gun bluing
Is there any alternative water displacing oil when hot bluing besides Brownells. Any info is appreciated
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i used the brush on blueing and i'm not happy with the results. I wonderwhat is used proffessionally and how it is done.
respect for the rights of others is peace (Benito Juarez)0 -
I've never done anything like that but I cant imagine a brush doing a very good job. What about something like those stain sponges? Those seem to give a more even coat than a brush.
Shane
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Key to using cold blue is to have a CLEAN surface. Then it helps to warm the metal up with a hair dryer. I have had good luck using a New toothbrush and VAN'S gun blue. Works better than the Birchwood stuff.
"Shoot Straight and Shoot often."0 -
i'm not wonderering about a different method of application but a different method in doing so.
i remember a potassiu nitrate or nitride ? water solution that has to be heated. but i like to know the specifics
respect for the rights of others is peace (Benito Juarez)0 -
Hello go to the BROWNELL'S web site they sell supplies and directions for all types of Blueing 0 -
Or you can get a copy of Dunlap's "Gunsmithing" and read the entire chapter devoted to metal coloring. For all intents and purposes, unless you plan on doing several guns and have a safe place to do it, the cost of equipment and material far exceeds the cost of paying a professional to do it. Several place advertise in the "Gun List" at pretty reasonable rates if you disassemble. prepare the metal and reassemble the gun yourself.
Generally speaking, you, as an individual, can send rifle or shotgun via USPS to a licensed dealer for custom work, repair, etc, legally, and have it returned to you directly. Handguns have to go via the lying, theives at ups or your dealer can send USPS. Unfortunately, from a dollar point of view, it's a wash. The upside to having your dealer send it, is you don't have the IDIOTS at ups to deal with.
"What you do ultimately means nothing, and you could be replaced tomorrow by the first passing cretin." Corinne Maier0 -
found this!
To do nitrate blueing, you'll need a sturdy steel pan or tank and a
Burner capable of heating the mass to the required 600-800 deg F.
Brownell's sells a wide variety of sturdy welded steel trays and
tanks. I welded short legs to mine and applied a layer of castable
refractory to the sides in order to minimize heat loss and speed
the initial melt. I use an old burner from a gas furance. A digital
pyrometer (Omega Engineering has 'em for < $100) measures the
temperature.
Chemically clean steel is a must. I first dip a part in hot concentrated
sodium hydroxide (lye) to saponify and remove any oil residue. After
a water wash, a short dip in hot (not boiling) hydrochloric acid
removes any inorganic surface contamination and rust. A second rinse
with hot distilled water followed by drying with a hot air blower
finishes the prep. This must be done fairly rapidly to prevent
re-oxidization. If you can't IMMEDIATELY wash, dry and blue a part,
store the cleaned part in a zip-lock bag purged with argon or nitrogen.
After blueing, let the excess saltpeter drip off, allow the part to
cool and then wash with warm water to remove the residue. Immediately
apply a fine oil film.
One small caution: Hot saltpeter will vigorously react with organic
materials and will start fires. After all, it is an oxidizer. Molten
saltpeter dripped on grass or paper will ignite it and the resulting
fire burns vigorously.
respect for the rights of others is peace (Benito Juarez)0 -
I've worked with cold blue and have gotten mixed results. I was "whinning" to an old gunsmith and he told me if I got bad results then I didn't get the part clean enough! He indicated that you have to boil the part in lye water to remove ALL oils/grease, then you CAN'T touch the part with your bare hands! He suggested tongs, then apply bluing with swab. Seems to work very well on my second blue job! Todate I have never done a whole gun ...just parts.
Worth a try!!? Good Luck! ...Mark
"FEAR the Goverment, that fears your ARMS"0 -
quote:Originally posted by brecht
found this!
To do nitrate blueing, you'll need a sturdy steel pan or tank and a
Burner capable of heating the mass to the required 600-800 deg F.
Brownell's sells a wide variety of sturdy welded steel trays and
tanks. I welded short legs to mine and applied a layer of castable
refractory to the sides in order to minimize heat loss and speed
the initial melt. I use an old burner from a gas furance. A digital
pyrometer (Omega Engineering has 'em for < $100) measures the
temperature.
Chemically clean steel is a must. I first dip a part in hot concentrated sodium hydroxide (lye) to saponify and remove any oil residue. After a water wash, a short dip in hot (not boiling) hydrochloric acid removes any inorganic surface contamination and rust. A second rinse with hot distilled water followed by drying with a hot air blower finishes the prep. This must be done fairly rapidly to prevent re-oxidization. If you can't IMMEDIATELY wash, dry and blue a part, store the cleaned part in a zip-lock bag purged with argon or nitrogen.
After blueing, let the excess saltpeter drip off, allow the part to
cool and then wash with warm water to remove the residue. Immediately
apply a fine oil film.
One small caution: Hot saltpeter will vigorously react with organic
materials and will start fires. After all, it is an oxidizer. Molten
saltpeter dripped on grass or paper will ignite it and the resulting
fire burns vigorously.
respect for the rights of others is peace (Benito Juarez)
A few points, 600-800 deg F is four times the temperature of boiling water. . .(ie OUCH!).
Lye (aka drain cleaner, Sodium hydroxide, etc) will dissolve your skin or other parts of your body you would prefer to remain intact.
Concentrated hydrochloric acid is no picnic either!
Personally, I wouldn't even try this at home. Just not worth it.0 -
Modern bluing solutions like those sold by Brownells operate in the 290-305 % temperature range, and it is boiling! 0 -
brecht,
The two most common metal finishes being used commercially currently are hot caustic bluing and slow rust blue.
No matter what some folks will say, hot caustic bluing is not for the amateur to use at home. The boiling salts will cause extreme heat and chemical burns when accidentally spashed on skin. There are also EPA restrictions as to where this can take place and under what circumstances. It involves tanks, gas burners and chemistry that is dangerous unless you have sufficient training in the mixing, using and storage. It is also more suited to bulk processing on a daily basis and not small amounts of parts infrequently.
HOT CAUSTIC BLUING
This requires 4 tanks, 3 with gas.
1) Prep metal.
2) Degrease metal in commercial degreaser. (boiling)
3) Immerse in boiling caustic lye solution. (salts) (280 - 310 degrees)
4) Lift, drain, and rinse in tank of cold running water also called shocking.
5) Return to bluing tank.
6) Shock (rinse) again checking for depth of color. Repeat as needed.
7) Continue rinsing until cool.
8) Tranfer to a hot neutralizer tank where the salts are obviously neutralized so that they don't bleed out or 'bloom' after you've finished. It shows up as a white powder if not completely neutralized.
9) Transfer to a cold rinsing tank and allow parts to rinse thoroughly and cool down.
10) Coat thoroughly with WD-40 to eliminate any water that might carry over then wipe down and coat with a high quality oil and allow to sit overnight if possible.
SLOW RUST BLUE
This is a reasonably priced process that can be accomplished at home with a minimum of equipment and hassle. Bownells carries two different slow rust products in bottles that can be used to apply to prepared metal surfaces. You also need a humidity cabinet and a buffing set up with wire wheels for the carding off process. Boiling off can be done on the stove for small parts but a tank will be required for boiling barrels and such.
See www.winrest.com scroll down to topic "step-by-step instruction..."
There is a lot of information on the 'net that you can access and read to better understand these and other metal finishing processes. Brownells, even as a commercial supplier, can be a good source of information.0
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