Sten kits
I have done searchs here and have not found a clear answer yet. Are the kits (avail from sportsmansguide and here on GB) full auto or are they just display kits rendered inoperable by welding and such? To me, if the kits ARE full auto, it would seem to be a bad idea. The reason is, you dont need ffl for the kit or reciever tube so any felon could get one and it would be an mg.
Anybody comes through that door, you put two in the chest and one in the head!
Anybody comes through that door, you put two in the chest and one in the head!
0
-
quote:Originally posted by hksrule
I have done searchs here and have not found a clear answer yet. Are the kits (avail from sportsmansguide and here on GB) full auto or are they just display kits rendered inoperable by welding and such? To me, if the kits ARE full auto, it would seem to be a bad idea. The reason is, you dont need ffl for the kit or reciever tube so any felon could get one and it would be an mg.
Anybody comes through that door, you put two in the chest and one in the head!
If these were full auto ready kits, just owning one would be a felony, since any collection of parts capable of being assembled into a full auto gun is considered legally the same as a completed full auto gun.
No way would sportsmansguide sell a full auto kit! So I strongly doubt it.
Now realistically speaking, when was the last time you've heard of a crime being committed with ANY gun built from a kit? (Let alone a full auto gun or something like a Sten gun).
What's the point? Compared to ubiquitous pistols, these guns are hard to conceal, not trivial to build or test, and will double your jailtime if you are caught with a full auto version. Unless you are leading a guerilla army or trying a drive by shooting, I dont see why youd even want one if you were a criminal!0 -
Those "parts kits" are just that, a kit. There is no reciever. The recievers on these kits have been cut and a large section removed.
These kits are intended to be used for making a non-gun or display piece. If a person plans to make another shootable Sten, they had better get the required govt paperwork before starting on the project.
The kit itself, without a reciever, is legal to own
Joe
"Never let school interfere with your education"0 -
quote:Originally posted by Laredo Lefty
Those "parts kits" are just that, a kit. There is no reciever. The recievers on these kits have been cut and a large section removed.
These kits are intended to be used for making a non-gun or display piece. If a person plans to make another shootable Sten, they had better get the required govt paperwork before starting on the project.
The kit itself, without a reciever, is legal to own
Joe
"Never let school interfere with your education"
DING DING DING DING...
We have a winner.0 -
These kits contain either a "torch cut" receiver approved by the BATF or no receiver at all. These kits appear for many different types of full autos including, Thompsons, Stens, 1919A4's, Uzi's, etc.
As has been aptly stated, these kits are for display guns or non-guns. The kits are also used as a source of replacement parts for persons who lawfully possess a full auto device. The barrels, springs, stocks, etc. supplied with the kit can be used to replace worn out or broken parts on these Class III weapons if you are fortunate to legally own one of them. No FFL is usually required to buy the kit.
Regards,
Heavyiron
"If I don't see you nomore on this world, I'll meet you on the next one, and don't be late!" - Jimi Hendrix0 -
Just one or two points of clarification/correction and to give some other info.
The kits are full auto, with cut receiver, as stated. It is not illegal to own a full auto parts kit as long as the "receiver" is not there. The problem with the Sten receivers is, they are so simple, owning a parts kit and the right size muffler pipe can get you in trouble because it would be so close to being complete at that point. I don't think you could even legally own a parts kit and a receiver template for one, they are so simple. But a person can make a legal semi-auto out of one, which will require making or buying a receiver tube that has different internal inside diameter than the full auto versions. The legal semi-auto versions have also been re-designed to fire from a closed bolt, rather than the open bolt.
In the Federal level, if you start with an "80% complete" semi-auto receiver, there is NO REQUIREMENT to have it registered, or put serial numbers on it, or tell anyone you have it, provided that it is built for personal use and will not be sold. State and city laws may force it, but there is no Federal law that prohibits a person from building their own firearm "from scratch" using a partially complete receiver. There would be no paperwork involved unless the completed gun was sold.
There are a couple of sites that have, or are developing, the necessary parts, and partially complete receivers, to build legal semi-auto Stens. The two I know of are:
http://semiautosten.com/
http://stenguns.tripod.com/id13.html
There were some legal semi-auto stens and (as I recall) bare receivers available from CATCO several months ago, but they are sold out. Actually, as I recall, they sold only the receivers and other necessary parts to complete a Sten as semi-auto. The receivers on the CATCO kits would require the usual transfer through an FFL. And it seem like they (the kits with semi-auto receiver) were close to $300, plus you needed you own Sten kit.
I have three sets held back, and am waiting on the http://stenguns.tripod.com/id13.html site to receive BATF blessing before continuing with building them. I am planning on building them as pistols, rather than rifles. Since the Assault weapons ban expired, you could build one as a legal semi-auto pistol using the "commando" styled pistol grip in place of the shoulder stock, and keep the original barrel length that way. This could not be done before because of the Assault Weapons Ban restriction on semi-auto pistols not weighing over 50 oz.
Most of the previosly posted info was starting to point you in the right direction, expect for the issue of needing some sort of paperwork to build one. There is no Federal law that requires the builder of a semi-automatic firearm to have any sort of registration done, or paperwork filled out. You could legally build one using the "80% receiver" and not tell a soul about it, as long as it was built with no intention of selling it.
Oh, and to the "what's the point" question, the answer is, because I can, and it looks even cooler than an M11/9.
MEMBER SINCE 10/24/1999.
To err is human, to moo is bovine.0 -
I thought you did need a permit to manufacture, or is this if you never intend to sell it.
Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people than my gun.0 -
If you never intend to sell it, there is no Federal requirement for paperwork or registration to manufacture. See info on following sites.
http://www.acmearms.com/80percentfaq.php
http://quartz2.cyberstation.net/~dwpaul/bs-home.htm
http://www.tanneryshopinc.homestead.com/
http://www.kristitool.com/
http://www.homegunsmith.com/
MEMBER SINCE 10/24/1999.
To err is human, to moo is bovine.0 -
Now realistically speaking, when was the last time you've heard of a crime being committed with ANY gun built from a kit? (Let alone a full auto gun or something like a Sten gun).
What's the point? Compared to ubiquitous pistols, these guns are hard to conceal, not trivial to build or test, and will double your jailtime if you are caught with a full auto version. Unless you are leading a guerilla army or trying a drive by shooting, I dont see why youd even want one if you were a criminal!
[/quote]
I personally havent heard of a criminal using such a weapon but I was simply stating that there is nothing stopping them or anyone else from making one and there are plenty of people out there who wont bother to research what's legal or not and get the kit for whatever purpose.
Anybody comes through that door, you put two in the chest and one in the head!0 -
boeboe
Good post.
Dean
If they don't trust us with guns, how can we trust them with the government?0 -
quote:
I personally havent heard of a criminal using such a weapon but I was simply stating that there is nothing stopping them or anyone else from making one and there are plenty of people out there who wont bother to research what's legal or not and get the kit for whatever purpose.
Put it this way, the kit alone won't get you to a full auto gun. . .you have to do a lot more to get there, and if so, it isn't an accident! If all you wanted was a full auto gun, its probably just as easy to illegally convert a semi-auto gun.
At this point, I think pretty much everyone knows that constructing a full auto gun in their basement is illegal, to the point where a claim of "Oh, I didnt know that was illegal" is going to provoke uncontrollable laughing by anyone who hears it, especially if the gun gets used in a violent crime!
Looking at this differently, the kits have been around for years. If there actually were criminals using these to make full-auto guns for crimes, the kits would have been specifically banned years ago.
There very well may be people using these kits to build illegal full-auto guns in their basements "just in case". . .but so what? If someone is going to break the law, they are going to break the law. They could also be building them from scratch or converting semi-auto guns too. If the guns never get used (let alone for a crime) what difference does it make?0 -
I'm sure thousands and thousands of these kits have been sold over the years. There have also been several full auto receiver blanks sold for them. To think that there are not hundreds, or even thousands, of illegal full auto Stens out there would be naive. But to my knowledge, none have ever been used in a crime. The closest thing to a crime I have heard of regarding these kist is one guy selling them at a gun show, and giving directions to another table at the show that sold the receiver tube blanks. He was busted for conspiracy to build a full auto gun.
So, why have people bought so many of these sets? Legal uses may include:
1. To use as replacement parts on legally registered full auto firearms.
2. To build a dummy gun.
3. Use them to replace the parts that always wear out on the dummy guns.[8D]
4. Just because they are cool.
5. To have around just in case the day ever comes when you really need a full auto firearm, since they take little more than a muffler pipe and a few hours work to complete.
6. Hold onto one in case it ever becomes legal to build your own.
7. Build a legal semi-auto Sten.
To me, it is very doubtful that most of the thousands sold over the past several years have been used for any of the above purposes. But you never hear of them being used in a crime.
MEMBER SINCE 10/24/1999.
To err is human, to moo is bovine.0
Please sign in to leave a comment.
Comments
11 comments