Another custom rifle question /gunsmith help
OK.....What are some of the things to look for when a custom rifle is for sale? Are there some tell tale things to look at?
One thing I noted on the .243 was the stock wood is beautiful but the job on the finish was of medium quality in my book. The blueing was deep and even. The trigger guard is milled and there is not a scratch on the steel anyplace.
What else does a person look for?
Then what do you do to find a value?
One thing I noted on the .243 was the stock wood is beautiful but the job on the finish was of medium quality in my book. The blueing was deep and even. The trigger guard is milled and there is not a scratch on the steel anyplace.
What else does a person look for?
Then what do you do to find a value?
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I believe that your questions were answered the first time you posted.
Neal0 -
Nmeyers,
If this is the post (copied below in blue)to which you refer it asks questions but has no real guidelines for me to learn from, I am trying to learn from the pros. Is there a benifit to having Timney over Canjar triggers? IF the rifle was built by Mr. Douglas himself, that adds value. But does it being made by Fred Flintstone hurt the value? How do I tell the grade of a douglas barrel? I'll get photos of the stock and post them so someone can point out the grade of the wood.
It is an hour drive to the shop it is in. I will try to get all the info I can within the next week or so. All of your input is appreciated, learning from the pros makes life better. I'm building a house now so buying it is out of the question.....FOR NOW...The shop owner said he has had it for a year, so it is not going anywhere fast.
You need to find out who built the rifle, what kind of trigger is on it , has it been glass bedded , has it been piller bedded, what grade of wood is the stock , what kind of wood is the stock made of, what poundage does the trigger break at and what is the length of trigger pull. On the plus side that you know it has a Douglas barrel and Belgium commerical action. These are two very good things on the puls side. I try to use FN Belgium commercial actions on my rifles I build and I only use Douglas Premium barrels. If you do purchase this rifle put a high qualty scope on it. You will have all ready spent a lot of cash on the rifle so a high qualty scope will make it that much better.
Hornet
Thanks for all your help!!!!!!!!!0 -
Tim,
There is a few things to consider when purchasing a someone else's custom rig.
The 243 you speak of is barely custom. It sounds more like someone had a love affair with their 243 at one time.
To point you in the right direction you first have to ask yourself why? Why did someone put their one-time pet rifle on the auction block?
Typically 1 of 4 reasons:
1.) The rifle didn't shoot any better after the upgrade.
2.) The rifle shot worse after the upgrade and the owner got fed-up.
3.) The owner ran into $ woes. (best case scenario for you)
4.) It was a pet project by a newbie 'smith.
With the description of this 243, the action is the only thing that merits any "value". If it is surplus $300.00 should do it.
Pretty wood is okay, but is it what YOU would have picked for the upgrade? Somebody else's wood grows blah over time.
You cannot assign a value on the blue, since most blued rifles are...blued.
So, if some over-eager rifle fancier dumped 300 into an action, 200 into a barrel(w/reamer rental), another 80 bucks into the final finish and 400 into a decent piece of walnut with another 400 wrapped up in shaping the blank, checkering it and spraying it well...it's worth about 300 bucks off the rack.
The value of a "custom" rifle is only in the eyes of the original owner.
See, I have a Win88 pre-64 in 358. I added an $800.00 piece of walnut and another $1,200 to have it custom fitted and finished.
I absolutely love it! But no one would buy it for $4500.00.0 -
Am I to understand that this is perhaps a Mauser action? If so, value will be lower than say a win70 or rem700 action with the exact same components.
first,..wood is wood, nuff said.
second, what is the condition of the throat? is the rifling eroded from high round count or insufficient cooling time?
what type of trigger? Mausers don't need high dollar triggers, they can't shoot up to the potential of a jewell or something in that range.
Is their a scope? what type rings and mounts?
has the firing pin spring been replaced with one a lot stronger which will reduce lock time and aid in accuracy enhancement?
is the smithing work done "true" and "square" or was this some basement gunsmith wannabe project completed on inferior novice grade lathes?
measure some fired brass for neck straightness and body straightness. be sure the neck is in line with the chamber and that the body does not exibit the "banana" traits resulting from an unstraight chamber.
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
quote:Originally posted by bpost1958
Is there a benifit to having Timney over Canjar triggers? IF the rifle was built by Mr. Douglas himself, that adds value. But does it being made by Fred Flintstone hurt the value? How do I tell the grade of a douglas barrel?
FN Mauser receiver, used good thing
Canjar trigger=very good, Timney trigger=good thing, Basix (or other low cost trigger)=no value.
If it was made by a "Top Name" gunsmith, it's a value doubler.
If it was made buy a known quality local smith, no added value
If it was done by "Bubbas gunshop", deduct 50%
The above is for some of the reasons JustC pointed out.
The stock is probably a Biship or Fajian, nothing special there.
Barrel maker and grade can not be determined after the barrel is prepped (the markings are on the breach end, and are cut off when fitting the barrel).
Basicly you have to figgure out what the parts are worth seperatly (receiver, trigger, mounts, , scope, stock (figgure $50-100 for the stock if you love it, $0.00 if you don't) and go from there. Barrel is a unknown, so if you love the caliber and chambering AND the throat is in excelant shape add $100, other wise no value.
It's been sitting for a year, that would raise a yellow flag to me.
There's a 5th reason customs get sold, owner died and widow/son had no use for it and dumped it in the first gunshop that offered them some cash.
If you were purchasing a rifle from someone like JustC or myself, you would be able to shoot the rifle first, and see how it shoots for us also. We would also tell you who the gunsmith was and invite you to contact him, about it, yourself. Although I will disagree with JustC a little on the accuracy potential, but that's only because I like Mausers, and don't like Remmy's [:D] (It's a CRF vs PF thing)
Some guys like a mag full of lead, I still prefer one round to the head.0 -
a little variety makes life more interesting Tailgunner[;)] I am about to undertake a mauser project on a pre-war waffenfabrik orberndorf action in 7x57 soon. just a freshen-up job with a new stock and trigger as well as mounts for glass.[8D] Got me one of them russian scopes with the real german post crosshair that i think would finish a mauser off just right[^]
why chase the game when the bullet can get em from here?....
Got Balistics?0 -
Obviously you recognized that the response from Hornet was great, since you quoted it in your 2nd posting; until you are able to answer the questions he raised, I doubt that we can get any closer to the "real" value of this rifle. 8mmnambu's WAG of $500 sounds realistic to me, based on what we now know. It would be helpful if you told us the asking price; we might be able to give you a quick "Grab it!" or "Forget it!" based on that alone.
If you can borrow a digital camera for your next trip to the gunshop, that would go a long way in helping us evaluate it.
My gut feeling, based on the replacement scope, is that this is a "problem" rifle. If I had a custom rifle that I'm proud of, I'd sell it complete (& with a test target); I'd only strip a gun that didn't perform well.
Neal0 -
Heres some pictures of customs I built or had built
I think Quality always Stands Out, never put a cheap stock on either, A nice pc of wood will set yours apart from the rest
Dan0 -
Thanks everyone!!!
I am going to take notes from all the posts and run down and see what the scoop is on this rifle. I will send you all back a "report on Custom .243 Mauser." We can see if I learned anything...
Will bring my digital camera and snap a few pictures to post too.
I really appreciate all the sound advise and opinions.0 -
take the bolt out and see if it says HS on it. if so it is a high quality custom gun built by Howard Sites. it would probably have a mexican mauser action and a curly maple stock. would be a shorter gun. just a thought.
When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns.3
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