATO ammo is loaded in different plants all over the world and although is supposed to be loaded to the same general spec.s it can vary quite a bit.I have a friend right now that bought two cases of military ammo (about 1600 rounds)that will blow the primers out in two different bolt action rifles that he owns.It was most likely loaded to shoot in automatic weapons.--As far as loading military brass yourself,it's no problem because you lighten your powder charges accordingly to make up for the differences in brass thickness.-- I have shot surplus ammo in commercial guns with no problems at all, but it really just depends on the lot of ammo you got,where it was made, and how tight the throat is on the particular gun you are using...........[8D] 0 -
I agree.[:D]quote:Originally posted by SaxonPig
All military cases are thicker, this is not unique to the 5.56. Yet the .308 (7.62X51) and .30-06 shooters use mil-spec ammo without complaint. Why should the 5.56 be different?
How many millions of military surplus 5.56s have been shot through sporting rifles in .223? I have fired a couple thousand, myself. I have never heard of anyone having any problem except that sometimes the bolt can be a tad hard to close because, as I said earlier, the mil-spec cases have the shoulder set just slightly forward to prevent crushing when slammed through a full-auto gun. I not believe the mil-spec ammo is loaded to significantly higher pressure than commercial ammo. I have not checked into this, but I would be very surprised if there was a real difference.
The opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not reflect the views of any third party or the policy of any state agency.0 -
quote:Originally posted by SaxonPig
All military cases are thicker, this is not unique to the 5.56. Yet the .308 (7.62X51) and .30-06 shooters use mil-spec ammo without complaint. Why should the 5.56 be different?
How many millions of military surplus 5.56s have been shot through sporting rifles in .223? I have fired a couple thousand, myself. I have never heard of anyone having any problem except that sometimes the bolt can be a tad hard to close because, as I said earlier, the mil-spec cases have the shoulder set just slightly forward to prevent crushing when slammed through a full-auto gun. I not believe the mil-spec ammo is loaded to significantly higher pressure than commercial ammo. I have not checked into this, but I would be very surprised if there was a real difference.
The opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not reflect the views of any third party or the policy of any state agency.0 -
"All military cases are thicker, this is not unique to the 5.56. Yet the .308 (7.62X51) and .30-06 shooters use mil-spec ammo without complaint. Why should the 5.56 be different?"
This is because, for some strange reason, civilian .308 and .30-06 (and even .30-40) are commonly loaded to higher pressures than their military equivalent.
It could be because the civilian .30 cartridges are commonly used with heavier bullets for hunting.....but I don't know for sure.0 -
How many military bolt action 223s have you seen issued to the military?-- Commercial guns are built different than military weapons.They have shorter throats and the military ammo is sometimes loaded to higher pressure to cycle automatic weapon actions.NATO is not concerned with SAAMI loading specs as are commercial companies,and rifles built by Ruger,winchester,remington,etc are not chambered to shoot military ammo.Sometimes they are ok, but not always,depending on the particular gun...........[8D] ---- P.S = Your comment that they may dump ammo loaded to hot onto the commercial market supports the fact that it is not always safe.Ever hear of a recall on bad surplus ammo? I haven't. 0
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