Self Defense AR-15 Pistol
Hi, I have been obsessing over the idea of having an AR-15 pistol chambered in the 223 round for self-defense purposes. However, I hear multitudes of people telling me that using the 223 round out of an 8 inch barrel is ineffective for self-defense purposes. The bullet will not fragment and simply overpenetrate; acting like an ice pick. I then did my research. I noticed that many SWAT guys are opting for the HK53 over and above the MP5. They like the higher 223 round over the 9mm. The HK53 however only has an 8.5 inch barrel. If SWAT guys are opting for this, how can the AR-15 pistol be ineffective for self-defense???? I then realized that for the AR-15 pistol to be effective, it has to have the right ammo. This is where I would like some help from the EXPERTS! I was wondering what SPECIFIC ammo would work best for the AR-15 pistol to be used for self-defense purposes??? Any ideas??? Any help would be GREATLY APPRECIATED!!!
Thanks!
Thanks!
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If you've ever shot an AR pistol you'd know immediately why you wouldn't want to shoot one inside your house. The blast and overpenetration are going to cause problems. The reliability is less than optimal for a self-defense piece too.
Love them Beavers
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First, AR-15 is a trademark of Colt Industries. They never made a pistol in .223. I'm guessing the reason that they never did is because such a weapon is good for nothing, with the possible exceptions of impressing your buddies with the fact that you are really cool.
As for AR-type clones, yes, there are a couple of pistols made. Notice how many PD's & SWAT teams use them: NONE. Like Kingjoey says, muzzle blast is a problem. Also, the lack of a shoulder stock makes them impossible to aim. In addition, you won't be able to find a holster for it, &, even if you could, it would make a large bulge in your suit coat.
You might want to read what the gun magazines are testing. It seems that just about every month some manufacturer comes out with a new gun that is well suited for self defense.
Neal0 -
Stick with a Shotgun for your house and a 4" .357 Magnum or .38 Special revolver.Leave the rifle rounds out of the picture. 0 -
My AR pistol is a 9mm, holds 72 rounds in the mag and goes full auto... 0 -
the reason why some swat teams having a 223 is thet it penetrates bullet proof vests. The normal guy you'll encounter is less likely to wear protective armor like we have seen ith the hollywood shootout. So a 9mm or 45 will do just fine.
another thing is that the ar 15 with a short barrel has usually problens with feeding ammo due to the direct gas system of the ar. i tried one and every 3rd round jammed.
it needs a longer barrel in order to get reliable function.
you don't want a jammed gun is a self defense situation.
That is the reason you don't see them in swat teams.
respect for the rights of others is peace (Benito Juarez)0 -
I have an ar15 pistol, bushmaster 7.5inch. It has a scope on it, because I use it for deer hunting. I tell you what..that winchester varmint ammo, that they sell at Walmart in 45grain, will not ice pick anything. It will blow a hole the size of a baseball in someone. I know, because I shot a deer at 25yards. As for being good for nothing. Mine has never jammed, because it is a factory upper. ANd it will group 2inch or less at 100 yards, so it is not a spray gun..
These little guns are accurate, Mine does not have a stock on it, and it is stamped pistol, however; ask anyone who has a registered SBR short barrel rifle, with a stock on the gun, you can shoot sub 1 inch groups. I wouldnt sell mine for anything. Just be sure that you get the correct spring. You need a the one made for pistols, but the spring for the CAR will work as well, paired up with the CAR buffer..0 -
quote:Originally posted by TED GAR
I have an ar15 pistol, bushmaster 7.5inch. It has a scope on it, because I use it for deer hunting. I tell you what..that winchester varmint ammo, that they sell at Walmart in 45grain, will not ice pick anything. It will blow a hole the size of a baseball in someone. I know, because I shot a deer at 25yards. As for being good for nothing. Mine has never jammed, because it is a factory upper. ANd it will group 2inch or less at 100 yards, so it is not a spray gun..
These little guns are accurate, Mine does not have a stock on it, and it is stamped pistol, however; ask anyone who has a registered SBR short barrel rifle, with a stock on the gun, you can shoot sub 1 inch groups. I wouldnt sell mine for anything. Just be sure that you get the correct spring. You need a the one made for pistols, but the spring for the CAR will work as well, paired up with the CAR buffer..
The reason for jamming on short barrel ar15's is because the gas tube is so short. You need the pistol buffer and spring, the CAR spring and buffer will suffice. A standard buffer and spring WILL JAM!0 -
As for the gas system, mine is as long as a full length bbl. You need to get the "pig tail" gas tube. Mine makes I belive 4 wraps around the bbl keeping the length long. I also have no buffer or spring to worry about. Mine is very reliable.
Just remember there are no stupid questions, just stupid people asking questions.
John0 -
For the 55 gr FMJ .223 to do its' special thing, it needs a minimum of 2650 fps. The bullet tumbles, breaks in two giving two very destructive wound channels. A 16" barrel will do it below 125 yards. The M4 that looks so cool with its' 14" barrel has been giving bad battle reports since Mogodeshu. Reports give it about 2650 fps at the muzzle.
Lightening the bullet to 40 or 45 grains and giving it a hollow point is changing the game.
I'd be interested in velocity data out of 8 1/2" barrels.0 -
this might help. http://www.accuratereloading.com/223sb.html
http://www.bobtuley.com/terminal.htm
Just some good reading..0 -
I'm with Kingjoey and Nmeyers.
Personally, I don't think the words "AR-15 type pistol" and "self defense" should be used together in the same sentence.
Too much noise, weight, bulk. Slow to point with one hand, and hard to aim.
Other than a more powerful round with a marked tendency to overpenetrate indoors, what advantages does this give you over say. . .a Glock with a long stick mag?0
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