.444 Marlin vs 45/70 Gov't
Hey all,
You may have had a topic on this question once before, but what do people who have shot and used both rounds on game think is the better cartridge? And why do you think this? If this question had been posted before, just guide me to the link. Thanks.
"The man who can hunt with 1 gun is the most dangerous, but that doesn't mean you can't have a lot of guns"
http://www.geocities.com/jonnya0322/
You may have had a topic on this question once before, but what do people who have shot and used both rounds on game think is the better cartridge? And why do you think this? If this question had been posted before, just guide me to the link. Thanks.
"The man who can hunt with 1 gun is the most dangerous, but that doesn't mean you can't have a lot of guns"
http://www.geocities.com/jonnya0322/
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I really like the .444 Marlin cartridge. I used to have one of their lever-actions for that round. It was very effective to the 100-150 yard range. It has a mild recoil too. However, I do think at this time the .45-70 is a better cartridge. The reason I say that is because of the wide power range and bullet selection for it. A .45-70 ammo can be bought that is "watered down" to be about the same power level as the .444. Not only that, but ammo can be bought (or loaded) for the .45-70 that goes clear up to the hard-hitting .450 Marlin round.
I really did love my ol' .444 Marlin (which I no longer have), but if I were to get one for deer hunting, it will definately be the .45-70...
Actually, when I hunt deer with a centerfire rifle (vs. my muzzleloaders), I now use a Ruger .44 mag. For me, I use it in the heavy woods where I'll expect shots under 50 yards and it is absolutely perfect for that. However, when I need a longer range deer rifle I just grab my .300 win mag. While the .45-70 won't shoot as flat as my .300 win mag, it does shoot far enough and flat enough that would have taken every one of my 70+ whitetails I have taken...0 -
The real problem with the .444 has always been lack of bullet selection. Unless something drastically happens in this area, I'm afraid that a very good round is going to gradually die a lingering death. In the right rifle and with proper bullet selection it could be loaded to be a more powerful round than the 45/70. It has thicker case walls which means it could be loaded to high chamber pressures/velocity than the 45/70 case. I saw one .444 in a Siamise mauser bolt action rifle at a range one day that would have been a great rifle if only the bullet selection had been there. The guy was shooting 1 gallon milk jugs with a 265 grain bullet and it was just vaporizing the jugs at 75 yards. The .444 just doesn't get the respect or the support from manufacturers tht it deserves. 0 -
Pinhead the salvation for the .444 may be found in the Barnes bullet selection, this company makes excellent bullets that hang together ( don't fragment) like no one elses. [;)] 0 -
You might be right about Barnes bullets. I haven't seen a .44 rifle bullet listed by them as yet though. 0 -
Jon, I have both .444 and .45-70. I can't really say which is better. I like them both. I have not yet hunted with the .45-70 because I just got it a few months ago, but have killed a few with the .444 and it has awesome killing power for whitetails. This topic was posted qutie a while back and it seemed people were split down the middle. Either die hard .444 or die hard .45-70. I personally like the extra power of the .45-70 and the increased sectional density. I will be hunting exclusively with the .45-70 this upcoming season( I always do this when I buy a new gun, then rotate guns)I would say you would be happy with either one. They both have about the same(close anyway) range and trajectory. I don't know if you reload or not, but the straight wall case is easier to reload than a bottleneck. IMO
"They call me Don. Dr. Jason Donald Dalinger."0 -
My Marlin 444 is a wondergun to me here in PA it will take any and all big game. I do wish there was more selection in ammo and it is not a gun you do much target shooting with. I had a Tasco scope on it but that made the rifle harder to use. The scope is now off and in the trash and the gun is a beaut to use. 0 -
Thanks for all your input guys. I definitely agree that the .444 gets the short end when it comes to bullet selection which is a little disappointing. I would agree with you Don, that the straight case is easier to reload as I have experience with the 45/70, but only in a revolver not a rifle. If the bullet selection was larger than I would definitely go with the .444 Marlin. I think we need to start a major petition to the bullets companies or something. What do you recommend for bullets on larger game with the .444 Don? I do reload so any suggestions are welcome.
"The man who can hunt with 1 gun is the most dangerous, but that doesn't mean you can't have a lot of guns"
http://www.geocities.com/jonnya0322/0 -
Jon, I use the 240 gr. softpoint right now. Some may argue that the 300 gr. is a better choice. After I use the remaining 240 gr. loads I have now, I plan on switching to the 265 gr. Hornady softpoint. I think the 265 gr. bullet would be a good all around bullet for whitetail and the occasional black bear. I really like the Hornady bullets. The 240 gr. has performed flawlessly. A really good load for the 240 gr. is 49 gr. of IMR3031. Here is a picture of a 240 gr softpoint I recovered from a spike (which I skull mounted) and a 200 gr Hornady JHP recovered from a doe my son shot with a Ruger .44 Deerfield carbine. Notice how the Hornady is a perfect mushroom ( the 240 gr. is a Rem. jsp.)The Hornady is the bullet on the left. The 240 gr JSP did a good job on the deer, it just did not hold together as well as the Hornady. It shot all the way through the deer, broke both front shoulders and lodged on the far side just under the hide. I enjoy recovering bullets from deer just to see how they performed. Many times it goes all the way through and the bullet is lost. I get excited when there is no exit hole.[:D][:D] 
"They call me Don. Dr. Jason Donald Dalinger."0 -
quote:I enjoy recovering bullets from deer just to see how they performed. Many times it goes all the way through and the bullet is lost. I get excited when there is no exit hole
Ah yes the autopsy. The final step in bullet selection, load and performance. Long distance shooting and recovering nosler partition is what made a huge fan out of me on that bullet.
What a lot of people don't get, and companies as well, is that if the bullet exit wounds, you have used more energy than is necessary and in fact it goes to waste every foot pound after the exit.
This thread was a good question.
My friend is one... who takes me for what I am.
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"If you do not allow yourself to find a positive way to get through the difficult times, you will become bitter. If you stay bitter, you do not get better." -- Joan Brock0
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