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450 Marlin Topper ? !

gotstolefrom
A very good friend of mine bought one of the new HR/Topper centerfire break barrel guns in 45/70 (yea..I thought so too).

Anyway, he is a big beefy guy and a 45/70 nut, and usually is pretty reasonable.
He has a Ruger in 45/70 that he loads a bit hotter, not quite 450 Marlin hot, but in between. Although some modern guns can handle more pressure than the original 45/70 was made with, I am not sure that the 'H&R/Topper' is up to the task. For my old bones, it is already too much for that light gun.
Any Help Here ?
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Comments

6 comments

Date Votes
  • Bill Costik
    What exactly are you asking here?
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  • GaBob
    I would not load .450 Marlin loads in 45-70 brass in any gun. The brass itself is not strong enough. That is the reason they developed the .450 to begin with. The Topper would probably handle the .450 but the shooter would take a pounding

    Keep Your Powder Dry
    NRA Life Member
    The only criminal class that is native to the United States is congress.
    MARK TWAIN
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  • gotstolefrom
    Thanks GaBob....Much appreciated....a done deal.
    I knew that little rifle would kick the crap outta me, but Glen is a big beefy guy. I just wanted to know if the Topper bbl could handle that stress. My vote is still don't do it.

    While I am here, educate me. I am scratching my head about the 'weak brass' mention. (I'm assuming you are not talking about work hardening) I've been loading for 30 years and the only 'weak brass' problems I've had can be counted on one hand. I had some isolated (45 LC) rims tear, but the rims were thinner than other brass I had seen. Maybe a justified split or two, but that is about it.

    I am of the thought that the bbl/rcvr carry the pressure, and all the brass has to do is swell to seal, and recover (somewhat) so that it can be extracted. How else is the brass supposed to handle the amount of pressure that is generated ?
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  • iluvguns
    NEF offers a 450 Marlin barrel through their exchange program. Have your buddy send in his receiver and have that barrel fitted to it. Then he can safely shoot 450!

    Here is the link to the page.

    http://www.hr1871.com/barrelAcc/index.htm
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  • GaBob
    Gotstolefrom
    As I understand it, the brass stretches(expamds) slightly with each shot. Even though it is contained in the chamber it expands and then contracts after each shot. During expansion it seizes to chamber walls. It then contracts which allows extraction. This expansion also has the benefit of lowering the pressure of the case head against the bolt face since the case is seized onto the chamber walls. The thinner brass can sometimes crack at the junction of the web and thinner brass causing a head separation,
    This is why a .45 Colt is not recommended for .44 Magnum type loads. I have seen head separations in .38 specials that were loaded too hot.
    I have not been able to locate the literature that gave this as the rational for developing the .450 Marlin but it was published about the time of the release of the .450.

    Keep Your Powder Dry
    NRA Life Member
    The only criminal class that is native to the United States is congress.
    MARK TWAIN
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  • gotstolefrom
    We are on the same page. I am aware of the type of brass failure you are referring to, I just did not put it together when I read your reply.
    Thanks again.


    If we do not hang together,
    We will most certainly hang separately.
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