Building a Long Range Rifle Platform
I have decided to start building a long range platform weapon. I have settled on the Remington 700 in .308 as a base unless someone can convince me otherwise. In my search to price out components for the system (heavy barrel, "tactical" stock, scope, etc) i have found it hard to find such items, and when i do i dont know if they will all fit together. I have googled such searches as ".308 heavy barrel" and "aftermarket tactical stock" but rarely come upon sites selling such products. Where do I go to find these items and how do i know what will work best? I have proven my prowess with the .22 and air rifles, and want to step up in competition level. I am rather new to the centerfire league so any and all input is appreciated. I have used this forum for research in other purchases and respect those who post here, so for that, thank you.
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This should get you started! Welcome to the GB forums.
Barrelmakers links:
http://benchrest.com/inlink/index.php?sid=672730821&t=sub_pages&cat=5&num_results=100
http://www.rockcreekbarrels.com/
Look up Schneider Barrels, I don't have the info handy.
http://www.lothar-walther.com/main.htm
Stocks:
http://mcmfamily.com/
http://www.rimrockstocks.com/
http://www.brunoshooters.com/
HS Precision
Bell & Carlson
Robertson Composites
Triggers:
Shilen
Rifle Basix
Kepplinger
Jewell
General Parts:
www.brownells.com
Competition Sites:
www.benchrest.com
www.long-range.com
Folks that use a lot of .308 Win:
www.snipershide.com
www.snipercountry.com0 -
McMillan Rifle Stocks http://www.mcmfamily.com/
0311 semper fi0 -
Thank you. How can I know if the barrel i choose will fit the stock I choose and accept the Rem 700 action/reciever. Sorry if these are n00b questions i dont really know much on this subject yet. Thank you for your time. 0 -
The stocks will be specified as "inletted" for a certain action and barrel channel size. You will need to know the barrel contour # from the manufacturer you purchase the blank from. A good gunsmith can conform the barrel channel if need be.
My favorite stocks are mcmillan and HS precision with 1 rimrock (borden) being very impressive thus far.
As far as any advice,..DO NOT SKIMP on rings and bases and glass. Use strong mounts and high end glass.
Now ifin you wish to get into 600 and 1000yd benchrest,..you'll be needing a whole lot more than the rifle itself, so be forewarned you will spend multitudes more money than you originally thought possible.[:0] If you were thinking more like varmint class matches at 100-200yds,..then I would go far under the 308 caliber to something in the 6PPC area. HTH
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
Fuddmann,
I'd look into the 6.5-284 as a long range caliber. There are much better balistics with this caliber as opposed to the .308 line-up of bullets. The only bullet in .308 with a really oustanding BC is the 240 gr(.711). Most of the 6.5's start around .500 in the light middleweights and go up to the mid .6's.
As far as components, what evrybody else says...lot of good sites there. -good luck
We have the second amendment so that all the rest are secure....UNK>0 -
fuddmann,
I've been thinking about this a bit and I wonder if you might consider the following as a suggestion to get you started.
Take a look around GunBroker Auction and some of the other sites and see if you can find a used rifle in really good shape that could get you going. It seems to me that rather than spending a lot of time trying to learn all of the verbage and concepts that surrounds this sport, that it might be easier and bunch more fun to find a used (or new) rifle and get busy learning to shoot and not have to waste time learning what to order to get one built. Your learning curve would be shortened dramatically by buying an existing rifle rather than building a new one. It will also give you a great deal of insight as to what works for you rather than what some else wants to build for you. Then when you get your order together, it will be what you want and feel comfortable using.
Remington has the VSF and VLS in .308 Win., the difference being the laminated as opposed to the synthetic stock. But you can take a look at used rifles for a PSS or a similar model. Shop smart and look for the best deal. Don't forget to include money for a top quality scope, rings and base like JustC pointed out.
A lot of the questions that you have will become more clear once you see the rifle and how it's put together. Plus, when you start shooting, you'll become more involved with other shooters that can help with your questions on the spot. This will really shorten up the time it takes to get going.
Plan on allowing for reloading the .308 Win. also. You can start by shooting Federal Gold Medal Match and maybe Black Hills Match ammunition but that will get expensive real quick. You will gain more experience from learning how to reload than depending on a supplier for your loaded ammunition. Besides, it saves you money that you can use to put back into your shooting.
Just a couple of thoughts for your consideration.
Best.0 -
Thank you all for your input. I appreciate all of it. 0 -
Thanks everyone for your input. I have a few more questions.
1) After looking around online and pricing things out and talking to a buddy of mine, I found this: http://www.savagearms.com/10fple2a.htm
Since this is what I is close to what I want to build, for cheaper than I could build on my own, does anyone know if civilian Joes can buy this, or only LEOs?
2) I went to my local sporting goods store and shot the bull a while with the guys there and looked at some scopes. What is the honest difference between the $500 scope and the $60 scope? They really looked the same to me. How much is just paying for the name brand? Can anyone recommend a decent scope for less than $200?
I really appreciate all the help from everyone, thank you.0 -
One more thing I forgot: What size bipod is best for prone shooting? I see models in the 6"-9", 9"-13" range and higher. Thanks. 0 -
I am going to agree with nononsense (as usuall) on his newest suggestion. I found that it took me a good 5-6yrs of fairly frequent shooting to gain that little "edge" or "style" that allows you to weld up to the rifle just right, break the trigger just right, breath correctly, etc. You will in this time probably burn your match grade barrel out, just as you are getting into your "groove". That can provide tons of frustration as you start to then lose accuracy and can't figure out why. From the beginners standpoint,..his suggestion of a good heavy barreled rem700 in a solid stock will provide you that "TRIGGER TIME" that is so necessary to consistency, and will come cheaper as you get closer to the top of the curve.
As far as scopes,..there is much to learn. Glass quality is very high in importance as are both coating quality, and adjustment integrity. Reticles and power ranges and click values etc are all application specific,..but glass/coatings/toughness are the most important things a scope MUST have to truley extract the potential of the rig at long range. A slight fluctuation in the scope at 100yds is horrendous at 500yds. You have to have GREAT optics and rock solid mounts to stay consistent and eliminate that variable as a cause of a flyer in your groups.
Your $500 dollar scope will most likely be "fully multi coated" on every air to glass surface where your $60 scope will have some very inexpensive grade of glass containing contaminants such as lead etc and poor coatings. The purer the glass grade and the higher quality and color spectrum of the coatings the better the picture and ability to remove paralax and resolve mirage. Second,..the erector tube and the springs and gears which control it's movement and stability inside the main tube will far stronger in the higher end scopes. Plastic gears are the common practice in cheap scopes, which one can easily deduce their fallacy. The higher end scopes will use stronger springs, and metal gears which will not wear as quickly and are machined to tighter tollerances that will equate to far more precise and repeatable adjustments.
You would have to run the paces with one of these
Nightforce NXS
Leupold MK IV M1
IOR Valdada
Schmidt and Bender
Swarovski
US Optics
Burris black diamond
Zeiss Diavari series
as a great learning tool with superb performance in the $700 range (cheaper price than most) I would look hard at the new Burris Tactical scopes or a used Leupold LR MK IV in 6.5-20x50 or 8.5-25x50.
Any of these or the hgiher end models will outlast 10 barrels over your shooting career with no BS warranties.
In the $200 range,..you are asking a lot to go for a long range scope. You will have to look for a deal on a good used scope with a good warranty to get the most from your money. Watch the GB scope auctions and see what you can do. If you must spend that little, then a good higher power Burris FF II or even Leupold vari-x II or a good Weaver T series or V series in 4-14 or 6-20 would be the best route.
HTH
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
fuddmann,
The easy question first. I use both a 6" to 9" as well as a 9"-12 or 13" bipod. The choice comes down to the terrain of the firing line, course of shooting or the hunting landscape. How high are the weeds and is there a bunch of rocks and downed wood. Lie down on the floor with a rifle and using a yardstick, measure what will work for you.
As to the Savage, yes you should be able to get one even if it says 'LE' or something of the sort. Usually this is a marketing ploy that works quite well by enticing folks into believing that their rifle is made for 'law enforcement'. The term 'tactical' is also very popular and quite a sales term these days. Here is some contact information for a man that can get good prices on Savage gear:
Northland Shooters Supply
P. O. Box 1434
Maple Grove, MN 55311
E-mail - briggs.j-b@comcast.net
Ph. - (763) 420-7163
Fx. - (763) 420-7610
Jim's a good guy, give him a call and explain what it is that you are trying to do.
Also bear in mind that this particular stock weighs about 5 lbs. without anything on or in it. That's fairly heavy in combination with the barreled action at about 11 lbs. according to Savage. I think that's great for long range shooting from a bipod but it will require some effort to carry any distance.
Scopes are always a trauma for shooters when it comes to buying a new one. We all get excited about buying the rifle but we should plan to spend nearly as much if not more for the glass that goes on top of that new rifle. I'm still in the process of replacing all of my Leupold scopes with NightForce scopes and THAT'S a trauma! But I see better with the NightForce scopes so that's what I'm going with as I get the money available.
Most scopes under $200.00 aren't worth the effort of putting them on the rifle. Spend a lot of your time behind a poor quality scope trying to shoot with precision and comfort and you will see exactly what I'm talking about. There is no comparison between a $200.00 scope and a $500.00 to $700.00 scope. Sure some of the manufacturers use their name instead of higher quality but that's true in any industry. You need to learn how to discriminate between the name and the real quality.
Now that I've written that, I'll go back on it and say that the lowest that I would go would be about $350.00 for a Weaver, Nikon or Burris. You will outgrow these but they will get you started without putting you into a real deep hole financially.
The better scopes use better glass, higher quality gears, more and better coatings in a completely sealed tube that won't fog. Maybe most of us can't tell the difference between a $1000.00 scope and a $2000.00 scope but I sure can see a difference between those that cost $200.00 and those costing $700.00 or more. Get the best scope you can afford or wait a bit a save a little more to get the one you need.
Best.0
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