Help identifying revolver - S&W variant?
I'm trying to identify the make and model of a revolver. Looks very similar to an S&W M&P but is chambered in .45, holds 6 rounds, and has no S&W markings other than on the wood grips (square butt). It has a 4.75" barrel, and "No. 57235" stamped below the grips, and "S 235xx" stamped on the frame. There are a couple of other marks on the frame - an "S" with a strange symbol above it, just behind the trigger guard, and an "o" in a circle linked to another symbol inside a circle (a "w"?) on the top just forward of the hammer. On the cylinder is an "S4" beneath the same strange symbol, and the number 57235 again. Any clues would be appreciated.
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Sounds like the Model of 1917 to me.
SIG pistol armorer/FFL Dealer/Full time Peace Officer, Moderator of General Discussion Board on Gunbroker. Visit www.gunbroker.com the best gun auction site on the Net! Email gpd035@sbcglobal.net0 -
I don't think so. The M1917 was clearly stamped "U.S.Army Model 1917" on the butt, SMITH & WESSON SPRINGFIELD MASS U.S.A on the top of the 5.5" barrel and UNITED STATES PROPERTY on the underside, plain wood grips with no S&W logo, a "GHS" inspector logo on the left side of the frame (until 4/19), or a flaming bomb ordnance logo.
http://www.qsl.net/ka1jbe/m1917.htm0 -
Yes, but....many M1917's were made that were NOT sold to the US. Many were sold to other countries, as well as the civilian market.
However, if it were one of the other M1917's, we would expect to find the S&W escutcheon on the frame, as well as barrel markings. So, MY guess is that it is a European knock-off of the M1917.
Photos are the only way we can do any more than guess.
Neal0 -
Yeah....my guess would be a Spanish knockoff of an S&W, but none of the marks he lists correspond with Spanish proofmarks.....or any other European proofmarks that I know of. 0 -
Thanks for your help! It looks like a Model 1917 - the "flaming bomb" insignia is the strange mark on the top of the frame near the hammer. Still haven't figured out the other mark - it looks like a penguin(!!) - or maybe an angel with her head bowed. Any chance this isn't the original barrel? 0 -
Pictures always help, especially when trying to get information about markings.
From your description it sounds like the Springfield inspection mark.
Not all of these pistols ended up in Govt. service. Also Brazil was licensed to mfg. the revolver by S&W and there are replacement Brazilian contract barrels floating around in the US market.
So what you have could be a "pieces-parts" revolver, or a licensed foriegn made, or a US mfg. that never made the final step into the Govt. armory.
If you can post pictures, do so and this matter should be cleared up quickly. If you have pictues, but don't have the ability to post them use the email icon above this reply to contact me. I'll send you my direct email address so you can send the pix to me as standard email attachments and I will then post them for you.
UPDATE 1/5/05
Last few days have been spent getting pictures and trading questions about the piece. From the following photo's you'll note that this is a 1917 that has been customized into a "snubbie" and that the barrel is approx. 2 3/4 inches long as the original stated length was measured from the back of the frame.
There are some other inconsistencies such as the s/n and the lack of Govt. markings. From info. exchanced so far I think the s/n is 57235 and the "S235xx" number given is a combination of inspectors mark and assembly number taken from the yoke cutout. As for the grips, using the number stamped on the inside they are from 1972-74. Lastly there is the barrel profile and the apparent lack of a flat or a barrel shoulder transition at the join between barrel and frame. There are no markings at all on the barrel, and this could be due to reprofiling when shortening and eliminating the extractor rod latch, or the fitting of a new barrel from a "blank". The tip on the extractor rod is correct, but the barrel sits above it rather than having a milled cutout for the tip.
During the 50's and 60's a number of these revolvers were converted to short barreled carry pieces, but this one appears a little different from the ones I've seen. Maybe someone will recognize the style of work and tie it to a specific shop/smith. Anyway, here's the pix:
If you only have time to do two things so-so, or one thing well ... do the one thing!0 -
Congratulations! Looks like you've solved the mystery, Contender Man.
Seems I remember seeing similar large-frame .45 snubbies being sold mail-order from ads in the American Rifleman in the late '50's and early '60's......though, as I recall, these were cutdown (or rebarreled) former New York State Police Colt New Service .45s.0
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