45acp, 185gr+p or 230gr+p, any ruling yet??
I'm the proud owner of a Para P-12 45acp. I carrier it for protective use. Uppon inspection of the Texas Ammo company's +p tactical, very hot bullets, they give me the option of 185gr+p at 1185fps or
230gr+p at 985fps. The JHP I believe is Hornady.
Leaving aside the speech of,"When I was in the war, we used 230gr" or "In the name of science , the ft lbs of 185gr are better".
I just want to know has there been any ruling yet, or experiences of any kind which would conclude what grain bullet, at this high of power, would be the best for a Life or Death situation.
Please, go into detail.
"Sometimes one Shot is the only Shot you have got, so make it count."
230gr+p at 985fps. The JHP I believe is Hornady.
Leaving aside the speech of,"When I was in the war, we used 230gr" or "In the name of science , the ft lbs of 185gr are better".
I just want to know has there been any ruling yet, or experiences of any kind which would conclude what grain bullet, at this high of power, would be the best for a Life or Death situation.
Please, go into detail.
"Sometimes one Shot is the only Shot you have got, so make it count."
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For what its worth, I've always read and heard that the 230Gr Federal Hydra-Shock was the best. I don't know how much, if at all, the +P boost would change that. 0 -
Spaz,
Forget Texas Ammo Company and go with stuff that has been battle tested by LE around the country. If your gun has a full 5 inch barrel, go 230gn Hydrashocks, Golden Sabers, Gold Dots, or Corbon 230gn +P load. If it is a compact model, go with 185gn in the same bullets I already mentioned. I would get a box of each and test them in your gun to see what feeds the best and what shoots the best. Yes it is expensive, but your a55 is worth it I hope.
When I say test the ammo I do not mean go to a local target range and shoot slow fire at 25 yards. Best way would be to draw from holster, fire your double taps at 5 yards or so, shoot the stuff like you would shoot it in a defensive situation. Shooting 230gn ball target loads is different from shooting full power defense loads.0 -
If any of the local PD in your area carry a .45acp find out what they use. If not do a google search on PD using the 45acp and see what they carry. My 2 cents. [8D]
Greg
Former Marine
A N G L I C O0 -
185 will have far less recoil ,and quicker on the second shot
185 non+p velocity is around 950fps
230 non+p velocity is around 720fps
but it takes more punch to move that 230 wich increases the recoil
buy a box of both ,and see what you like ,and see what the gun likes ,they can be fickle ,what ever works for you ,and that particular gun is what you need to carry ,not what another person carries in a different gun,it can take several hundred rounds of each to decide what groups best ,at the same time what you like
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1911 is RIGHT! I carry a Kimber Ultra Carry II, If I shoot the 230's in it, it will JUMP! it's a hand full.... I load-up 185's and I like shooting the gun with that in it, you have a lot more control. Just started to load 200gr HP's with Tite Group. It seems to work but have not got it just right, YET! [:D] Get some 230's and 200's and 185's and give them all a try..... you will find the best one for you and your gun.
It will hurt you, More than it will hurt me..
Life Member..NRA,
American Legion, MECU, MWCA, SMSC, NASDS, IDPA
Thanks for all the help!
IN GOD WE TRUST! *And don't use Pay Pal!0 -
Spaz,
Yes. The works of Marshall and Sanow are one of the most definitive answers on handgun stopping power. Marshall and Sanow were New York police who years ago wanted to know what the most effective handgun/rifle caliber was with the criteria of one-shot stops. One shot stops are defined as either 1. perp dead or 2. perp on the ground not moving. These statistics are therefore all derived from actual shootings involving people and compiled over many years. Their work doesn't include one shoot stops on ballistic gelatin or pigs or some other surrogate animal. Their data is from real-life shootings and shoot-outs which would include all the human variables. Their work is often cited by forensic scientists, ballisticians, gun writers, defense experts, and expert witnesses.
The best performing 45 ACP is as below:
Remington 185 grain Golden Saber
83 shootings
80 one shot stops
96% one shot stops%
12.4-inches penetration (recovered from actual shootings)
The effectiveness of the 45 ACP 185 Golden Saber is tied for the best manstopper with the 357 Magnum with 125 grain JSP bullet for handgun cartridges.
Rifle data is limited but the 308 has produced 98% one shot stops. Suprise,surprise.
So no science for your answer - this is the experience you were asking about.
If you want to look at the data yourself go to this link:
http://www.handloads.com/misc/stoppingpower.asp?Caliber=18&Weight=All
While the Marshall and Sanow work is not complete and does not cover every aspect of shootings, it is likely the best that will be available for a long time.
Regards,
Heavyiron[8D]
"If I don't see you nomore on this world, I'll meet you on the next one, and don't be late!" - Jimi Hendrix0 -
If you want hot (read: NUCLEAR!) go with Cor-Bon 185 gr. +P+. We chronographed 20 of them out of a 5" Spingfield and the average velocity was 1248 FPS. That's 640 FPE. You ain't gonna do any better in the old ACP.
It's easy to spot liberals-they are the ones who have no assets to protect and need every handout they can get. They have forbeyed themselves ascendence to a productive lifestyle.0
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