.22 vs .25 auto
I was wandering what is the difference or is one better out of the 22 and 25 as far as reliability and power. I know the price difference and availability. I don't want to start a argument about them being underpowered, just a comparison. Is the rimfire or center fire more reliable? What about recoi
l, I know it would have a lot to do with the gun its fired from, but if its fired from a similar pistol. Like the small frame Taurus (pt22 and pt25 I think)
Now that I'm thinking about it what is the difference b/w the 9mm and 38spl. I know that the 9mm is close to the same size as the 38 short but the 9mm was made with modern smokeless powder.
I guess these questions have been asked before and I apologue for the repeats.
l, I know it would have a lot to do with the gun its fired from, but if its fired from a similar pistol. Like the small frame Taurus (pt22 and pt25 I think)
Now that I'm thinking about it what is the difference b/w the 9mm and 38spl. I know that the 9mm is close to the same size as the 38 short but the 9mm was made with modern smokeless powder.
I guess these questions have been asked before and I apologue for the repeats.
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In the case of price the .22 wins hands down. For stopping power it is a toss up for standard loads, but with the higher power loadings offered in .22LR the rimfire comes out on top. For reliability the rimless .25 has the clear edge since it was specifically developed for use in tiny pocket automatics while the rimmed .22 was a "make do". If you are crazy enough to risk your life on either of these cartridges for self defense then take the .25 because it will feed and function more reliability than the .22. If you are just looking for a plinker or tackle box gun then buy the .22 and save a bundle on ammo. 0 -
for a HIDE-AWAY pistol it is a toss-up but a full size gun the 22 semi auto with either a 4 inch or longer barrel ishard to beat for plinker or target shooting From the Pre WWW II sports model WOODSMAN to the short barrel Ruger or short barrel High Standard [^][:p] 0 -
.25 acp has killed plenty of people but it has just injured and pissed off more--it does not have the velocity or energy that a .22 Long rifle bullet has. As far as reliability the majority of .25's aren't offered in what I would consider reliable(Ravens, Jennings, Bryco)--the ONLY .25's that I would consider carrying would be either the Colt 1908, Colt Junior, the Baby Browning & Bauer and the Beretta 21A & 950---any other .25 and it's your rear end[;)] Same thing goes for .22 mouseguns--better than nothing but you better make your shot really count. Recoil isn't even a factor between these two rounds--it's minimal.
The Taurus you mention is similar to the Beretta though it is double action only.
The main difference between the 9mm and .38 special is .356 vs .357 bullet diameter. The modern 9mm is a little more powerful than the .38 but with quality defense loads the bad guy would probably never know the difference. Obviously the 9mm can hold more cartridges. I'm not sure which .38 Short you are referring to--the .38 Short Colt or the .38 S&W--if you meant the .38 Short Colt that was never used by the military-the .38 Long was with disasterous results in the Philippines which had the .45 Colt round in SAA's and 1902 DA's(the .45 version with the large trigger also known as the Alaskan or Phillipine model) being put into service.
The .38 S&W was used by the military in the Victory model revolver.0 -
My sister-in-law was wanting a carry but after considering many things I don't think any think anything other than 22 or 25 will be good for her. If I was being shot at, I wouldn't ask what are you shooting. and anything bigger and she wont practice. There are more reasons that went into the decision. So what I gather there are no difference in the except cost (not a problem) and the 25 is a little more reliable in feeding. The reason I mention the Taurus is because of them being close to the same. I think if she is going to carry it may be a revolver. I know there are many 22 revolvers, but are there any that shot 25's.
How is the recoil and bang (sound) of a 327 shooting a 32s&w compared to the 22. I consider this because it could grow with her if she got more comfortable with shooting.0 -
I would pick the 22 every time over the 25.
However; why not just get a 9mm or 380?
quote:Originally posted by Briansims8
My sister-in-law was wanting a carry but after considering many things I don't think any think anything other than 22 or 25 will be good for her. If I was being shot at, I wouldn't ask what are you shooting. and anything bigger and she wont practice. There are more reasons that went into the decision. So what I gather there are no difference in the except cost (not a problem) and the 25 is a little more reliable in feeding. The reason I mention the Taurus is because of them being close to the same. I think if she is going to carry it may be a revolver. I know there are many 22 revolvers, but are there any that shot 25's.
How is the recoil and bang (sound) of a 327 shooting a 32s&w compared to the 22. I consider this because it could grow with her if she got more comfortable with shooting.0 -
CWI555 most of the time I have a 9mm or 38 and this winter I will most likely carry a taurus judge or my 1911. I feel that for her a 22 or 25 or maybe a 32 would be better. It would be harder for her to make a follow up shot from any thing bigger. I think the recoil, flash, sound of a 9mm in a enclosed area may be just to much for her, almost like a flash bang. I though about a 380 but while at the range a man was shooting a LCP so I took out my plugs and it was almost as loud as a 9mm. I know that the 22/25 is under powder and will just piss them off, but they will be pissed off running in another direction. I could not imagine some one getting shot with a 22 and saying "is that all you got". Any one who thinks other wise I would love to see them try it. The reason I think a 327 using a 32s&w would be good is that she could move up, same goes for a 22/22 mag. 0 -
The .25 is more powerful from a 2" barrel than almost all .22s. The velocity readings that most people refer to are from rifle-length barrels. Even published handgun velocities are from 4-6" barrels.
.25 feeds/fires more reliably.
Shooting people seldom just "pisses them off." If .22s and .25s didn't work, they wouldn't have been around for over 100 years. Bigger calibers are better.0 -
Brian please don't take offense at this but if your sister in law is unwilling to actually put some time and effort into training with whatever gun she gets, she could be in for a rude awakening when it comes time to use it. In a real life shooting she most likely wouldn't even be bothered by the noise or recoil-and at the range she should have hearing protection anyway.
Hope you aren't considering having her pack a .327 loaded with .32 S&W(the short one)--at the minimum go with .32 Longs which are not much better.
You may also consider taking her to a range that rents different handguns and let her shoot some different ones--you may be suprised what she can and cannot do. Most women can handle the .38 special unless they are feeble-WITH TRAINING--just buying a gun and having her put it in the drawer will get her nothing but trouble.
Many felons are shot with 9mm and larger and don't give up and have ended up killing their intended victim, so why do you think one that is shot with a .22 will just run away?0 -
22lr 0 -
I would recomend a double stack .380 Like the CZ83 or Beretta 84, Taurus PT58, the latter has 19 round mags.. If recoil is a concern, a 7 year old can shoot a pt58 with a full clip comfortably. If that will absolutely not do for some odd reason then go with a keltec .32, And if that wont do a small .22lr or 22magnum revolver.
I have shot a 25acp alot and in my opinion it is a useless round that shouldnt even be chambered in modern weapons.. I have personally seen FMJ loads bounce off of cardboard. If i had to choose between a .25ACP or a sharp stick, I'd have to think about the choice.0 -
You said you didn't want to hear it, but in my opinion neither .22LR nor .25ACP are satisfactory for self defense.
Both cartridges are obsolete as pocket pistols nowadays, given the ready availability of super small super light .380 guns like the Kel-Tec 3AT and its clone the Ruger LCP. These little guns really aren't any bigger or heavier than typical .22 or .25 automatics, but are significantly more powerful.
In terms of shooting someone with a .22 and "just pissing them off", put it this way. Many assailants are drunk or high on drugs. They may literally NOT EVEN KNOW they've been hit by a .22 or .25 until far later, and that phenomenon is actually fairly common. While I have seen people killed with .22s from a pistol, I've also seen cases of people shot with them in the torso where the bullet didn't even penetrate their chest wall, being partially slowed down by winter clothing.
My take on this is that if you're going to take all the LIABILITY of carrying a deadly weapon (eg a gun), then you really owe it to yourself to carry one that is actually deadly! Bottom line for me is that .22 and .25 are guns to carry only if that's all you have and you can't get anything else.
Now, to actually answer the question on ballistics, from a RIFLE the .22LR is the clear winner.
From a short barrelled pistol, the two cartridges are nearly identical ballistically. One or the other may be a little more powerful depending on the exact load and especially the barrel length, but these are minimal differences between what are otherwise really weak loads.
Which would I pick? Again, I wouldn't choose either one, but if you forced me to pick one, I'd pick the .22LR.
Ammo is FAR cheaper, and more readily available in a wide variety of configurations. You can pretty much buy .22LR anywhere that sells ammo, but that is NOT true of .25ACP.
.25ACP ammo is surprisingly expensive, costing about $28 per 50 rounds. . ..22LR ammo costs about $30 per **500* rounds.
Only possible advantage of the .25 is increased reliability from small pistols, but I think in practice there are SOME small .22s that are reliable, while there are .25s that are not. If you are going to carry one of these, you have to make sure the particular gun you've got is reliable.
On 9mm vs. .38 special, there are multiple differences. Summarizing briefly, 9mm is a rimless cartridge designed for semiautomatic pistols. .38 special is a rimmed cartridge designed for revolvers.
While both shoot similar diameter and weight bullets of .357 of an inch wide, and approximately 125 grains in weight, in general the 9mm fires these bullets significantly faster, and is a good bit more powerful.0 -
"I have shot a 25acp alot and in my opinion it is a useless round that shouldnt even be chambered in modern weapons.. I have personally seen FMJ loads bounce off of cardboard. If i had to choose between a .25ACP or a sharp stick, I'd have to think about the choice."
Statements like this are very wrong and extremely irresponsible.
The .25 doesn't bounce off cardboard. It is capable of over 12" penetration in ballistic gelatin.0 -
I agree with Bill DeShivs, and I totally disagree with anyone who says a .25 ACP is useless. The first rule in a gunfight is to have a gun.
Brian, the .25 auto would be my choice over the .22, based on penetration and reliability.0 -
Size is irrelevant. My wife is 5'4" and 115 soaking wet. She shoots everything from .22 to .44 magnum. She has some difficulty with the Winchester 1300 folder I have, but she'll still get a couple off with it. As for the flash bang effect, No one is immune to it. Most firearms which are discharged indoors are going to make your ears ring.
As for flash, that to can be handled to a degree, but I think it has to be taken in context. If you know it's coming, it's a lot easier to prevent a 'freeze'.
quote:Originally posted by Briansims8
CWI555 most of the time I have a 9mm or 38 and this winter I will most likely carry a taurus judge or my 1911. I feel that for her a 22 or 25 or maybe a 32 would be better. It would be harder for her to make a follow up shot from any thing bigger. I think the recoil, flash, sound of a 9mm in a enclosed area may be just to much for her, almost like a flash bang. I though about a 380 but while at the range a man was shooting a LCP so I took out my plugs and it was almost as loud as a 9mm. I know that the 22/25 is under powder and will just piss them off, but they will be pissed off running in another direction. I could not imagine some one getting shot with a 22 and saying "is that all you got". Any one who thinks other wise I would love to see them try it. The reason I think a 327 using a 32s&w would be good is that she could move up, same goes for a 22/22 mag.0 -
I agree, the 25 is worthless. If I got myself caught between throwing a 25 at an assailant, or shooting them with it, it would be a toss up which might be more effective.
quote:Originally posted by Bill DeShivs
"I have shot a 25acp alot and in my opinion it is a useless round that shouldnt even be chambered in modern weapons.. I have personally seen FMJ loads bounce off of cardboard. If i had to choose between a .25ACP or a sharp stick, I'd have to think about the choice."
Statements like this are very wrong and extremely irresponsible.
The .25 doesn't bounce off cardboard. It is capable of over 12" penetration in ballistic gelatin.0 -
My wife has small hands and we have tried everything for her . She ended up with a Beretta 25, functions perfectly, and it will go through a phone book plus some..Its what she can handle, although not the ideal caliber, we are both confident in its use...So each their own in what they can use..imo..nambu 0 -
DeShivs, are you telling me That I did not experience over and over again the .25acps failure to penetrate a paper oil can from 10 feet? It happened. Based on that experience, I am not going to use an ammo companies sells pitch of ideal penetration to push a round that is a liability to its users.
I know one thing, i am not irresponsable enough to tell this man that a person is safe with a .25acp.. If it is all a person can afford fine, If they can get something better they should if they intend to use it.[:)]
In an instance where a person is small, a person who needs a gun because they can not fight, it is illogical for said person to have a small round, one of the most unlikely rounds to incapacitate the threat in this case.. Do you follow the logic?0
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