Explanation of the "Grain" system.
I know this is a dumb question, but when buying ammo does the grain weight on the box refer to the weight of the bullet or the powder charge? And while your at it, if anyone feels like giving a brief explanation of the grain system I would appreciate it.
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It's the weight of the bullet.7000 grains = 1 pound. [:)] 
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Hello when buying ammo the GRAINES reflex the weight of the bullet However in reloading because of the small amounts of powder used in pistol and the need for uniform powder charges used in rifle .IMHO there was a need for very small increments of measure THUS we use grains 7000 = 1 pound I guess if we were metric we would use milligrams.With 38 SPECIAL 2.5 grains of bulls-eye powder is a common load and only 5.0 grains would be an overcharge so we need to be able to weigh small amounts. 0 -
Let me confuse the issue for you just a bit more[}:)][:D]...
When referring to the old Winchester cartridges such as the 44-40, the "-40" refers to the powder charge in grains (of blackpowder that is). So, when you look at an old box of ammo, it will say something like "44-40 W.C.F. 200 grain flat nose" thereby telling you that it has a 200 grain .44 caliber bullet loaded over 40 grains of blackpowder.
Bert H.
Real Men use a SINGLE-SHOT!0 -
quote:Originally posted by Bert H.
Let me confuse the issue for you just a bit more[}:)][:D]...
When referring to the old Winchester cartridges such as the 44-40, the "-40" refers to the powder charge in grains (of blackpowder that is). So, when you look at an old box of ammo, it will say something like "44-40 W.C.F. 200 grain flat nose" thereby telling you that it has a 200 grain .44 caliber bullet loaded over 40 grains of blackpowder.
Bert H.
Real Men use a SINGLE-SHOT!
Then you get to throw in cartridges like .30-06. Then the nomenclature changes again.
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It is not a dumb question; it is a wonderful question, that most new shooters and reloaders are too afraid to ask! There are many measurements for weight. Troy OZ. for gold and silver, there are 14.583 troy OZ per avoirdupois pound. Carat as used in diamonds and other gems is a weight measuring system also.
So your question is not dumb at all. To shooters a 1/10 grain is an important measure of weight. It can make a big difference in loading safety.0 -
As previously stated, 7000 grains equals one pound avoirdupois and/or apothecary. The grain is the same weight in both apothecary and avoirdupois systems but one pound apothecary equals 5760 grains. Avoirdupois uses 16 drams per pound and apothecary uses 8 drams per pound. Troy weight uses the same as apothecary.
Many years ago I was loading Dupont Bulk Powder in shotgun shells. It was loaded by volume the same as black powder. In my pharmacist mindset, I forgot they used 16 drams/ounce and weighed the powder in apothecary weight. Lucky for me the shell would not hold that much powder.
Keep Your Powder Dry
NRA Life Member
The only criminal class that is native to the United States is congress.
MARK TWAIN0 -
When I worked in industry over 30 years ago we rounded the number of grains in an ounce off to an even 440. We used that when weighing chemicals and making formulas. The actual is 437.5 I believe. Generally a one ounce slug is about 440 grains, a 220 grain 30.06 bullet would weigh about 1/2 an ounce, and a 110 grain 30 caliber bullet weighs about 1/4 ounce. Normslly the weight of the powder charge isn't shown on ammo boxes. Often for example, a 30-06 cartridge might be loaded with around 50-55 grains of powder, weighing aproximately 1/8 ounce. When weighing in grains, the scale is marked in grains so there is no confusion. Usually weights are to the nearest .1 (1/10) grain.
"Let him step to the music he hears, however measured or far away." Thoreau0 -
4 grains = 1 carat
24 grains =1 pennyweight
480 grains = 1 troy ounce
5760 grains = 1 troy pound
437.5 grains = 1 ounce avoirdupois
7000 grains = 1 pound avoirdupois
1 grain = 0.0648 grams (0.06479891)
15.432 grains = 1 gram0 -
I am surprised none of the old timers mentioned this. The term "grain" actually came from the weight of one single full grain of wheat. One grain of powder weight is equivalent to the same as one full ripe grain of wheat. This came from one of my reloading books, but I do not recall which one. The grain weight on factory ammo is the actual bullet weight as previuosly stated. I have never seen any factory ammo that listed the charge in grains. Shotgun ammo sometimes lists the charge in "drams".
"They call me Don. Dr. Jason Donald Dalinger."0 -
The history of weights and measures from around the world can be fascinating!
From the files of little known facts:
Grains and drams, ounces and pounds, stones and tons.
The basic unit of weight in the British system is the grain - originally based on the weight of a grain of barley (but note that money was based on the grain of wheat - and that three grains of barley weigh the same as four of wheat). This grain is the troy grain - there is no other weight of the same name.
The weight of one grain is constant throughout the many different systems of British weights. As you will see below, the ounce and pound are anything but contstant, but have altered to meet circumstances over a period of over a thousand years.
The avoirdupois pound is the pound in general use today. As its name implies, it was intended to be used for weighing heavy goods. This pound is of 7000 grains, and is split into 16 ounces (each, therefore of 437.5 grains). Each ounce is divided into 16 drams (which my calculator makes of 27.34375 grains each - much more fun than metric isn't it?).
avoirdupois weights
16 drams = 1 ounce
16 ounces = 1 pound
7 pounds = 1 clove
14 pounds = 1 stone
28 pounds = 1 tod
112 pounds = 1 hundredweight
364 pounds = 1 sack
2240 pounds = 1 ton
2 stones = 1 quarter
4 quarters = 1 hundredweight
20 hundredweight = 1 ton
NB: The sack is not in common use. There was a 'Butchers stone' of 8lb until the end of 1939.
The Troy pound was of 5760 grains, and was divided into 12 ounces, so a troy pound is lighter than an avoirdupois pound, but a troy ounce (at 480 grains) weighs more than an avoirdupois ounce. The troy pound was declared illegal in 1878, but the troy ounce continues in use today for weighing gold. The troy ounce is split into 480 grains, and you will see 1/2 ounce weights marked both '240 grains' and '0.5oz'. However, the apothecaries system also has an ounce weighing 480 grains, being divided into 8 drams (sometimes spelled drachms) of 60 grains, each dram being split into 3 scruples, of 20 grains. To make things more fun, a 2 dram weight would be marked '3ij' - I think that '3' means 'scruples' (there being 3 to the dram), and the 'ij' being an old-fashioned way of quoting the Roman numeral 'ii'. It doesn't end there - there are 20 penny-weights to the troy ounce, so the 1/2 ounce weight mentioned above could also be marked as '3iv' or '10dwt'.
Troy & apothecaries weights
1 ounce = 480 grains
1 ounce = 24 scruples
1 ounce = 20 pennyweights
1 ounce = 8 drams
The wool pound was of 6992 grains, and was (of course) used for weighing wool. The clove, stone and tod mentioned above were also used.
The tower pound was used for weighing coins, and was of 5400 grains. I believe the name tower comes from Tower Hill, the site of the royal mint. This number of grains comes from the traditional weight of an English silver penny of 22? grains (Troy, or grains of barley - the same as 30 grains of wheat), and 240 pennies to the pound. The tower pound was abolished in 1527.
The London pound, or libra mercatoria (trade pound) was 7200 grains (i.e. 15 troy ounces). This died out around the middle of the 14th century. One London stone was of 12? London pounds.0
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